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puzzleannie
Guest
now will you please explain that to the average 9th grader in my Confirmation class?
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Curious_Seed
Guest
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Ranklyfrank
Guest
Your situation is moot, even though arguable. I was asking Exodus.
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The_Exodus
Guest
I wonder as well!
But I think I know the steps that have to come next. One has to make sort of infinite movements and go where one does not know. The whole idea of “following Jesus” may indeed be correct objectively speaking, but what must occur from the subject’s perspective cannot involve some convinced “ah, I must do such and such.” If the mind is completely sure, completely confident, the infinite steps cannot be made. The movement must be, fundamentally, a movement into the unknown, else it is not such a movement as I’m talking about.
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The_Exodus
Guest
I wasn’t scoffing.As far as I am concerned, it wasn’t ‘an act of revealing divine truth’ which can be considered revelation when you said, “I don’t know a damn thing” which implied that it was merely a ‘an enlightening or astonishing disclosure’ since your epiphany was not founded on divine truth. I’ve found out more about you then you know about Jesus. Let’s remember that epiphany and revelation do have many different meanings.And may I remind you it isn’t polite to scoff at people who have contributed to your topic.
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Ranklyfrank
Guest
That sounds very sane to me. And your reasons are why I said that sitting at the cusp of paradox, where attention lives without identifying anything as “mine,” is so crucial. It looks and sounds to me like you have set foot on a remarkable adventure. Q’plah!
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fhansen
Guest
Yes, but how did you know?
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Ranklyfrank
Guest
The discovery of “not knowing” in this way is a landmark step in awareness. It is the discovery that "I am not contents; I am the ineffable THAT which perceives content but feels free of associating with it as “self.” The knowing shifts from and transcends knowing by identifying with contents to knowing awareness as a reflexive act. When you think you know, you think you know. But when you know, you know you know. Not knowing as Exodus describes is that latter kind of knowing and sees that knowledge of objects is empty, while knowing self awareness is all there is. Then the world is your playground. You are in it, but not of it. In other words, the path of freeing oneself from progressively larger misidentifications of limits has finally reached the threshold of the perception of “I” as immaterial, and all that that implies in further movement in the invisible.
The movement of spiritual discovery is always away from ego. At first the ego cannot differentiate itself from sensation and perception. Then it identifies with the body, then the family, then the group, then ideas, and then with the awareness itself that allowed all of what came before. And each successive level has a fulcrum and both transcends and incorporates what came before. It is, imo, like Exodus had a kind of birthday. I’m happy for that.
The movement of spiritual discovery is always away from ego. At first the ego cannot differentiate itself from sensation and perception. Then it identifies with the body, then the family, then the group, then ideas, and then with the awareness itself that allowed all of what came before. And each successive level has a fulcrum and both transcends and incorporates what came before. It is, imo, like Exodus had a kind of birthday. I’m happy for that.
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MindOverMatter2
Guest
Awareness presupposes knowledge.
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Ranklyfrank
Guest
Of course it does, Mom. How much do you know when you’re unconscious? Awareness is the vessel of ideas and thoughts, even “I think I’m Mom2.”
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MindOverMatter2
Guest
Therefore “not-knowing” is not the landmark of awareness.
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crazzeto
Guest
Probably one of the most distressing days of my life, was the day I realized that I couldn’t possibly read enough, or study enough to really fully understand the faith left by Christ. I know it’s stupid to distress about something like this, but my mind has this bizzar tendancy to want to fully undestand stuff.
So now I just cling to the truths of the Church and more or less go with it. I figure that’s enough for me.
So now I just cling to the truths of the Church and more or less go with it. I figure that’s enough for me.
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Betterave
Guest
You don’t know a damn thing, but you think you do know the steps that have to come next…?
What do you think those steps are?
Here are two possibilities (or statements, at least):
A: “If the mind is completely sure, completely confident, the infinite steps cannot be made. The movement must be, fundamentally, a movement into the unknown, else it is not such a movement as I’m talking about.”
B: “If the mind is not completely sure, completely confident, the infinite steps cannot be made. The movement must be, fundamentally, a movement into the unknown, else it is not such a movement as I’m talking about.”
Is either true? Only one? Both?
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Ranklyfrank
Guest
Very correct. Knowing you don’t know is.
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The_Exodus
Guest
A is true.
I know I have to go where I am unsure. I am sure about the method of the action, though not the specific action itself. It’s sort of like anything, really, when speculative knowledge meets the road of practical life.
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Betterave
Guest
Are you sure?
Then presumably you don’t have to go anywhere…?
What is it about the method of action that you are so sure about?
If that’s all you mean, I guess most of us have had this epiphany… but it wouldn’t lead most of us to say “I don’t know a damn thing.”
On second thoughts, I really have no idea what you mean. Do you?
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