I just talked to a ''religious''catholic,seen how dire the situation in europe is nowadays

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willymonfrete

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Im from the Netherlands but I grew up half my life in the states because my mother is american,anyway the difference between catholicism here and there is like night and day,I got to talking at a shisha lounge with a guy who says hes a religious catholic,but when we started talking about homosexuality things went south.I said to him :we should have Agape for homosexuals,but homosexuality is a mortal sin,and though its a mortal sin,it isn’‘t worse than masturbation or fornication’'he got really angry at this and said if I had a kid that was gay wouldn’t you support him?I said I would love him/her but I’d warn them its a sin that destroys your relationship with God and sends you to hell if you die without repentance.he started calling me Brainwashed.
we got to talking about finding a catholic spouse in this country,I said I don’t Think I will ever find a Catholic spouse in this country because all the people at mass are senior citizens,already married or children.and that the few unicorn catholic women my age do not actively seek husbands anyway,its not like you can just go up to them after mass and ask them on a date.he told me it shouldn’t matter and that I should just find a atheist woman and fornicate with her.I told him I do not believe in fornication and that I could easily take a trip to say poland to find a catholic wife but the problem is most fornicate before marriage and thats simpely off the cards for me.he said I was misconstruing Jesus words and that fornication isn’t wrong.I told him with all respect and charity to you,but this is why I am in despair of ever finding a catholic wife in the netherlands,the few hard to find catholics here think like you and are cafeteria catholics(I didn’t say it in those exact words but thats the gist of what I said,remember the convo is in dutch)and I want a religious partner who atleast believes the bible,all of it,is the word of the Holy Spirit,doesnt use contraception and respects the sanctity of marriage.he upon that point almost got violent and said I belong in a mental hospital.he said the ‘‘bible has many contradictions stop reading everything it says and taking it so seriousely’’.
he got really angry and told me a story of how he shot someone in the head when he was a cop and he is not sorry for it.I said you should repent for it.he then yelled at me and said I dont need to repent anything and God approves of what I did because the guy was a klootzak(means something really foul in dutch).
he start saying other things in the convo about how people that go to church all the time are hypocrites and do this and that and he said 80% of popes had many women and were bad people.I said we certainely have had bad popes in the past but we also had many reconized saints among them.and he said no the church has always been corrupt etc
if this is the face of a religious catholic in this country I seriousely do not want to live here or raise morally upright catholic children here,I only stay because of the good social safety net and infrastructure.
Keep in mind I’m no Traditionalist but accepting 100% of what the church dogmatically defines is considered lunacy here,even among people who call themselves christians!
I told him that I wasn’t always religious and had dated a Jewish woman and a muslim woman and fornicated with them,upon that he said then its oke for me to keep doing it why change?I said back then I was a atheist/agnostic but now I made the choice to follow Christ 100%.I said I do not claim to be a holy person ,he told me I should go to a mental hospital or lock myself up in a monastery,I said I could never be a monk as I know I need sex or I will fall into sin,he said I will never find happiness as long as I keep reading the bible ‘‘so literally’’.
 
You can’t base you entire opinion on European Catholicism on one conversation in a Shisha lounge…
 
You did a good deed by telling that guy the truth.
God will bless you for that.
When looking for a godly wife, keep your spiritual eyes open with prayer and chaste living and God will show you who he has picked out for you.
 
How long have you been in Europe? And when is the last time you tried to have that conversation in the States.

I live in Canada and I can’t help but think if you moved back to the States, you would be having that exact conversation. Things on this side of the ocean are the same. Sometimes we look back at how things were when we grew up and assume our home town did not change, but guess what, home towns changed with the times even when it means bad change. Also, I can help but think that since you admitted to not being fully commited to Christ previously, you never noticed how things are in the states because you never tried to practice your religion in the USA.

Jesus NEVER said it would be easy to follow him. Also, I would not have such discussions. What give the time of day to someone who is so insulting as to say you should be locked up. Next time you see him, give a polite greeting and leave

Angie
 
@Willie:

I dont have personal experience with religion in the Netherlands, but based on your 2nd hand account of the conversation, the man you spoke to appears to be emotionally immature and disrespectful. I would just focus on making objectively good decisions in your life, spiritually, professionally, and with volunteering. If you don’t think the Netherlands is the best place to live that will be a decision you’ll have to make, but just don’t base any decisions on one anecdotal.

100% loyalty to the Magisterium is very uncommon in the United States. Perhaps not to the same degree in other places, but it’s something all of us have to come to terms with. We need to learn how to not be afraid.
 
the few unicorn catholic women my age do not actively seek husbands anyway,its not like you can just go up to them after mass and ask them on a date.
Have you tried reaching out to them? If only in friendship first?

If they’re unicorn women, they probably consider you a unicorn man. If good practising Catholics are hard to find, they’re probably having the same problem.
 
In my own experience of the UK it’s a lot more laid back than the culture of these forums. You don’t really get Catholic communities like you did when my grandparents were young and there aren’t a lot of young adults at a lot of parishes, young Catholics come of age with non-Catholic peers and are naturally influenced by their culture and views.
 
In finding a good wife, ask St. Joseph.

I’m not kidding, really I made a novena and he found my husband for me.

Things as far as Catholicism go, are bad all over. Even at my parish, I hear similar things that you described. Oh, maybe not that bad, but people condone their kids living with partners and being ‘cafeteria’ is pretty common here.

There is no utopia. In fact I’d be a little afraid to live there.
As a Catholic, I’m going to be judged for my own behavior and faithfulness, no matter what is swirling around me.

You were born at this time for this time. No matter where you find yourself, live the Faith!
 
His understanding of religion is deeply flawed, but you really need to consider the guy’s mental state. He was probably a little intoxicated, and he told you about something that was doubtless deeply traumatic for him: he killed someone when he was a police officer. He probably still feels conflicted about it and wonders if he did the right thing. You were dealing with someone who was pretty emotionally raw.
 
Netherlands has its own view on democracy and considers it superior to the American model. Not only political and religious refugees but also all kinds of sexual minorities apply for refuge in this country.
I have traveled and stayed a while in the Netherlands many years ago, it is very contrasting country.
For example, you can not say that Amsterdam and Groningen are the cities with the same spiritual mentality/atmosphere.
In the Netherlands there are very conservative regions.
Amsterdam is like a country in the country.
There are regions where you can see other Netherlands very traditional and God-fearing in relation to sin.
I had to read the Dutch catechism of the Catholic Church and it was completely identical with the teaching of the church.
I’ve even heard about radicals from militant Catholics, though I do not know if there are many of them there.
 
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