I might have misunderstood Purgatory

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hansard

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Hi, everyone.
I was under the impression that Purgatory worked like this:

If you have unconfessed venial sins at the time of death, you face “temporal punishment” in Purgatory.
If you have unconfessed mortal sins at the time of death, you go to Hell.

I’ve read that a confession prior to death will get one to Heaven.

Yet, I’ve also read that the temporal punishment of Purgatory applies to all sins, whether confessed or not, because they still have to be cleansed from the soul.

What is the no-nonsense, simple truth of the matter? Please explain it to me as simply as you can. Oh, and the Catechism is no help, really; I just looked there. Please don’t refer me to the Catechism.
 
Confessed or not, all sins accrue temporal punishment. It’s just that Confession makes up for a part of it. So if you die in a state of grace with unforgiven sins, you’ll just be punished more for them than you would if you repented and/or took them to the Confessional and/or did penance.
 
When you commit a sin after baptism, there is a temporal punishment you must pay either on earth or in purgatory.

An example: A lapsed Catholic murders a man. His temporal punishment is life in prison. He confesses the sin (with true repentance) and is absolved. He still must pay the temporal punishment either in prison for life or in purgatory.

An indulgence pays for our temporal punishments that we earn from sin that we commit. When we die, if we have not paid for all of our temporal punishments, we will pay for them in purgatory.

A partial indulgence remits part of our temporal punishment. A plenary indulgence remits all of our temporal punishment we have earned up to that point.

Note: Baptism remits all sins and temporal punishment. Confession remits only sins.
 
So: penance, indulgences, prayer and other forms of atonement all count as “good works”, right? These good works pay some of the temporal penalty, but presumably not all?

Could you have your entire time in purgatory remitted by penance alone–a life of prayer, for example?

And further: people who are declared as saints must have, in effect, been granted a complete indulgence under the “power to bind and loose”. In canonizing someone, the Pope virtually declares them to be in Heaven, without really knowing the state of their soul. He uses his authority.
Is that a fair explanation?
 
Just because a saint has been canonized it doesn’t mean that before their canonization they never experienced purgatory. For example, St Thomas More was canonized hundreds of years after his death. It is possible that he spent some time in purgatory.

A partial indulgence remits part of our temporal punishment. A plenary indulgence remits all of our temporal punishment we have earned up to that point.
 
Zekariya said:
Just because a saint has been canonized it doesn’t mean that before their canonization they never experienced purgatory.
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Exactly what I thought. The canonization effectively removes them from purgatory (if they are there); or they might have experienced purgatory, and probably did, for an unknown period of time before going to Heaven. In the latter case, the canonization kind of affirms their place in Heaven.
 
hansard said:
Exactly what I thought. The canonization effectively removes them from purgatory (if they are there); or they might have experienced purgatory, and probably did, for an unknown period of time before going to Heaven. In the latter case, the canonization kind of affirms their place in Heaven.
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Canonization doesn’t remove someone from purgatory. Canonization confirms infallibly that they are in heaven as witnessed by the miracles of the saint being canonized.
 
I thought that purgatory was basically a purification before entering heaven ? If your in purgatory your already slated for heaven your just being purified or I guess doing penance So that you don’t have all the “baggage” that you picked up while amongst the living.
 
hansard said:
Exactly what I thought. The canonization effectively removes them from purgatory (if they are there); or they might have experienced purgatory, and probably did, for an unknown period of time before going to Heaven. In the latter case, the canonization kind of affirms their place in Heaven.
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Canonization doesn’t really change anything from the standpoint of purgatory. A saint that went through purgation in purgatory does not have the temporal punishment remitted by canonization. The purgation would happen first and only after their temporal punishment was complete would they enter heaven and the Church have the opportunity to canonize them. Basically it’s not possible to canonize a saint while they are in purgatory since a saint is in heaven by definition.
 
This is very informative. I just wanted to say thank you for sharing as I have pondered this.
 
I just wanted to add a little to what others have said:

There are three parts to repentence: contrition, confession, and satisfaction. The third part, satisfaction, is what is made up in purgatory if we don’t make it in this life. Satisfaction is essentially bringing forth fruits worthy of repentance as Scripture commands us to do (see for example, Matt. 3:8, Luke 3:8, Acts 26:20). This is how the Church explained it at the Council of Florence:

“Also, if truly penitent people die in the love of God before they have made satisfaction for acts and omissions by worthy fruits of repentance, their souls are cleansed after death by cleansing pains; and the suffrages of the living faithful avail them in giving relief from such pains, that is, sacrifices of masses, prayers, almsgiving and other acts of devotion which have been customarily performed by some of the faithful for others of the faithful in accordance with the church’s ordinances.”
ewtn.com/library/councils/florence.htm
 
hansard said:
Hi, everyone.
I was under the impression that Purgatory worked like this:

If you have unconfessed venial sins at the time of death, you face “temporal punishment” in Purgatory.
If you have unconfessed mortal sins at the time of death, you go to Hell.

I’ve read that a confession prior to death will get one to Heaven.

Yet, I’ve also read that the temporal punishment of Purgatory applies to all sins, whether confessed or not, because they still have to be cleansed from the soul.

What is the no-nonsense, simple truth of the matter? Please explain it to me as simply as you can. Oh, and the Catechism is no help, really; I just looked there. Please don’t refer me to the Catechism.
Click to expand...
Purgatory= bye bye vicissitudes of life, despair, so long depression and anxiety, farewell to the possiblity of being lost forever, a heart-felt arm of honour to all the infernal legions who tried to drag you to Hell with them, an assurance that you’ll be with God (and people you love) soon, that you’re getting closer day by day, and that no one will or could get you off course. What’s not to be liked about Purgatory? While not the equivalent of a cruise in the Caribbean*, it doesn’t look bad to me. You don’t say it, but just in case you worry about Purgatory. Forget about the tales of horror, forget about the “poor” souls, we are the poor souls (along with the souls of the damned).

*With a reputable cruise line!
 
Zekariya said:
Just because a saint has been canonized it doesn’t mean that before their canonization they never experienced purgatory. For example, St Thomas More was canonized hundreds of years after his death. It is possible that he spent some time in purgatory.

A partial indulgence remits part of our temporal punishment. A plenary indulgence remits all of our temporal punishment we have earned up to that point.
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It was my (average-sinnerly) understanding that Martyrdom cancels all Purgatory?

Even if it didn’t, certainly the sheer horror of losing your head should accrue at least partial credit???:eek:

ICXC NIKA
 
There are two kinds of punishments merited by sin: temporal punishment and eternal punishment.

The latter corresponds to “guilt,” which is forgiven in confession. The former corresponds to “debt,” which persists even after forgiveness/absolution.

Think of it this way: if I break my neighbor’s window playing catch with my son, I am guilty of something. If I apologize for it and he forgives me, that erases my guilt. But, problematically, his window is still broken, and I owe him for that. The debt is erased by my replacing his window (unless he chooses to forgive me the debt, as well).

All sins merit temporal punishment. Much of this can be discharged on earth through prayer and humble offering-up of our sufferings and works to God. A good practice is to begin each day by consecrating it to God and offering Him everything in your day that is pleasing to Him. Physical aches and pains, illness, annoyances, difficulties at work, etc., are all means of discharging that debt.

Whatever isn’t discharged at death is worked off in Purgatory.

Indulgences are one means of working off this debt. Partial indulgences pay part of it (we don’t know how much), plenary indulgences pay all of it.
 
GEddie said:
It was my (average-sinnerly) understanding that Martyrdom cancels all Purgatory?

Even if it didn’t, certainly the sheer horror of losing your head should accrue at least partial credit???:eek:

ICXC NIKA
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“By a plenary indulgence is meant the remission of the entire temporal punishment due to sin so that no further expiation is required in Purgatory. A partial indulgence commutes only a certain portion of the penalty; and this portion is determined in accordance with the penitential discipline of the early Church.”

Source: newadvent.org/cathen/07783a.htm

Martyrdom (Baptism of Blood) does cancel purgatory. Martyrs also get lots of benefits including the crown of martyrdom.
 
sw85 said:
A good practice is to begin each day by consecrating it to God and offering Him everything in your day that is pleasing to Him. Physical aches and pains, illness, annoyances, difficulties at work, etc., are all means of discharging that debt…
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How, exactly, would one do this? I try, but I find that I am not particularly good at praying. >_> What is the mechanic through which this accomplished?
 
Robertanthony said:
Purgatory= bye bye vicissitudes of life, despair, so long depression and anxiety, farewell to the possiblity of being lost forever, a heart-felt arm of honour to all the infernal legions who tried to drag you to Hell with them, an assurance that you’ll be with God (and people you love) soon, that you’re getting closer day by day, and that no one will or could get you off course. What’s not to be liked about Purgatory? While not the equivalent of a cruise in the Caribbean*, it doesn’t look bad to me. You don’t say it, but just in case you worry about Purgatory. Forget about the tales of horror, forget about the “poor” souls, we are the poor souls (along with the souls of the damned).

*With a reputable cruise line!
Click to expand...
This is one way of looking at things, but you don’t seem to quite understand how… painful Purgatory will be. My parish priest explained it in a sermon, when we was talking about how we waste time with activities in our life which we are gaining neither temporal nor spiritual merit. Then he said that Purgatory is the GREATEST WASTE of time any person can possibly make.

Here on earth, we are able to remit our temporal punishment MUCH easier than we can in Purgatory. In Purgatory we are simply suspended there, suffering horribly in our sorrow for our sins with nothing to do to remit them but WAIT for the necessary graces to come from those on earth offering prayers for us. On earth, our senses are darkened by the fall, making it so that we perceive time quicker than it really travels. In Purgatory, not so. Time will appear MUCH slower as we suffer through our sins.

I have decided that Purgatory isn’t my safety net to catch me when I die. It is my TENTH safety net, if I fail in all other things. It is a dangerous path on earth to sin figuring “Oh, it’s not mortal, Purgatory will take care of that for me,” because Purgatory is truly much harder than just finding remission of sins here on earth.
 
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