I need advice to stop masturbating

[Ormond]

Ormond: This topic is in particular a Catholic seeking guidance from like-minded people on how best to change a behavior. I think this is the third thread I’ve seen you take up this objection in. Such objection is fine, but could you please focus your objections on the moral theology board? Perhaps Philosophy if it comes up there under a natural law argument. It’s not that your thoughts are unwelcome here, but arguing over it is a bit off-topic here on the Family board. That’s not to say there cannot be any debate or argument in a topic like this either, but it can only go so far before hijacking a thread, you know? The thread creator is just a Catholic looking for Catholic advice here, not looking to debate the right or wrong of it.

Where ever I make these points someone will say I should be making them somewhere else. Nobody is obligated to read my remarks, and there is even an easy ignore feature which allows any member to remove ALL of my posts from their view of the forum, which I don’t object to at all. I’m not stopping anybody from typing anything, don’t wish to, and couldn’t if I tried. So your application for fantasy victim status is hereby politely declined.

The thread creator is looking for Catholic advice, agreed. I am offering my version of Catholic advice, and you are welcome to offer yours. If you wish to assert that your version of Catholic advice, or the Vatican’s, is the “one true version” ok, feel free to say that.

 

[Ormond]

So, Ormond, you don’t know even the basics of Catholicism enough to dare argue about it.

I’m arguing for mercy, kindness and acceptance of the innocent. Some here are arguing for judgment and condemnation of the innocent. What you are arguing for is no longer clear, and that’s ok, I know I can be exhausting.

 

[Cone]

Here’s a new method to try.

The concept was invented by celibate male clerics whose minds became obsessed with sex due to their lack of such experience, a normal biological reaction. .

Source?

 

[Ormond]

Source?

Common sense. What do you think a group of male mammals who never have sex are going to be thinking about? Perhaps some nature documentaries would be of assistance here.

 

[Cone]

Common sense. What do you think a group of male mammals who never have sex are going to be thinking about? Perhaps some nature documentaries would be of assistance here.

Wouldn’t common sense suggest that those obsessed with sex would favor masturbation, not oppose it?

 

[goout]

I’m arguing for mercy, kindness and acceptance of the innocent.

Welcome to the Catholic Church.

Some here are arguing for judgment and condemnation of the innocent. What you are arguing for is no longer clear, and that’s ok, I know I can be exhausting.

It’s not near as exhausting if you understand what is being said.
How’s that going?

 

[Tablefor9]

It’s a choice of whether to follow that commandment, and whether to sell it to others.

I’m suggesting you believe the commandment has a source higher than human, but that’s just your own belief, not an established fact. You are entitled to your belief, and when you try to sell it, you will be challenged.

By selling the doctrine, you are indeed threatening eternal damnation, just as the doctrine does. That said, I do agree of course that you did not create the doctrine yourself. But you are selling it, so I will counter sell.

I gather you are not a Christian if you are willing to subject innocent people to pointless suffering for no good provable reason. I am offering mercy and comfort to those suffering from pointless shame, guilt and fear, and you are offering them eternal damnation. You can call that Christianity if you wish, but I do not.

You are defining sin in the way you prefer, I am doing the same. You are CHOOSING a different interpretation of Christianity than I am, as is your right.

Yes, your sin of inflicting pointless suffering upon the innocent obviously does draw my animosity intensely, that is now an established fact. You want to swing the sword of holy judgment, and I do too, we are Catholic DNA brothers, locked in the embrace of combat.

The point of my animosity is to demonstrate to you that you do not sit on a high holy throne from which you can judge others from a safe distance, which seems to be a common perspective among the Catholic Taliban. If you are going to judge and threaten damnation, I am too. I will join you in the world you have created. And I predict I’m better at swinging the sword than you are. We shall see.

If you don’t want to hear Catholic moral teaching, why are you here? No one has a gun to your head, despite the “Catholic Taliban” characterization.

 

[Ormond]

Wouldn’t common sense suggest that those obsessed with sex would favor masturbation, not oppose it?

There’s no need to be obsessed with sex if one is having sex. It’s the lack thereof that causes the obsession. Why do I have to explain this? If you lack food for a few days, you tend to become obsessed by food, right? It’s our smart body trying to communicate with our sometimes stupid brain.

To elevate the discussion a bit, it seems to me that what’s great about Catholic culture is also one of it’s primary weaknesses. Catholics, in general, on average, are a very intelligent articulate people. We are children of the Jews after all, and the apple does not fall far from the tree. So far, so good.

The price tag can be that we tend to live in our heads quite a bit, which can alienate us from our bodies, and convert our spiritual journey in to a second hand abstract symbolic experience more so than direct experience. We confuse talking about God with experiencing God sometimes, often.

Point being, when we have so many big fancy thoughts clogging our brains that we lose track of the wonder and glory of our bodies, various somewhat absurd conditions can emerge.

Watch. You or someone else will respond to this with some elevated sophisticated type of analysis, instead of simply facing that what we’re discussing feels good and doesn’t hurt anybody. The “feels good and doesn’t hurt” is too simple, too obvious, too common sense for the Catholic mind. We can’t resist turning the simplicity of it in to some kind of glorious theological principle, because most of the time, we are trapped living in our heads, instead of the real world.

Our bodies live in the real world. We might listen to them more carefully sometimes.

 

[goout]

There’s no need to be obsessed with sex if one is having sex. It’s the lack thereof that causes the obsession.

Not even your first words can pass the test of coherence.

This is such a patently absurd notion that it makes anything else you want to say suspect.

 

[Ormond]

If you don’t want to hear Catholic moral teaching, why are you here?

To give Catholic moral teachings of a somewhat different flavor than is common above. To make a contribution. To expand the conversation. To engage in the dialog Catholics are always talking about. To inflate my ego and glory in the sound of my own little voice. All of that.

 

[Cone]

There’s no need to be obsessed with sex if one is having sex. It’s the lack thereof that causes the obsession. Why do I have to explain this?

Because it’s illogical. People obsessed with sex tend to engage in sex, not avoid it. You made a smear against the fathers of the Church, which you can’t back up with either fact or reason. What are you doing here other than trolling?

 

[goout]

Because it’s illogical. People obsessed with sex tend to engage in sex, not avoid it. You made a smear against the fathers of the Church, which you can’t back up with either fact or reason.

It betrays an ignorance of basic human nature. The world is full of celibate people who are not obsessed with sex, and even more full of people having sex all the time who are obsessed with it.
And people who overeat and are obsessed with food.
And people who express themselves all day long and are obsessed with more of it.

 

[Tablefor9]

To give Catholic moral teachings of a somewhat different flavor than is common above. To make a contribution. To expand the conversation. To engage in the dialog Catholics are always talking about. To inflate my ego and glory in the sound of my own little voice. All of that.

What you provide may or may not be the moral opinions of a Catholic, but they are not the moral teachings of Holy Mother Church. And just speaking personally, conversation that contributes might be received better if it were honey rather than acid. To speak plainly, one doesn’t have to be argumentative and rude.

 

[Filius_Prodigus]

I’m arguing for mercy, kindness and acceptance of the innocent. Some here are arguing for judgment and condemnation of the innocent. What you are arguing for is no longer clear, and that’s ok, I know I can be exhausting.

If it is not clear for you it is perhaps because of your preconceptions of what I should be saying (possibly due to the fact you’re rebutting several people at once).

Simply put, I argue that according to the RCC it is a sin against chastity.

Your reaction to this is that it’s some sort of tragedy against masturbators. All it implies is that they cannot participate in the eucharist. It’s no worse a “sin category” than e.g. lying. And we all lie, become irate, etc, and we should confess it.

Masturbation is just an addiction (habit). It is not an inherent, unavoidable mental illness. People can fight it off. I for one did.

 

[Ormond]

Because it’s illogical.

I’ll try again. If you don’t eat (another bodily function) for a week, what happens in your mind in regards to food?

What are you doing here other than trolling?

Trying to find anyone who knows what the word “trolling” actually means. Someone stating positions you don’t agree with isn’t trolling. Annoying perhaps, but not trolling.

 

[goout]

I’ll try again. If you don’t eat (another bodily function) for a week, what happens in your mind in regards to food?

Trying to find anyone who knows what the word “trolling” actually means. Someone stating positions you don’t agree with isn’t trolling. Annoying perhaps, but not trolling.

Someone setting up straw men continuously rather than stating real objections could easily be mistaken for trolling.
So what do you say. Do you have objections to Catholicism?

 

[Ormond]

Simply put, I argue that according to the RCC it is a sin against chastity.

Almost right. According to the clergy of the RCC it is a sin against chastity. The clergy are a tiny fraction of the RCC.

Your reaction to this is that it’s some sort of tragedy against masturbators.

Here you reveal how little understanding you have of the posts on this topic from those racked with guilt and fear. Or maybe you just don’t care.

Masturbation is just an addiction (habit). It is not an inherent, unavoidable mental illness. People can fight it off. I for one did.

Thinking that masturbation is a sin is an avoidable form of mental illness. People can fight it off. I for one avoided it.

 

[goout]

Almost right. According to the clergy of the RCC it is a sin against chastity.

Wrong.

 

[Filius_Prodigus]

I’ll try again. If you don’t eat (another bodily function) for a week, what happens in your mind in regards to food?
.

I used to think the same way you do. Until I tried it (quitting abruptly). Then I understood my libido is just the same… or perhaps even less. I still crave but I just watch netflix, have a conversation, etc.

I discovered it’s like when I wanked once a day. The rest of the day I was doing anything else. The key was completely abstaining from porn. I still get to incidentally see humans in sexy attire but it doesn’t seem to affect me much.

 

[Ormond]

Wrong.

Thank you for giving up, throwing in the towel, flying the white flag of surrender. I’m tired too.