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Nevarlander
Guest
Careful with the sharpies. I’ve done it too. Sometimes it just makes it look bad, but these were over white-out stains.
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rayne89
Guest
This is really uncharitable and uncalled for. I suggest you review the forum rules on conduct.
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Goth_Catholic
Guest
There’s a lot of verbal abuse on any given day that sometimes becomes mental and physical abuse but it ends there. My relationship with my father is non existent even though we occupy the same house. There’s a lot of pain there. And it really causes me to be afried because I’m essentally afried of him. That fear of being lashed out at and struck down is always with me. It sucks and I’ve realized and accepted that we’re never gonna have a relationship, that’s just the way it is.Can I ask you something? Feel free not to answer if it’s too personal. Are you drawn to the Goth culture because you’ve had a lot of difficulties in life and don’t feel particularly “pink and perky” if you know what I mean? As in, you relate better to things that are darker, (not in the evil sense)more somber as opposed to “happy happy joy joy” type things. I don’t know if this is making sense.
I have a theory about those that are drawn to Goth culture. When I was a teen (back in the day) Goth was in it’s beginning stages, we didn’t even really have a name for it yet. I remember looking in my closet one day and realizing every artcle of clothing I owned was was either black or gray. Even my winter coat and my shoes. It wasn’t something I had planned on or thought of doing purposefully.
I was more of the head banger variety, listened to music like Metallica, Guns n Roses an such. My hubby (who was my boyfriend at the time) was pretty much the same but was into harder stuff like Danzig, The Mistfits, and bands like Tool etc.
We both came from difficult homes that were abusive. My theory is that kids that experience a lot of pain growing up are drawn to somber (even angry) type music and culture because that’s is what they relate to.
Just wondering if that has been your experience. (By the way I read your signature, thought was interesting cause my hubby has a black rose tattoo.)
I’m not depressed but i’m defentantly not a “pink and perky” person. The glass is always half empty. I rather be dark and somber and pessimistic because I can just deal with things better that way. I’d rather assume the worst, then hope for the best. So yeah, I think what your trying to say carries weight. When you have problems especially within yourself, you really do see things from a darker point of view.
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Goth_Catholic
Guest
What is your problem with me? I’m different, big deal. I wear black makeup, fishnets, and combat boots. I read books that track witches and watch movies with vampires. My favorite thing to do is write stories that invole charectors with quirks and addictions. Woohoo. I also get good grades, go to mass every sunday, study Catholicism and volenteer at the hospital. Next year i’ll be a junior but taking senior classes. In two years I’ll hopefully be majoring Pre-Med at a catholic college. Wow.
Give up trying to insult and degrade me, because that’s never gonna happen. I’m more secure about who I am then you’ll ever know. The day I don’t bare goth tattooed to my soul is the day I loose it.
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bcuster
Guest
I am always truely humbled by the wisdom of others. There is a wealth of information to ponder in these replies. I can only give you my perspective as a mother, a child of God, and a therapist.
First I can say that you, as a parent, know your child best. You know whether the black finger nail polish is self-expression or a symptom of a deeper problem (ie. depression, self-deprication, etc.).
We all parent our children a differently. We choose our battles and allow self-expression. You apparently have experience with the Goth culture and are not put off by some of its elements.
As for any culture, I propose a simple test. Jesus told us to look for the fruit. I paraphrase: Good trees bear good fruit. Bad ones do not. So look at the fruit. This applies to any culture or practice from what we watch on TV to the music we listen too.
I work with children who have emotional/behavioral problems. I try to practice a non-judgemental attitude toward families. When parents come in with facial piercings and body art, I hope my expression does not betray my conservative upbringing. I look at the quality of the relationships in the family, their sincerity and their willingness to see their children a little differently also.
First I can say that you, as a parent, know your child best. You know whether the black finger nail polish is self-expression or a symptom of a deeper problem (ie. depression, self-deprication, etc.).
We all parent our children a differently. We choose our battles and allow self-expression. You apparently have experience with the Goth culture and are not put off by some of its elements.
As for any culture, I propose a simple test. Jesus told us to look for the fruit. I paraphrase: Good trees bear good fruit. Bad ones do not. So look at the fruit. This applies to any culture or practice from what we watch on TV to the music we listen too.
I work with children who have emotional/behavioral problems. I try to practice a non-judgemental attitude toward families. When parents come in with facial piercings and body art, I hope my expression does not betray my conservative upbringing. I look at the quality of the relationships in the family, their sincerity and their willingness to see their children a little differently also.
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Nepenthe
Guest
Hey, it isn’t only a ‘youth’ culture, you know? As an eldergoth (or, uh…not ) I feel I should represent a little too.
What has come to be called ‘goth’ culture has been around a long while, and its modern form has been going strong since the seventies. Many of us did and do start out as ‘spooky kids’ from a very early age, and yes, quite a few come from troubled backgrounds, but that last is sadly commonplace throughout society, and neither are prerequisites. There have always been people interested in the moodier, romantic, introspective life, and hopefully always will be.
I have found that the younger ones are often simply amazed at the wealth of learning, history, innovation and friendship amongst such like-minded people. Sure, there are some bad influences out there, but again, that is literally everywhere and anywhere one looks. On the whole, and I have been around the goth and punk scenes a long time, I’d venture to say there’s an emphasis on learning to be a force for good, particularly in regards to good manners, kindness, education and a desire to escape (or better yet, reclaim) the regiment of consumerism and mass-culture. Attempts at coopting and diluting these ‘alternative’ cultures have been made along the fringes (often attracting the young and those new to the ideals), but the spirit of independent, DIY creativity and community has been very resilient. Once a youngster manages to avoid being sold a prepackaged ‘style,’ then, if they’re still quirky and like the way they are, hurray for them.
And I might point out, in times past, those moody, romantic, introspective youth might well have entered religious orders – and some still do! I wouldn’t bother asking any monks or nuns if they’re goths, since the answer is, naturally ‘Of course not!’ for various reasons.
And it isn’t a matter of ‘growing up and out of it’ for many people. It’s a personality type, and most often, not a childishly rebellious one at that. A surprisingly disproportionate number of longterm goths are highly successful, very often in independent or creative professions. Is a dislike of polo shirts and khakis to be considered ‘immature?’ To me, that sort of corporate-casual uniform, and it is considerably more a uniform than what is thought of as goth attire, often looks frankly unattractive and depressing, often in a stale, aging fratboy way.
And as women grow older, they don’t automatically become iconically bleachstreaked soccermoms either. If dressing in quiet, dark, slightly old-fashioned clothing isn’t easy for everyone to pull off, neither is WASPy preppiness. It’s not easy for women approaching middle age to know how to dress – the pressures to conform are nearly as strong as they were in junior highschool, and the sudden social devaluation as youth ends is problematic too, to put it mildly.
I have found that I cannot dress in the way deemed ‘normal’ by the media, by young people (at my age, I’m supposed to be listening to oldies stations, wearing tracksuits and driving an SUV, arg) and by others to whom conformity is terribly important. And when I say 'can’t; I mean I look like I stole someone else’s clothes. When I wear black, dark red, grey, olive green, and so forth, I simply look nicer, and feel more dignified. And if one looks like Mirdath or myself, it’s just appropriate to our tastes, physical appearances and preferences.
And why should I ever give up the exquisite taste I have been graced with, in literature, music, art, and social interaction? To add to what Mirdath has already said, I didn’t join a subculture – I just found out there were other people like me, and it’s great! So great, that I intend to keep on being myself. Heck, my grandmother was pretty darn gothy too! And if I picked it up from anyone, it was from her.
) I feel I should represent a little too.What has come to be called ‘goth’ culture has been around a long while, and its modern form has been going strong since the seventies. Many of us did and do start out as ‘spooky kids’ from a very early age, and yes, quite a few come from troubled backgrounds, but that last is sadly commonplace throughout society, and neither are prerequisites. There have always been people interested in the moodier, romantic, introspective life, and hopefully always will be.
I have found that the younger ones are often simply amazed at the wealth of learning, history, innovation and friendship amongst such like-minded people. Sure, there are some bad influences out there, but again, that is literally everywhere and anywhere one looks. On the whole, and I have been around the goth and punk scenes a long time, I’d venture to say there’s an emphasis on learning to be a force for good, particularly in regards to good manners, kindness, education and a desire to escape (or better yet, reclaim) the regiment of consumerism and mass-culture. Attempts at coopting and diluting these ‘alternative’ cultures have been made along the fringes (often attracting the young and those new to the ideals), but the spirit of independent, DIY creativity and community has been very resilient. Once a youngster manages to avoid being sold a prepackaged ‘style,’ then, if they’re still quirky and like the way they are, hurray for them.
And I might point out, in times past, those moody, romantic, introspective youth might well have entered religious orders – and some still do! I wouldn’t bother asking any monks or nuns if they’re goths, since the answer is, naturally ‘Of course not!’ for various reasons.
And it isn’t a matter of ‘growing up and out of it’ for many people. It’s a personality type, and most often, not a childishly rebellious one at that. A surprisingly disproportionate number of longterm goths are highly successful, very often in independent or creative professions. Is a dislike of polo shirts and khakis to be considered ‘immature?’ To me, that sort of corporate-casual uniform, and it is considerably more a uniform than what is thought of as goth attire, often looks frankly unattractive and depressing, often in a stale, aging fratboy way.
And as women grow older, they don’t automatically become iconically bleachstreaked soccermoms either. If dressing in quiet, dark, slightly old-fashioned clothing isn’t easy for everyone to pull off, neither is WASPy preppiness. It’s not easy for women approaching middle age to know how to dress – the pressures to conform are nearly as strong as they were in junior highschool, and the sudden social devaluation as youth ends is problematic too, to put it mildly.
I have found that I cannot dress in the way deemed ‘normal’ by the media, by young people (at my age, I’m supposed to be listening to oldies stations, wearing tracksuits and driving an SUV, arg) and by others to whom conformity is terribly important. And when I say 'can’t; I mean I look like I stole someone else’s clothes. When I wear black, dark red, grey, olive green, and so forth, I simply look nicer, and feel more dignified. And if one looks like Mirdath or myself, it’s just appropriate to our tastes, physical appearances and preferences.
And why should I ever give up the exquisite taste I have been graced with, in literature, music, art, and social interaction? To add to what Mirdath has already said, I didn’t join a subculture – I just found out there were other people like me, and it’s great! So great, that I intend to keep on being myself. Heck, my grandmother was pretty darn gothy too! And if I picked it up from anyone, it was from her.
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Cadence
Guest
I hope before you turn pre-med you learn how to spell “lose”!
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Goth_Catholic
Guest
Oi. I can’t even spell pediatrician (I had to google the spelling) right and that’s what I want to be. My cross to bare.I hope before you turn pre-med you learn how to spell “lose”!
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TOP
Guest
OI? Ok , lets turn the wayback machine, wayback. You can’t go running around yelling oi.:dts: Your a goth , stick with your own kind. Geesh , kids these days. No respect for us old folks. When I was a teenager, only a select few could were oxbloods w/ white laces and keep long hair. You had to earn it. Silly d rockers 
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Suat
Guest
Hi Goth_Catholic, I know the question was not addressed to me, but I use woollite dark on my clothes. How fast they turn ‘pastel’ black depends on the fabric of course. For anything similar to jeans, then start to fade within the first few washes (incredibly annoying as I hate the blue-black color), the rest of the stuff fades slower than that. Probably not worth the extra cost overall though.
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estesbob
Guest
Well I am a big fan of the old horror films so perhapos I am a repressed Goth? Those movies, BTW,would lead me to beleive that big bosoms and lots a cleavage must a Goth thing. At any rate i am going to get some black nail polish and see how my cleints react . Do you think there is a market for a Goth CPA?
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Mirdath
Guest
It’s possible!
Well, they don’t hurt it, let’s say… you can be a stick and still look good too though – think Cesare from The Cabinet of Dr. Caligari, or Luna from London After Midnight
I’m very much on the ‘stick’ side myself.Elements of the look are pretty common in corporationland already. There’s a whole ‘corporate goth’ thing. Black nailpolish on a guy might still be over the line though (rargh small-minded suits)
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bear06
Guest
You’ve pretty much just shown why I don’t want this for my kids. Life can be tough enough for a teen without being dark, somber and pessimistic. It’s almost like giving up. We’re Catholic, we should be hopeful.and joyful in Our Savior.
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Goth_Catholic
Guest
A rejoicing heart can beat in darkness
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bear06
Guest
You act like this is a religion which is quite scary to me. You should have “Catholic Faith” inserted in your statement. I don’t mean to degrade you but I have serious concerns about this sub-culture which you are only confirming.
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Goth_Catholic
Guest
two halfs of the same soul
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bear06
Guest
But you just said you’re pessimistic and somber.
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bear06
Guest
Our souls shouldn’t be divided.
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Goth_Catholic
Guest
On life, yes. On heaven, no way.But you just said you’re pessimistic and somber.
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Goth_Catholic
Guest
Never said they were divided, merely they were two halfs.
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