I need to talk about this

[SilverLight]

I really like this site and what it has to offer. I was raised Catholic and I have always called myself one. My family may not be like other Catholic families though.

I was never told masturbation was wrong and the same for contraception. Perhaps my parents know the damage that may be able to do to some young people and confuse them later on in life. Why I have no real idea though.

That’s not what this is about though. I said before that I like this site but I feel hurt and a little scared when I see people tell me in all caps NO THAT’S WRONG! or at least that’s how it feels. I was raised differently but that does not make me a bad person or bad Catholic. I still believe in God I just have a slightly different outlook on things.

I am a young woman who has her own views and respects yours. I would not call what you personally believe in wrong because I was always told that’s kind of rude to do. You do what you feel is right and I will do what I think is.

If you do not agree with me that’s fine and I do not care because I respect that. I just had to get this out and off my chest.

I’m sorry if this angers anyone greatly.

 

[Trident_H]

Hey Silver. I know what you’re saying. And I know that sometimes when people mean a bit too well they can sometimes come off as ranting. I just want to let you know that I’m in your corner on this. Don’t let that stuff stress you out. Don’t let it get you down. We’re all just learning here. Some of us are learning how to come up to a level. And others are learning how to use compassion and understanding to give us a hand to get there.

I hope you’re doing Ok.

Peace Silver.

Your pal,

Trident

 

[SilverLight]

Hey Silver. I know what you’re saying. And I know that sometimes when people mean a bit too well they can sometimes come off as ranting. I just want to let you know that I’m in your corner on this. Don’t let that stuff stress you out. Don’t let it get you down. We’re all just learning here. Some of us are learning how to come up to a level. And others are learning how to use compassion and understanding to give us a hand to get there.

I hope you’re doing Ok.

Peace Silver.

Your pal,

Trident

What you have said has put me at ease and so I must thank you.

I hope you are doing well also.

 

[SilverLight]

Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts!

All of us have free will, and have the freedom to believe or not believe anything. Hopefully when people made comments here, they were careful not to tell you that YOU were a bad person because your thoughts were wrong, but that the Catholic church teaching is clear, therefore you might disagree with the Catholic church?

You know, raising many children, especially boys I was worried that the Catholic church teaching on masturbation would be difficult. I know that it is extremely hard for a 12-13 year old child to control themselves and never wanted them to feel dirty or ashamed. Praise God that the Catholic church had the answers! The teaching is clear that masturbation is a sin, however along with that teaching is a warm understanding of human nature. Catholic church teaching shouldn’t harm or damage anyone, especially a child. When we raised our children the intent wasn’t to confuse them it was to be open and honest!

Here is a cut-and paste (edited) from the Catechism of the Catholic Church
**
CCC 2352 …“Masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action…(but) To form an equitable judgment about the subjects’ moral responsibility and to guide pastoral action, one must take into account the affective immaturity, force of acquired habit, conditions of anxiety, or other psychological or social factors that can lessen, if not even reduce to a minimum, moral culpability” **

I find that just beautiful. My husband had my boys read this exact paragraph. They were told very lovingly the truth! The truth is the action was sinful but that Jesus is merciful and wanted them to try their best, whatever their best was and that Jesus knew it was hard. I think this is a beautiful teaching because masturbation can lead to a lifetime habit, and often brings with it feelings of intense loneliness. We never expected our children not to sin but it was important for us to teach them the true teachings of the church.

As far as artificial contraception, you are not alone in disagreeing with that teaching! However I urge you, if you feel up to it, to dig deeper because there is great FREEDOM in not using artificial contraception. The Church is wise in this teaching, not sure if you will agree, probably not but discussion is good. Please be assured of my prayers for you and your faith journey, we are all on a journey! God bless.

Thank you for being understanding in what you say and not harsh.

I do disagree with some of the things the church says and it seems my parents do also. I find it harsh to call a sexual desire a sin sometimes. Just because someone has lust for someone or something does not mean they will act out on it.

When I was younger some of what the church said scared me and I had some anxiety because of it. I also honestly personally have no need for contraception at the moment. I do not want children until I know I can afford to take care of them the best I can. This comes from me being adopted and wanting to be able to care for my own in a way my birth mother could not though she did the best thing she could at the time. I have a good life now because of her decision to put me up for adoption and I thank her every day.

You have been very kind Monicad and I thank you for that.

 

[Vico]

Thank you for being understanding in what you say and not harsh.

I do disagree with some of the things the church says and it seems my parents do also. I find it harsh to call a sexual desire a sin sometimes. Just because someone has lust for someone or something does not mean they will act out on it.

When I was younger some of what the church said scared me and I had some anxiety because of it. I also honestly personally have no need for contraception at the moment. I do not want children until I know I can afford to take care of them the best I can. This comes from me being adopted and wanting to be able to care for my own in a way my birth mother could not though she did the best thing she could at the time. I have a good life now because of her decision to put me up for adoption and I thank her every day.

You have been very kind Monicad and I thank you for that.

Sexual desire is not sin, rather entertaining the desire willingly, is sin. (Assuming this is for someone that one is not married to, or fantasy.)

From the Catechism, on contraception:
2399 The regulation of births represents one of the aspects of responsible fatherhood and motherhood. Legitimate intentions on the part of the spouses do not justify recourse to morally unacceptable means (for example, direct sterilization or contraception).

 

[SuperLuigi]

I really like this site and what it has to offer. I was raised Catholic and I have always called myself one. My family may not be like other Catholic families though.

I was never told masturbation was wrong and the same for contraception. Perhaps my parents know the damage that may be able to do to some young people and confuse them later on in life. Why I have no real idea though.

That’s not what this is about though. I said before that I like this site but I feel hurt and a little scared when I see people tell me in all caps NO THAT’S WRONG! or at least that’s how it feels. I was raised differently but that does not make me a bad person or bad Catholic. I still believe in God I just have a slightly different outlook on things.

I am a young woman who has her own views and respects yours. I would not call what you personally believe in wrong because I was always told that’s kind of rude to do. You do what you feel is right and I will do what I think is.

If you do not agree with me that’s fine and I do not care because I respect that. I just had to get this out and off my chest.

I’m sorry if this angers anyone greatly.

Per the forum rules, people may question a doctrine about a religion but it must be done respectfully.

While I’ve heard good things about the radio and I like the apologist and prayer request features on here, personally, I would NEVER ask for advice or post a rant on the forums. Not in a million years. :nope:

I’ve also seen a lot of complaints, both on posts like this and in PM’s. I’ve gotten the sense some folks get pretty incensed on here, which is unfortunate because it does nothing short of poison the spirit of the forums whether it breaks the rules or not.

And typing in all caps is not necessary for practicing Catholics because the Truth speaks for itself. That really doesn’t do any good, and actually, from a technical writing perspective, it makes what you are saying HARDER to read.

So please be advised to use bold/italics or an e-mote smiley.

 

[heidi_storage]

People are going to tell you when you contradict RCC teaching. That’s not mean, it’s helpful to you to know what your faith says is true and right. And just because you haven’t been taught that something is wrong does not mean that it can be construed as “right”; that way leads to relativism.

That said, people can certainly be careless of others’ feelings on this forum. Don’t let it get to you–it’s in the nature of any internet forum, really. Most aren’t setting out to upset you, and it’s best if you do not get upset over what some random person thinks of your words. This forum gives you a voice, too, and you can use it to respond–as you have done.

 

[pianistclare]

Well, if everyone could just decide for themselves, we wouldn’t need commandments, or tenets would we?

A person can talk themselves into believing/justifying anything.
When people point this out, it’s not being mean or harsh. It’s the truth.
If the truth hurts…then we need to take a long hard look at our perceptions.
This is how we grow in holiness. Looking inward and then reaching back out to God.
Peace.

 

[Rbaker]

I really like this site and what it has to offer. I was raised Catholic and I have always called myself one. My family may not be like other Catholic families though.

I was never told masturbation was wrong and the same for contraception. Perhaps my parents know the damage that may be able to do to some young people and confuse them later on in life. Why I have no real idea though.

That’s not what this is about though. I said before that I like this site but I feel hurt and a little scared when I see people tell me in all caps NO THAT’S WRONG! or at least that’s how it feels. I was raised differently but that does not make me a bad person or bad Catholic. I still believe in God I just have a slightly different outlook on things.

I am a young woman who has her own views and respects yours. I would not call what you personally believe in wrong because I was always told that’s kind of rude to do. You do what you feel is right and I will do what I think is.

If you do not agree with me that’s fine and I do not care because I respect that. I just had to get this out and off my chest.

I’m sorry if this angers anyone greatly.

I like to look at it this way. I would say that the majority of the people on this site would never be this blunt in real life. If you told them about a problem, I am sure they would comfort you and give you some good advice. Computers make it really hard to see emotions and can often give off different vibes then the author intended. But yeah, lots of people on here say things they’d never say face to face

 

[pianistclare]

I like to look at it this way. I would say that the majority of the people on this site would never be this blunt in real life. If you told them about a problem, I am sure they would comfort you and give you some good advice. Computers make it really hard to see emotions and can often give off different vibes then the author intended. But yeah, lots of people on here say things they’d never say face to face

Well, there are awkward people everywhere, not just online.
But how does that justify continuing in error?
Aren’t we responsible for our own actions?
Doctors correct (or attempt to correct) risky behaviors in their patients. Are they rude? They use facts. For ex: smoke, then high risk of lung cancer. Sin is alike a cancer. It’s there silently destroying your relationship with God. People who care advise you to stop. Why is that perceived as a bad thing? Ultimately, if the person listens and learns, they do better. I think that’s a worthy goal. But then., I’m a Catechist. It’s my job to lead the people to the truth of the Christ’s Church on earth.

 

[1ke]

I would not call what you personally believe in wrong because I was always told that’s kind of rude to do. You do what you feel is right and I will do what I think is.

This is the crux of it all, actually. So thank you for bringing this up.

This is called moral relativism and the Church rejects it as incompatible with the Truth. The Church teaches that there is objective truth and it is knowable because it is divinely revealed.

We are called into relationship with God, to know, love, and serve him. Part of that is embracing THE truth. Not “my” truth or “your” truth, but the actual truth. Living in the light. Living The Way. Not “a” way, “the” way.

So, when something you believe is wrong, it is an obligation on your part to seek the truth and it is an obligation on other people’s part to tell you the truth. Not to be rude, but to do the work God sent us to do-- evangelization.

When people correct erroneous information you or I hold, they are doing one of the Spiritual Works of Mercy. And, we should receive that with joy because we now know more than we did before and can continue to grow in knowledge of God.

Our shortcomings, our gaps in knowledge, things taught to us that were wrong-- none of those is our fault. We have the opportunity to learn and grow, to continue on the path to holiness. Staying ignorant of the truth does not help us, rejecting the truth does not help us, and retaining the notion that we can each “personally believe” opposite things and both be right does not help us either. Our goal is Heaven.

 

[SilverLight]

Per the forum rules, people may question a doctrine about a religion but it must be done respectfully.

While I’ve heard good things about the radio and I like the apologist and prayer request features on here, personally, I would NEVER ask for advice or post a rant on the forums. Not in a million years. :nope:

I’ve also seen a lot of complaints, both on posts like this and in PM’s. I’ve gotten the sense some folks get pretty incensed on here, which is unfortunate because it does nothing short of poison the spirit of the forums whether it breaks the rules or not.

And typing in all caps is not necessary for practicing Catholics because the Truth speaks for itself. That really doesn’t do any good, and actually, from a technical writing perspective, it makes what you are saying HARDER to read.

So please be advised to use bold/italics or an e-mote smiley.

Oh I was using all caps there to make a point. I hardly do so in other threads I learned early on from online chats and other forums that using all caps is just not a good thing to do.

 

[SilverLight]

This is the crux of it all, actually. So thank you for bringing this up.

This is called moral relativism and the Church rejects it as incompatible with the Truth. The Church teaches that there is objective truth and it is knowable because it is divinely revealed.

We are called into relationship with God, to know, love, and serve him. Part of that is embracing THE truth. Not “my” truth or “your” truth, but the actual truth. Living in the light. Living The Way. Not “a” way, “the” way.

So, when something you believe is wrong, it is an obligation on your part to seek the truth and it is an obligation on other people’s part to tell you the truth. Not to be rude, but to do the work God sent us to do-- evangelization.

When people correct erroneous information you or I hold, they are doing one of the Spiritual Works of Mercy. And, we should receive that with joy because we now know more than we did before and can continue to grow in knowledge of God.

Our shortcomings, our gaps in knowledge, things taught to us that were wrong-- none of those is our fault. We have the opportunity to learn and grow, to continue on the path to holiness. Staying ignorant of the truth does not help us, rejecting the truth does not help us, and retaining the notion that we can each “personally believe” opposite things and both be right does not help us either. Our goal is Heaven.

Then perhaps this is no longer the environment I need to be in anymore. Some of the things the church teaches give me an amount of anxiety and slight depression. I’m not trying to seem overly sensitive here. Perhaps the Theology classes I took in my past college semesters gave me to much of an open mind. I accept what other people believe as the truth for them and that’s fine with me. I am more happy and at peace when I do so and feel no conflict in my heart or soul. I feel my relationship with God has always been strong.

 

[pianistclare]

Then perhaps this is no longer the environment I need to be in anymore. Some of the things the church teaches give me an amount of anxiety and slight depression. I’m not trying to seem overly sensitive here. Perhaps the Theology classes I took in my past college semesters gave me to much of an open mind. I accept what other people believe as the truth for them and that’s fine with me. I am more happy and at peace when I do so and feel no conflict in my heart or soul. I feel my relationship with God has always been strong.

Well, that would be unfortunate, because there are a lot of great educators here…one can learn a lot. that’s why there are so many lurkers…not for the occasional snarky remark, but for the real info, articles, and clarifications. It’s a good place to talk things out.
A person is to grow spiritually for their entire life. I don’t know why anyone would forego more tools in their toolbox. Perhaps limit yourself to reading the various Catholic Answers tracts online. There’s a lot of solid info there.
Good luck!

 

[Maximilan_Kolbe]

Well, there are awkward people everywhere, not just online.
But how does that justify continuing in error?
Aren’t we responsible for our own actions?
Doctors correct (or attempt to correct) risky behaviors in their patients. Are they rude? They use facts. For ex: smoke, then high risk of lung cancer. Sin is alike a cancer. It’s there silently destroying your relationship with God. People who care advise you to stop. Why is that perceived as a bad thing? Ultimately, if the person listens and learns, they do better. I think that’s a worthy goal. But then., I’m a Catechist. It’s my job to lead the people to the truth of the Christ’s Church on earth.

At times, we have to remember that many on here who respond with advice do not have the time for interaction that a conversation would allow. They may only get one chance to make a point that is very important.

I am reminded of an interview with Dr. Laura Schlesinger years ago where she was questioned about how she was often so blunt with her callers, and asked if she was that way with her patients? She said the dialogue with a patient and a caller is very different. She said that often when someone would call her for advice, she knew she may only get one chance to speak to them. She had one shot. She could not afford to tiptoe around, or begin a long process where she could expect future calls back to work on progress. As such, she was usually quite direct and at times seemingly harsh because she knew she’d never get a chance to help the person again.

Websites like this can often be that way. Most people do not have time it takes to go back and forth, to include pleasantries and a congenial buildup the way a conversation would allow. Facial expressions and body language are lost. So at times (look at how many posters post once in a topic and never respond back!) people only get once chance to respond to a question or comment, and it may seem brusque.

However, most of the time I see people feeling as though they are attacked it is due to a combination of being too thin-skinned or feeling guilty inwardly.

Unless someone is “in your face” about what they do that flies in the face of Church teaching (which comes off as looking for a fight), usually people simply explain what we believe, and why we believe it. Rarely do I see attacking.

The World News board can get a bit more heated, because much of that is opinion versus opinion, and very political.

I’d be curious what posts you perceived to be overly hostile, and frankly, why you’d even care if they were?

I am comfortable with what I believe (luckily, it aligns with Church teachings in this case, which makes me more comfortable I suppose), and as such, why would I care if someone disagreed or attacked my belief anyway? In my mind, I am right, so why would it bother me at all if someone thought I was wrong or even crazy? Living in a mostly secular world, I know for a fact many people think my wife and I are nuts. Meh. We’re right; they’re wrong (in our minds).

 

[SilverLight]

People are going to tell you when you contradict RCC teaching. That’s not mean, it’s helpful to you to know what your faith says is true and right. And just because you haven’t been taught that something is wrong does not mean that it can be construed as “right”; that way leads to relativism.

That said, people can certainly be careless of others’ feelings on this forum. Don’t let it get to you–it’s in the nature of any internet forum, really. Most aren’t setting out to upset you, and it’s best if you do not get upset over what some random person thinks of your words. This forum gives you a voice, too, and you can use it to respond–as you have done.

I know how forums can be I am active on a few. I am more afraid of being shut down because my views are slightly different. I have run into some extreme people on here and in real life both in this religion and others.

 

[1ke]

Some of the things the church teaches give me an amount of anxiety and slight depression.

Then continue on through the struggle until you reach a place of understanding. First on the list of the Fruit of the Spirit is love, but second is JOY. The beauty of the Church’s teaching brings peace and joy. But not without struggle for many of us. So many have been impacted by the poison of the culture-- moral relativism first among the poison. Once you’ve gotten the poison out, good teaching can take root, mature, and grow.

I am more happy and at peace when I do so and feel no conflict in my heart or soul. I feel my relationship with God has always been strong.

yes, but the goal is to be more holy, not more happy. I think there’s a reason that several places in the bible we see stories of people literally or figuratively “wrestling with God”.

It is through this earnest struggle that we become more holy.

 

[SilverLight]

Then continue on through the struggle until you reach a place of understanding. First on the list of the Fruit of the Spirit is love, but second is JOY. The beauty of the Church’s teaching brings peace and joy. But not without struggle for many of us. So many have been impacted by the poison of the culture-- moral relativism first among the poison. Once you’ve gotten the poison out, good teaching can take root, mature, and grow.

yes, but the goal is to be more holy, not more happy. I think there’s a reason that several places in the bible we see stories of people literally or figuratively “wrestling with God”.

It is through this earnest struggle that we become more holy.

But there does need to be a balance of happy and holy though. I am not sure how much good would come from being sad and holy that just sounds gloomy to me.

 

[1ke]

But there does need to be a balance of happy and holy though. I am not sure how much good would come from being sad and holy that just sounds gloomy to me.

Through holiness, we know true happiness. That is what “beatific vision” means-- the seeing that brings bliss.

The Beatitudes are the recipe for true happiness. Blessed or Happy are the…

It is about how to find joy in holiness. Which is sometimes (well, usually) found in embracing the Cross. How can there be joy in the cross? How can there be joy in suffering and in all circumstances? That is the paradox of the cross. It is what makes it repugnant to so many. But it is where our salvation is found.

The lives of the Saints teach us the way to real happiness. The gospel teaches us the way to real happiness. The Church teaches us the way to real happiness.

It is not found in the false happiness that secular society preaches.

 

[Sugabee43]

Through holiness, we know true happiness. That is what “beatific vision” means-- the seeing that brings bliss.

The Beatitudes are the recipe for true happiness. Blessed or Happy are the…

It is about how to find joy in holiness. Which is sometimes (well, usually) found in embracing the Cross. How can there be joy in the cross? How can there be joy in suffering and in all circumstances? That is the paradox of the cross. It is what makes it repugnant to so many. But it is where our salvation is found.

The lives of the Saints teach us the way to real happiness. The gospel teaches us the way to real happiness. The Church teaches us the way to real happiness.

It is not found in the false happiness that secular society preaches.

Beautiful post, 1ke, as per usual!! It is the polar opposite of what our world glorifies as “true happiness”. It cannot be obtained through worldly love, power, riches, or fame. True happiness can *only *be attained from the Spirit-ual love, power, riches, and fame of Jesus. He gives us true love, true power, true riches, true fame! As (I think) St. Augustine, a Doctor of the Church, once said, “All else is ashes”.
This doesn’t mean we don’t have an obligation to this earth and our brothers and sisters and to their health and joy and comfort. It just means we cannot or will not fill the hole in our hearts and souls with anything other than Christ.