I'd like Catholicism more if it weren't for the Catholics

[I_Believe]

I have attended protestant worship services of all sorts of denominations. The people who attend those services look like this:

:extrahappy:
:clapping:
:grouphug:

And at the Catholic services, they look like this:



What is GOING ON HERE PEOPLE?!?!

It’s very simple. When you place yourself before the Real Presence, you know your place. At least if you have the Faith you do.

Big difference between a prayer service and a Liturgy.
The Liturgy is the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.

You think those on Calvary clapped and hugged while Christ hung there dying ? How about at the Sermon on the Mount ? You think when that sermon was over everyone erupted in a thunderous applause, singing “praise the Lord, and pass me a copperhead !” ?

 

[redrosetea]

At your church everyone piles into the front pews?!?!? WOW!

Almost every Saturday I stand at the back of the Church and watch the folks come in. Every time the last 2 rows in all 4 columns of pews fill up and, by the time we process in, the people who came in after those 2 rows filled up are scattered around the church in such a way that offering the sign of peace becomes difficult. I usually sit in the 3rd or 4th pew from the front and, believe me, nothing blocks my view of the altar. You would think that when at most 50, but most often 35 people gather for Mass they’d fill the first 2 rows of pews rather than the last.

Yes they always have done

 

[Phemie]

Yes they always have done

All I can say is ‘you’re lucky’. Fr. and I have often joked that if we could design our dream church it would only have two rows of pews.

Even at Midnight Mass and the Vigil the front pews are empty.

 

[kage_ar]

If you are looking for crowded pews, come to our Parish. It was sooo nice, at Sat evening Mass I could actually have a bit of room to breathe, but, usually our Masses are standing room only.

I’m all about fellowship, but, I also want to be able to breathe without the hair of the lady next to me brusing against my face!

Guess it is all about where you are.

 

[bubba451]

Perhaps I was a bit harsh–I LIKE the Church I attend and I love the TLM and I don’t want anybody fussing around with it. I sit up front with my family and I rarely am unhappy or frowning. In fact, I’m glad I’m there and participate as fully as I can. Most other people at our mass seem very happy and we reserve time AFTER mass for a community social. Our attendance is up every week so I guess others feel the same. Your mileage may differ.

I guess if you seek a more Prodestant-like experience, possibly another local parish can provide that. They are all different as you may know.

As Cat mentioned in saying teaching the faith is the key, if people are being fed the Word of God, people will beat a happy path to the door. As a former Prod. myself, there were plenty of places that were different (ie.more charismatic, vocal, outgoing) but that doesn’t mean that God is honored less in places that are not so outgoing…

 

[Monica4316]

When I was a non denom Protestant, whenever I went to services people looked really excited to be there and to worship God. I didn’t always feel this way, because sometimes I struggled with things or just wanted to pray quietly. But I didn’t want it to seem that there’s something wrong, so I did what everyone else was doing… I raised my hands and sang out loud and smiled at everyone… I acted like the worship was a really spiritual experience for me even when it wasn’t. Sure, sometimes it was… but other times, I’m ashamed to say that my ‘worship’ was fake.

Now that I go to a Catholic church… sure people act differently… but I wouldn’t say they look sleepy, rather quiet and prayerful. We shouldn’t judge by appearances. There were times during Mass when I looked really ‘normal’ but felt so close to God and was experiencing His presence in the Eucharist. It’s just different expression

but if you want to witness to others… I suggest just starting with yourself and don’t do it to get attention, but to honour God. Here are some examples, which I try to follow…
always genuflect, pray on your kneeler before Mass, stay after Mass to pray before the Blessed Sacrament, sing all the hymns… but again, remember, we are at Mass for God not for others. It’s different than a Protestant church. Try to focus on the Eucharist, not on other people there.

God bless

 

[Monica4316]

I was an evangelical Protestant for over 40 years.

I think many of your Protestant friends realize that what is on the face does not necessarily reflect what is in the heart.

We had Protestant friends who could raise their hands, sing halleluah, cry for joy, and do flips down the aisle, but their lives were a misery due to sin and they struggled constantly with belief and real life. Some of them didn’t make it, and ended up denouncing their faith.

OTOH, we had Protestant friends who looked like dill pickles sitting in the pews. Nary a smile or even a twinkle in the eye. Yet they lived lives of joy and service to Our Lord and sacrificed many of the world’s “pleasures” to build up the Kingdom of God here on this earth. In private, they were peaceful and loving people who always built us up by their words and attitude.

I think that most Protestants realize that Catholics are the same way. The Catholic with the beautific facial expression may be thinking evil thoughts during Mass, while the Catholic with the sour face and dull eyes may be so enrapt in worship and aloft in the heavenlies that he/she is totally unaware of how they look to others.

good point

 

[tcraig]

yellowbicycle, I know what you’re speaking of … that something that’s often “missing” in a Catholic parish.

I’m a former protestant, a Methodist. I certainly didn’t have a “happy clappy” service, in fact it was more diginified and formal than the majority of OF masses I’ve attended (with much better music).

But there is often a sense of community at protestant churches that I have found consistently lacking in Catholic parishes (and we’re military and have moved a lot since our conversion).

Here’s my most recent example:

My mother (who is still protestant) just moved from another state. She attended her Church for the first time last week.

Since then, she’s gotten a visit from the pastor, has been given a pictorial Church directory (to “help you know who we are”) and has had one visit by a Church elder and a “welcome” dinner dropped off at her home.

I can’t even begin to count the number of parishes we’ve joined over the years, and our joining has merited nothing more than a blurb in the Church bulletin. No visit (or even call) by the priest, no welcoming committe, nothing to ease our transition into the new parish.

Does the protestant atmosphere of hospitality and goodwill create a different, more positive and welcoming environment? You bet it does! And people take it seriously to practice hospitality and goodwill.

I’ve yet, even though I’ve expended much effort, been able to get a successful woman’s committee together in order to provide meals to new mothers or the sick. Catholic women (at least the many that I’ve met) seem to have absolutely no interest in providing ministries of the types that protestant women do so well.

I agree that our Catholic faith is so beautiful, and I want to make more fall in love with it … but there often appears to be something seriously lacking in Catholic parishes.

It’s hard to pin down, but I know what you’re talking about.

 

[Monica4316]

I’m talking about this is a COMMUNITY, and what do I see? I see the back pews filled, and the front ones empty. I see people sitting so far apart, they can’t even shake hands in peace

maybe this is just your parish?

at my parish, the pews are filled every Sunday, and sometimes I can’t find a place at the front if I come later than usual…

 

[kage_ar]

Here’s my most recent example:

My mother (who is still protestant) just moved from another state. She attended her Church for the first time last week.

Since then, she’s gotten a visit from the pastor, has been given a pictorial Church directory (to “help you know who we are”) and has had one visit by a Church elder and a “welcome” dinner dropped off at her home.

The Protestant congregations are recruiting. They KNOW that person has choices to make, and they want them to choose 1st Congregation of the Fill-in-the-blank.

Catholics, well, we are required to be there. If we see someone new at 10 AM Mass, we assume they are from the Parish up the road or are from out of town or that they usually go to the 8 AM - we do not instantly think “new Parishioner”.

When we see a new face over at Coffee and Do-Nuts, that is the time to introduce ourselves, see if they are new Parishioners, etc.

 

[maurin]

It’s very simple. When you place yourself before the Real Presence, you know your place. At least if you have the Faith you do.

Big difference between a prayer service and a Liturgy.
The Liturgy is the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.

You think those on Calvary clapped and hugged while Christ hung there dying ? How about at the Sermon on the Mount ? You think when that sermon was over everyone erupted in a thunderous applause, singing “praise the Lord, and pass me a copperhead !” ?

now, I_Believe, be reasonable for once. If you were talking joyfully about the cult of man, everyone would be clapping your shoulder, and saying ‘bravo’. But when you talk about the Cult of God, all you get is the likes of me nodding seriously and saying, ‘thank you.’ Thank you for reminding me why I left the Novus Ordo and its diluted teachings.

Pray for the lifting of the excommunications from the Bishops of the Society of Saint Pius X, and for their integration into the life of the Church.

 

[yellowbicycle]

No, poor choice of words. I mean the enthusiastic stuff isn’t a Catholic liturgical principle.

If you understood me to be saying that you’re not Catholic, then I guess I got a tongue lashing that I’m glad you edited. I appreciate your forebearance.

No tongue lashing.
I don’t do that.
I was going to explain, (well, I guess I AM explaining) that I don’t want the liturgy to become clapping and hooting and hollering.
What I want is for people to not leave early.
What I want is for people to not arrive late.
What I want is for people to not play on their i-phones during mass.
What I want is for people to be so enthusiastic that, when it is time to sing, they actually sing, not stare at their feet. What I want is for people to be so enthusiastic that they actually recite the creed, and not just watch the priest do it.
And this is not at my home parish, this is when I travel. I see it ALL the time when I travel. Which leads me to believe that MY parish, where people recite the creed, and kneel, and !gasp! actually GO to adoration, is the exception.
And that makes me very, very sad.
So, you’re right then. Enthusiasm, the kind that I’m looking for, maybe it’s not a Catholic liturgical principle.
Oh yeah, I edited all of this out, because I already said pretty much the same thing in three other posts, and I don’t like to beat dead horses.

 

[yellowbicycle]

When I was a non denom Protestant, whenever I went to services people looked really excited to be there and to worship God. I didn’t always feel this way, because sometimes I struggled with things or just wanted to pray quietly. But I didn’t want it to seem that there’s something wrong, so I did what everyone else was doing… I raised my hands and sang out loud and smiled at everyone… I acted like the worship was a really spiritual experience for me even when it wasn’t. Sure, sometimes it was… but other times, I’m ashamed to say that my ‘worship’ was fake.

Now that I go to a Catholic church… sure people act differently… but I wouldn’t say they look sleepy, rather quiet and prayerful. We shouldn’t judge by appearances. There were times during Mass when I looked really ‘normal’ but felt so close to God and was experiencing His presence in the Eucharist. It’s just different expression

but if you want to witness to others… I suggest just starting with yourself and don’t do it to get attention, but to honour God. Here are some examples, which I try to follow…
always genuflect, pray on your kneeler before Mass, stay after Mass to pray before the Blessed Sacrament, sing all the hymns… but again, remember, we are at Mass for God not for others. It’s different than a Protestant church. Try to focus on the Eucharist, not on other people there.

God bless

Thank you for your honesty. This isn’t a problem at my parish. It’s when I travel. I see it everywhere. Which makes me think my parish is the exception, and the dozens of other parishes I’ve been to represent the rule.

 

[yellowbicycle]

The Protestant congregations are recruiting. They KNOW that person has choices to make, and they want them to choose 1st Congregation of the Fill-in-the-blank.

Catholics, well, we are required to be there. If we see someone new at 10 AM Mass, we assume they are from the Parish up the road or are from out of town or that they usually go to the 8 AM - we do not instantly think “new Parishioner”.

When we see a new face over at Coffee and Do-Nuts, that is the time to introduce ourselves, see if they are new Parishioners, etc.

But even if that person IS from the parish up the road, don’t you want to say hi to them? Maybe they are miserable at their parish and would like a new one, and maybe a friendly face and a wave hello would keep them. I’m not suggesting people start exchanging recipes during Mass, but…well, for example, there was a young girl at our parish with a baby. I made sure that we, with our babies, sat next to her. After mass, I told her how sweet her baby looked (she had eyelashes super models crave and big fat cheeks!! ) and we started chatting and I said ‘I know it’s hard to handle a baby at Mass, but I’m always here with my husband, so if you want to just sit next to us, we can always help you out.’ and she started telling us that her baby was out of wedlock (what can I say, people tell me all sorts of things) and she said ‘I think I’m not allowed to get my baby baptized’ and I said ‘NO! That’s not the case at all! Let me introduce you to Sister Margaret. She’ll tell you everything you need to know.’
Those two chatted, and over the months, this woman AND her baby got more and more involved in the parish.
So, I guess the short of it is PLEASE don’t assume that. Even if they are from just up the street, don’t you want to say hi?

 

[yellowbicycle]

maybe this is just your parish?

at my parish, the pews are filled every Sunday, and sometimes I can’t find a place at the front if I come later than usual…

That’s WONDERFUL!!!

 

[yellowbicycle]

It’s hard to pin down, but I know what you’re talking about.

I’m glad somebody does!

I wish we did more to welcome new people at our parish. I welcome them and I am VERY impressed with our priest - he really does know EVERYONE by name! There’s at least 500 families!
But, wow, people stopping by for a visit and with some food, even! She must have felt so welcome! For the record, people who offer me food are my FAVORITE people.
Not a bad idea…the wheels are turning…and I DO make a mean lasagna…

 

[yellowbicycle]

In any case, I’m concentrating harder on what’s going on at the altar and singing the responses and hymns than on what others are doing–barring babies, of course.
Argh! For the tenth time, I’m not looking for a pep rally! I’m looking for joy!
You are concentrating harder on what’s happening rather than singing? Isn’t singing hymns part of what’s going on?

---

As a matter of fact, at my parish people, including me, sing at the tops of their voices in a very reverbant, acoustically live church. (So live, in fact, a few fuzzy panels had to be put on the wall to cut down the echo.)

Singing the responses with others is part of concentrating on the altar.

My word! That’s wonderful! At the parishes I travel to, there’s nuthin. All I can hear is me.

 

[kage_ar]

But even if that person IS from the parish up the road, don’t you want to say hi to them? Maybe they are miserable at their parish and would like a new one, and maybe a friendly face and a wave hello would keep them. I’m not suggesting people start exchanging recipes during Mass, but…well, for example, there was a young girl at our parish with a baby. I made sure that we, with our babies, sat next to her. After mass, I told her how sweet her baby looked (she had eyelashes super models crave and big fat cheeks!! ) and we started chatting and I said ‘I know it’s hard to handle a baby at Mass, but I’m always here with my husband, so if you want to just sit next to us, we can always help you out.’ and she started telling us that her baby was out of wedlock (what can I say, people tell me all sorts of things) and she said ‘I think I’m not allowed to get my baby baptized’ and I said ‘NO! That’s not the case at all! Let me introduce you to Sister Margaret. She’ll tell you everything you need to know.’
Those two chatted, and over the months, this woman AND her baby got more and more involved in the parish.
So, I guess the short of it is PLEASE don’t assume that. Even if they are from just up the street, don’t you want to say hi?

You SHOULD say HI, that is what I said - just, not in Mass and not in the Church. Say HI in the Hall during coffee.

We have an old building, no “gathering space” and the parking lot is not the place to strike up a conversation without risking life and limb. Say HI, just no conversations IN the actual Church.

 

[LilyM]

But even if that person IS from the parish up the road, don’t you want to say hi to them? Maybe they are miserable at their parish and would like a new one, and maybe a friendly face and a wave hello would keep them. I’m not suggesting people start exchanging recipes during Mass, but…well, for example, there was a young girl at our parish with a baby. I made sure that we, with our babies, sat next to her. After mass, I told her how sweet her baby looked (she had eyelashes super models crave and big fat cheeks!! ) and we started chatting and I said ‘I know it’s hard to handle a baby at Mass, but I’m always here with my husband, so if you want to just sit next to us, we can always help you out.’ and she started telling us that her baby was out of wedlock (what can I say, people tell me all sorts of things) and she said ‘I think I’m not allowed to get my baby baptized’ and I said ‘NO! That’s not the case at all! Let me introduce you to Sister Margaret. She’ll tell you everything you need to know.’
Those two chatted, and over the months, this woman AND her baby got more and more involved in the parish.
So, I guess the short of it is PLEASE don’t assume that. Even if they are from just up the street, don’t you want to say hi?

Do you wander up to strangers in a movie theatre and start chatting to them, even during the movie? I’d have you booted out if you did that!

It’s called recognising the purpose for which you are in a place.

We’re there at Mass to worship God and Him alone. We have 140-some other hours of the week to spend on our neighbour. At least for that one hour we can concentrate on God undividedly, surely - with WHOLE heart, mind and soul as He commanded?

Your lady with the baby can wait until you’re OUTSIDE the Church at least, for heaven’s sake!

 

[yellowbicycle]

I don’t believe that I have noticed too many mopey faces. The people I see are enjoying themselves in some sense.

Bill

Oh good! That is good to hear.
I see people checking their iphones.
They aren’t interested in the liturgy.
Or eachother even.

It breaks my heart.
Catholics have everything wonderful about their liturgy, and so many don’t even appreciate it.