I'd like Catholicism more if it weren't for the Catholics

[yellowbicycle]

Do you wander up to strangers in a movie theatre and start chatting to them, even during the movie? I’d have you booted out if you did that!

It’s called recognising the purpose for which you are in a place.

We’re there at Mass to worship God and Him alone. We have 140-some other hours of the week to spend on our neighbour. At least for that one hour we can concentrate on God undividedly, surely - with WHOLE heart, mind and soul as He commanded?

Your lady with the baby can wait until you’re OUTSIDE the Church at least, for heaven’s sake!

Did you read the part where I said Mass was already over?

 

[yellowbicycle]

You SHOULD say HI, that is what I said - just, not in Mass and not in the Church. Say HI in the Hall during coffee.

We have an old building, no “gathering space” and the parking lot is not the place to strike up a conversation without risking life and limb. Say HI, just no conversations IN the actual Church.

So you’re not supposed to talk to parishoners in the church AFTER mass? I’m supposed to chase her out to the parking lot?

 

[LilyM]

Did you read the part where I said Mass was already over?

Even so you’re still in His presence, in His house - His Real Presence is every bit as worthy of respect (and silence) after Mass as during!

People around you are still trying to pray in thanksgiving for starters, and in any event INSIDE the nave of the church is not the place for chatter.

Why not at least wait until you’re in the vestibule or entry?

 

[kage_ar]

What I want is for people to not leave early.
.

They may have to go over and unlock the hall so your kids can go to CCD and the old folks do not have to stand outside in the rain. They may have to go to work.

What I want is for people to not arrive late.
.

Maybe they had to park 2 blocks away and walk in the rain. Maybe they were trying to get 5 kids out the door, maybe they just came from work.

What I want is for people to not play on their i-phones during mass.
.

Never seen this happen. Once I saw a teen texting… that was years ago.

What I want is for people to be so enthusiastic that, when it is time to sing, they actually sing, not stare at their feet. .

Those who CAN sing in the odd key that the hymnals are written in do sing. The rest of us, well, we just pray.

What I want is for people to be so enthusiastic that they actually recite the creed, and not just watch the priest do it…

where people recite the creed, and kneel, and !gasp! actually GO to adoration, is the exception…

These things are normal at my parish and at every parish in my area. Except for the odd grumbly teen or scowley older gentleman, everyone recites the creed. Most even bow during it.

We have 24X7 Adoration at our Parish, and the other Parishes have regular hours. Maybe it is the part of the country you visit?

 

[yellowbicycle]

I don’t think we should criticize yellowbicycle for wanting to “invigorate the masses.” (masses = people)

I think several posters seem to be mistakenly thinking that he wants a Protestant worship service feeling in the Mass. I don’t think that’s what he’s saying at all.

He sees people walking through the motions and questions whether they are engaged or on task with Mass. It is questionable, sometimes, whether the people in attendance at Mass truly know what’s going on or not.

As I have said in my other posts, we can’t judge people by their appearance, facial expressions, body language, etc.

BUT–I think yellowbicycle’s concern is genuine. And my answer to his question about “invigorating the Masses” is catechesis.

When people are taught and actually understand what the Mass is and what’s happening at the altar, and when they internalize it (not just learn it for CCD), then they are filled with joy and awe.

A year or so ago, Scott Hahn was a speaker at our parish. The church was packed–I mean football game-packed–no spaces, standing room only, and the standing space was packed!

The next weekend, I sat in my usual place in Mass (when I don’t play the piano), and before the Mass, an elderly lady that had never seemed particularly engaged in Mass turned to me and said, “Did you HEAR Scott Hahn last weekend. I’m so excited about my Church now. I never knew half the stuff he said. Now I understand!”

She was literally glowing with enthusiasm for the Catholic Church.

I think that the reason my husband and I are quite happy in the Mass is that as Protestant converts who have done a lot of studying, we KNOW what the Mass is and we love it very much.

So if we want to see people on task with Mass–I say, catechize them. Teach them. And watch them wake up.

That’s wonderful!
And I think you’re very right.
I didn’t really appreciate the mass until I had done some reading on it. Then again, I just didn’t go then
Scott Hahn is PARTICULARLY a good choice.
I’m so happy to hear that he had such a great impact on your parish.

He’s a gem to Catholicism.
You’ve given me food for thought, thank you!

 

[kage_ar]

Did you read the part where I said Mass was already over?

It is proper to maitain respectful silence before the Tabernacle, before and after Mass.

 

[yellowbicycle]

Even so you’re still in His presence, in His house - His Real Presence is every bit as worthy of respect (and silence) after Mass as during!

People around you are still trying to pray in thanksgiving for starters, and in any event INSIDE the nave of the church is not the place for chatter.

Why not at least wait until you’re in the vestibule or entry?

No, they weren’t trying to pray in thanksgiving. The place was empty. Those of us with babies were the only ones left because we were still ‘packing it in’. And all those people who weren’t inside praying were in the entryway. Even the choir was gone!
I thought the Lord would be pleased that I was welcoming someone into his house. Shows you what I know.

 

[kage_ar]

So you’re not supposed to talk to parishoners in the church AFTER mass? I’m supposed to chase her out to the parking lot?

The Nave is not the place to visit.

 

[yellowbicycle]

It is proper to maitain respectful silence before the Tabernacle, before and after Mass.

So, when I go and help decorate the church for holidays and I say things like ‘Put those lights over there, and these over here’ I’m being disrespectful? I have alot more to learn about Catholicism than I thought.

 

[Monica4316]

Thank you for your honesty. And, I just said in a post I made a moment ago, this isn’t a problem at my parish. It’s when I travel. I see it everywhere. Which makes me think my parish is the exception, and the dozens of other parishes I’ve been to represent the rule.

I think the reason it’s like this is because Catholics are required to go to Mass, and so you get a whole variety of people there…some who are really devout, and others who don’t care at all. In Protestant churches however, there is less variety, because if someone doesn’t care they just stop going.

I think that really it depends where you go.
At my parish, it’s actually pretty good… I’ve met some strong believers there, and it helps that I sit with friends who are great Catholics. People stay afterwards to pray in the chapel and before the Tabernacle. We have coffee and donuts time once a month after Mass which most people attend… the priests are approachable and friendly… there ARE people who don’t sing and don’t do anything, but all that we can do is just be good examples ourselves and of course we dont know people’s hearts…one day I just wanted to spend the Mass quietly praying along with the responses, etc, I didn’t want to sing loudly…but I definitely did care about the service and paid attention… probably there are others like this too.

btw, Have you ever been to a charismatic Mass?
I went once, and I really liked it… people there definitely did look happy and greeted each other, everyone sang the hymns and participated, there was a lot of reverence for the Eucharist and I had people introduce themselves to me after the Mass…

also, recently I went on a catholic conference (for university students), and people there were all really devout, there was again great reverence for the Eucharist and everyone looked very happy to be there.

I do see what you are saying about parishes though, I like the idea another poster had to meet other strong Catholics and sit together…this might encourage others to participate. I’ve seen this happen.

God bless

 

[yellowbicycle]

The Nave is not the place to visit.

Good to know. I do not want to be disrespectful. Thank you for correcting me. It is hard for me not to say hello to new people, but I will remember your words and stop myself from welcoming new faces.
Again, I appreciate your correction of my behavior.

 

[yellowbicycle]

I think the reason it’s like this is because Catholics are required to go to Mass, and so you get a whole variety of people there…some who are really devout, and others who don’t care at all. In Protestant churches however, there is less variety, because if someone doesn’t care they just stop going.

I think that really it depends where you go.
At my parish, it’s actually pretty good… I’ve met some strong believers there, and it helps that I sit with friends who are great Catholics. People stay afterwards to pray in the chapel and before the Tabernacle. We have coffee and donuts time once a month after Mass which most people attend… the priests are approachable and friendly… there ARE people who don’t sing and don’t do anything, but all that we can do is just be good examples ourselves and of course we dont know people’s hearts…one day I just wanted to spend the Mass quietly praying along with the responses, etc, I didn’t want to sing loudly…but I definitely did care about the service and paid attention… probably there are others like this too.

btw, Have you ever been to a charismatic Mass?
I went once, and I really liked it… people there definitely did look happy and greeted each other, everyone sang the hymns and participated, there was a lot of reverence for the Eucharist and I had people introduce themselves to me after the Mass…

also, recently I went on a catholic conference (for university students), and people there were all really devout, there was again great reverence for the Eucharist and everyone looked very happy to be there.

I do see what you are saying about parishes though, I like the idea another poster had to meet other strong Catholics and sit together…this might encourage others to participate. I’ve seen this happen.

God bless

The charismatic mass sounds wonderful! No, I’ve never been to one. I will have to look into that. I have been to a living rosary. Took my breath away. And I love love love the vigils. The babies can’t stay awake for them though

 

[Cat]

The Protestant congregations are recruiting. They KNOW that person has choices to make, and they want them to choose 1st Congregation of the Fill-in-the-blank.

Catholics, well, we are required to be there. If we see someone new at 10 AM Mass, we assume they are from the Parish up the road or are from out of town or that they usually go to the 8 AM - we do not instantly think “new Parishioner”.

When we see a new face over at Coffee and Do-Nuts, that is the time to introduce ourselves, see if they are new Parishioners, etc.

With respect, I think you are really expecting a lot to expect visitors to attend coffee and donuts, unless it is held in the lobby such that you can’t avoid it exiting the church. If you have to go somewhere else in the church building to get your coffee and donut, then I think most people will skip it, especially first-time visitors who don’t know anyone.

I have never attended coffee and donunts at my parish after nearly five years of attendance. It just doesn’t appeal to me. (I love donuts, BTW, like Homer Simpson!)

I don’t feel comfortable in those social settings.

I see nothing wrong with stating that a parish SHOULD be warm and welcoming to newcomers and strangers. The Bible says that we should welcome strangers because some have entertained angels unaware. Hospitality is actually listed in the New Testament as one of the Gifts of the Holy Spirit.

It is not a sign of holiness or deep spirituality to be so immersed in your “prayer” that you ignore everyone around you before or after Mass.

As I said in an earlier post, WE have to take the first step and be a more welcoming person. Honestly, now, that doesn’t mean dashing up to all the strangers in the church lobby, grabbing them, hugging their necks, and crying out, “Praise the Lord and bless your heart, honey, we’re so GLAAAAAD that you decided to come and worship with us here today at St. Curly’s Church!”

It may mean something as simple as smiling and nodding at people that you don’t know, or waving at people in the parking lot, or saying, “Hi,” to people as you exit the church. For a lot of people, that’s enough. It makes you feel welcome and warm and part of the “group.” It might be enough to encourage them to come BACK to Mass next week–wouldn’t that be wonderful? And if they aren’t Catholics, the friendly faces and smiles and waves MIGHT just be enough to convince them to at least study Catholicism and perhaps even join RCIA or a Catholic apologetics class or a Bible study.

Do you get the idea here that Cat is speaking from personal experience? Hmmm???!!

My husband and I were KICKED OUT of our evangelical Protestant church. I stood in the church parking lot, shook my fist at heaven, and said, “God, if you want me in a church, then You are going to have to tell your people to WOO me into church, because I refuse to allow myself to be treated so badly again by supposedly Christian people.”

Well, one of the main factors in our decision to become Catholic was the friendliness of people who attended Mass with us. One elderly couple in particular were so kind. They always waved and smiled at us, and once, right before Communion, I started to stand up so that they could pass by us, and the woman knelt next to me and said, “You don’t have to interrupt your prayer. We’ll just walk out the other end of the pew.”

Such kind words and action–such a simple little thing–would YOU call it PROTESTANT?!

Well, if it was truly a Protestant thing to do–it was the straw the broke me and caused me to make a decision to enter RCIA. I continued to kneel there and I started sobbing. I was so touched that someone in the Church would treat me so kindly. I was literally starved for the touch of Jesus, and this woman and her husband gave it to me.

Now what if that woman had decided to ignore everyone around her in Mass and just “pray?”

There is nothing in those hospitable actions that is irreverent or disrespectful of Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament or --heaven forbid–Protestant (gasp in horror). I’m sure that long before Protestants existed, Catholics were smiling, nodding, waving, and saying “Hi” to each other before and after Mass.

In our parish, hugs and kind words and actions before and after Mass (and sometimes during) are common. We see them constantly and I’m glad. If kind looks and smiles and handshakes and are Protestant, well–tough cookies. I don’t see how it’s Protestant to show love to our Christian brothers and sisters.

 

[Lujack]

I can see where YellowBike is coming from. Too many people look at the Mass as an obligation only and don’t take into account the fact that it is also a gift. Mass is a beautiful thing, and sometimes it seems like people are just going through the motions, or don’t want to be there. This isn’t calling for a dilution of the Mass, its calling for a celebration of what we have. We have a beautiful gift in the Mass, and we should appreciate, and, God forbid!, enjoy it.

Mass is a good thing, and people sometimes seem to refuse to enjoy it.

 

[kage_ar]

So, when I go and help decorate the church for holidays and I say things like ‘Put those lights over there, and these over here’ I’m being disrespectful? I have alot more to learn about Catholicism than I thought.

You are doing a job. You need to communicate with others to do that job. Last evening, I had to have a discussion with our visiting Priest and his interpreter about the mics for Mass, they were in the Sanctuary, I remained down in the Nave. did what we had to do, were brief and to the point, then, went to the Hall to visit.

Your Priest could remove Jesus from the Tabernacle if there needs to be a bunch of action in the Nave.

 

[kage_ar]

Good to know. I do not want to be disrespectful. Thank you for correcting me. It is hard for me not to say hello to new people, but I will remember your words and stop myself from welcoming new faces.
Again, I appreciate your correction of my behavior.

How about a friendly smile and a nod. Then, after Mass, outside of the Nave, have your conversation

 

[redrosetea]

Your heart is in the right place yellow B

 

[LilyM]

So, when I go and help decorate the church for holidays and I say things like ‘Put those lights over there, and these over here’ I’m being disrespectful? I have alot more to learn about Catholicism than I thought.

You are intelligent enough to know the difference between ‘visiting’ and giving necessary directions, so I’ll take it you’re not asking this question seriously.

Good to know. I do not want to be disrespectful. Thank you for correcting me. It is hard for me not to say hello to new people, but I will remember your words and stop myself from welcoming new faces.
Again, I appreciate your correction of my behavior.

Again, you have plenty of opportunities to say hello, both before and after Mass, just be sure to do it outside the nave (main body) of the church - like I said, in the entry or vestibule is acceptable, as well as in the hall.

 

[yellowbicycle]

They may have to go over and unlock the hall so your kids can go to CCD and the old folks do not have to stand outside in the rain. They may have to go to work.

Maybe they had to park 2 blocks away and walk in the rain. Maybe they were trying to get 5 kids out the door, maybe they just came from work.

Never seen this happen. Once I saw a teen texting… that was years ago.

Those who CAN sing in the odd key that the hymnals are written in do sing. The rest of us, well, we just pray.

These things are normal at my parish and at every parish in my area. Except for the odd grumbly teen or scowley older gentleman, everyone recites the creed. Most even bow during it.

We have 24X7 Adoration at our Parish, and the other Parishes have regular hours. Maybe it is the part of the country you visit?

I’m in the midwest. Major cities throughout.
You gave me good reasons that some people might be doing these things, but gosh, SO many have to go to work at 11:50. It seems very, well, unlikely.
And, in isolated incidents, with few people, I wouldn’t care.
But it’s epidemic! I see it SO often!
I’ve seen people answer their CELL PHONES during Mass! I don’t believe there are THAT many doctors on call in ONE parish!

24/7 adoration?!?! Wow! That’s wonderful!
Say an extra prayer of thanksgiving that your parish is so vibrant.

 

[yellowbicycle]

You are intelligent enough to know the difference between ‘visiting’ and giving necessary directions, so I’ll take it you’re not asking this question seriously.

Again, you have plenty of opportunities to say hello, both before and after Mass, just be sure to do it outside the nave (main body) of the church - like I said, in the entry or vestibule is acceptable, as well as in the hall.

I thought complimenting someone on their beautiful child was NOT considered visiting. So, I’m afraid I WAS asking the question seriously.
The entry is full when Mass gets out. It’s doors to the inside, entryway, and then you’re in the nave. And I have my own children to get in the car or stroller (if the weather’s nice) once I get outside. I’m afraid the brief moments when we are putting on coats is all opportunity I’ve got.
Again, thank you for the correction.
I will know not to speak to anyone before or after Mass.