If Abortion isn't a CRIME, what is it?

[PJM]

Actually it’s not legal to the time of birth in most US jurisdictions (and less than 1% of abortions occur after viability at 21 weeks in the US) and the courts have ruled there is no right to abortion up to the time of birth and that restrictions on later term abortions are reasonable.

And there are also not 9 trimesters in a pregnancy.

REALLY:shrug:

Then you can explain these two articles how?

liveactionnews.org/there-is-no-federal-law-protecting-the-preborn-from-abortion-at-any-time/

I hope and pray that your right:thumbsup: and I’m wrong

Where is the evidence?

God Bless you

Patrick

factcheck.org/2015/09/clinton-off-on-late-term-abortions/

 

[pensmama87]

To be fair to PJM, I think he meant nine months rather than nine trimesters (although it’s curious that we say nine months when it’s actually closer to ten.) Though the trimester distinction is pretty arbitrary, IMO - there’s just way too much going on the whole time to easily divide it into stages.

 

[PJM]

THANK YOU

God Bless

 

[PJM]

To be fair to PJM, I think he meant nine months rather than nine trimesters (although it’s curious that we say nine months when it’s actually closer to ten.) Though the trimester distinction is pretty arbitrary, IMO - there’s just way too much going on the whole time to easily divide it into stages.

I did:blush:

THANK YOU!

 

[PJM]

THANK YOU!

Loved my trip to Ireland

 

[Padres1969]

REALLY:shrug:

Then you can explain these two articles how?

liveactionnews.org/there-is-no-federal-law-protecting-the-preborn-from-abortion-at-any-time/

I hope and pray that your right:thumbsup: and I’m wrong

Where is the evidence?

God Bless you

Patrick

factcheck.org/2015/09/clinton-off-on-late-term-abortions/

Nothing in that article you link to disputes what I said. In fact it seems to all but agree with the data I stated (1.3% of abortions are after 21 weeks in your article). It comes to a different conclusion claiming that doesn’t mean they’re rare, but it doesn’t disagree with the underlying number.

The article you link to also points out that states are free to place their own restrictions on abortion in the latter term. As I had said, the Fed hasn’t outlawed such abortions, but it also has not protected them either and the states are free to restrict and regulate late term abortion. And in fact your article points out only 8 states (Colorado, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New Mexico, Oregon, Rhode Island, Vermont, and Washington State) have on demand abortion until term. The other 42 have restrictions in place on late term abortions, with exceptions for certain situations (typically the major exceptions, health of the mother at risk, rape, incest, fetal in-viability).

 

[PJM]

Nothing in that article you link to disputes what I said. In fact it seems to all but agree with the data I stated (1.3% of abortions are after 21 weeks in your article). It comes to a different conclusion claiming that doesn’t mean they’re rare, but it doesn’t disagree with the underlying number.

The article you link to also points out that states are free to place their own restrictions on abortion in the latter term. As I had said, the Fed hasn’t outlawed such abortions, but it also has not protected them either and the states are free to restrict and regulate late term abortion. And in fact your article points out only 8 states (Colorado, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New Mexico, Oregon, Rhode Island, Vermont, and Washington State) have on demand abortion until term. The other 42 have restrictions in place on late term abortions, with exceptions for certain situations (typically the major exceptions, health of the mother at risk, rape, incest, fetal in-viability).

THANKS for sharing!

GBY

 

[Della]

Nothing in that article you link to disputes what I said. In fact it seems to all but agree with the data I stated (1.3% of abortions are after 21 weeks in your article). It comes to a different conclusion claiming that doesn’t mean they’re rare, but it doesn’t disagree with the underlying number.

The article you link to also points out that states are free to place their own restrictions on abortion in the latter term. As I had said, the Fed hasn’t outlawed such abortions, but it also has not protected them either and the states are free to restrict and regulate late term abortion. And in fact your article points out only 8 states (Colorado, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New Mexico, Oregon, Rhode Island, Vermont, and Washington State) have on demand abortion until term. The other 42 have restrictions in place on late term abortions, with exceptions for certain situations (typically the major exceptions, health of the mother at risk, rape, incest, fetal in-viability).

Abortions have gone down, thanks be to God, but that doesn’t mean that it should be allowed to go on as it has been. I believe that a turnaround is coming in which the natural order of marriage and family will reassert itself and we will be deeply ashamed we allowed abortion on demand to ever exist.

G. K. Chesterton wrote a great deal about the natural order of relationships that God established, that we cannot escape except at our own cost. And we have paid heavily for our hubris in defying God’s order of marriage and family, and will continue to for a long time yet. Satan is laughing us to scorn because he managed to convinced an entire generation that their own offspring were a burden and an obstacle to “true happiness.” It’s the tree of knowledge of good and evil all over again, for those with eyes to see it and hear to hear the truth.

The judgment of God for this vile practice is going to be fearful. I only pray God have mercy on any laxity on my part that allowed it to go on so long with such terrible consequences for souls.

 

[Theo520]

Saw this on a blog and thought it might make for a meaningful discussion

Continued Blessings

Patrick

I’d say it’s legal homicide. Other examples are:

• death through self defense
• death through capital punishment
• death during wars

 

[Della]

I’d say it’s legal homicide. Other examples are:

• death through self defense
• death through capital punishment
• death during wars

But I hope you don’t mean to say that that therefore makes morally right? The others you list are rights–true God-given rights that do not violate God’s laws set out in the Ten Commandments. There can be just wars in which, even if the innocent are killed that was not the intention. And criminals who committed egregious crimes may be subject to the death penalty, but even that ought to be limited and rare.

Abortion, however, is intrinsically evil because there is no good reason to deliberately kill an unborn child. The Church recognizes that sometimes procedures need to be done to save the life of the mother that will inadvertently take the life of the child, but that is not the same thing as saying it’s right in all circumstances to kill the child in the womb any more than it is all right to deliberately kill any other innocent person.

 

[o_mlly]

It is a question of fact. In the USA civil law permits abortion so it is not a crime in our present jurisprudence.

In the eternal law and divine law, direct abortion is intrinsically evil.

Civil law which is contrary to the eternal or revealed law is not law. Any civil law that promotes evil acts may be ignored. The funding of abortion with tax dollars is anathema.

 

[ctb95]

Reasonable restrictions being “whenever you feel like having one.”

I think this is a question that a lot of pro-choice people ask to pro-life people: “Should abortion be considered a crime? If not, then what is it?”

OMG!

I didn’t mean for the first half of that comment to be taken seriously. I was sarcastically responding to a comment about “reasonable restrictions” on abortion.

 

[goout]

I’d say it’s legal homicide. Other examples are:

• death through self defense

The child is attacking the mother?

• death through capital punishment

The child is guilty of a crime?

• death during wars

The child is part of an invading army?

Clarification please !!

 

[PJM]

I’d say it’s legal homicide. Other examples are:

• death through self defense
• death through capital punishment
• death during wars

So its not murder?

The three examples you share; are you impying that like THEM, Abortion is OK because it too is leagealized

GBY

 

[PJM]

I didn’t mean for the first half of that comment to be taken seriously. I was sarcastically responding to a comment about “reasonable restrictions” on abortion.

THANKS for the clarification!

 

[pensmama87]

The child is attacking the mother?

The child is guilty of a crime?

The child is part of an invading army?

Clarification please !!

Right.

The issue is not just death, it’s why. We are permitted to use lethal means as a method of protection, but that’s against an aggressor. A child in the womb isn’t an aggressor, but mainstream discussion of abortion lumps these situations together all the time.

Children killed by abortion are killed only because they exist. Their existence is deemed inconvenient or troublesome. There are analogous situations, but they put the killer in a much, much less flattering light (think: abandoning infants, smothering an elderly or disabled person who’s burdensome to care for, or even genocide.)

 

[ctb95]

THANKS for the clarification!

Haha, no problem. Re-reading my original comment, I saw how it could be confusing. I’m definitely pro-life!

 

[PJM]

Haha, no problem. Re-reading my original comment, I saw how it could be confusing. I’m definitely pro-life!

God Bless you and THANKS

 

[Richca]

Saw this on a blog and thought it might make for a meaningful discussion

Continued Blessings

Patrick

Abortion is an unspeakable crime. It is the killing of the most defenseless and innocent persons of society. The direct and deliberate killing or murder of any innocent person is a grave or mortal sin, a grave or deadly crime.

 

[Theo520]

But I hope you don’t mean to say that that therefore makes morally right? The others you list are rights–true God-given rights that do not violate God’s laws set out in the Ten Commandments. There can be just wars in which, even if the innocent are killed that was not the intention. And criminals who committed egregious crimes may be subject to the death penalty, but even that ought to be limited and rare.

Abortion, however, is intrinsically evil because there is no good reason to deliberately kill an unborn child. The Church recognizes that sometimes procedures need to be done to save the life of the mother that will inadvertently take the life of the child, but that is not the same thing as saying it’s right in all circumstances to kill the child in the womb any more than it is all right to deliberately kill any other innocent person.

I’m only commenting on legality, not expressing a personal opinion.

Many people think capital punishment is intrinsically evil, opinions vary on what is moral