If climate change is real, is it a sin to do nothing about it?

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My main point is that CO2 redutions should be made where they make sense. Nuclear electricity generation makes perfect sense (the grid does not care where the energy comes from). That alone would be huge progress. On the opposite side you have airplanes: there’s really nothing which can replace jet engines.

Re: electric car, it quite quickly went from a complete nonsense to being viable (if expensive) for city commuting, so I’d just give it a few more years.

Then we have another CO2-free transportation technology, namely electric trains.
The problem with electricity as cars go is that it is great for stop and go traveling. But as far as highway driving goes (being in Texas cities are spread out) it is less than practical to take it out of the 40 mile range. Where gasoline is not good at stop and go commuting but affective at highway speeds. Its a catch 22 as of right now. You cant have one without the other.

I will concur that the tech is getting better but by no means practical for my situation here in rural north Texas.

DLG
 
Per DLG123 : “My family is in oil and gas production as well as ranching so I start off with 2 strikes against me.”

In my pots #125 and #130, I was telling Lynn (unsuccessfully, I see) to be on guard against allying herself with the eco-fakers and unscrupulous bad actors whose actions I saw up close and personal. I indicated that their actions, lies and propaganda result in authentic environmentalists having “two strikes against” them from the beginning of any debate like this one.

I hope, DLG, that in view of your use of the phrase “2 strikes against me” you didn’t take my words to mean that the oil, gas or coal industries, or people associated with them, necessarily were bad actors. That is not the case, especially not in today’s regulatory climate. Of course, the better known a company is, the more careful it is to be protective of the environment–it simply has no choice.

I fear, DLG, that there is no point in trying to persuade Lynn.
KSU… Jayhawk? or Initials?

I did not think that at all. I did read your posts but I guess the 2 strikes stuck in my head or great minds think alike…

The only thing to do is pray for lynn that God opens his/her eyes…

A little of topic… but the reason I had to put his/her above is my favorite baseball player has lynn as his first name and my neice has that as her first name so I never know if it is a man or woman…

Can anyone name the baseball player? hint greatest pitcher of all time
 
Let’s see, if adjusting your thermostat to a lower setting will kill your family and all your pets, then yes that would be a sin…
But only if the person understood that lowering the thermostat would kill them.

The issue is there are lots of people who do not understand that ACC is killing people, so there is no sin on their part. However, there is sin on the part of people who understand it is killing people and even tho they may be lowering their own GHG emissions, they fail to tell their brothers about ACC & its killing people – the sin then fall back on the person who fails to tell.

Some 6 or so years ago I was about to give up telling people about ACC, due to no one listening and everyone giving me back heavy flak. At Mass that week we had the reading about how the sin falls back on those who fail to instruct their brothers. So – sorry to be a pain in the ____, but I’m telling you, ACC is killing people and will be killing huge portions of humanity in the future if we fail to mitigate. If you have ears and hearts to hear this, then go to it and mitigate ACC. If not, well, I’ve done my Christian duty to you.
 
My family is in oil and gas production as well as ranching so I guess I start off with 2 strikes against me.
I also have some Texas tiny portion of a share in some gas wells, and it seems they are using some new tech to get at it more. I hope it’s not fracking…
 
KSU… Jayhawk? or Initials?

I did not think that at all. I did read your posts but I guess the 2 strikes stuck in my head or great minds think alike…

The only thing to do is pray for lynn that God opens his/her eyes…

A little of topic… but the reason I had to put his/her above is my favorite baseball player has lynn as his first name and my neice has that as her first name so I never know if it is a man or woman…

Can anyone name the baseball player? hint greatest pitcher of all time
I’m a woman. I guess that’s why I’m more concerned about life issues than economic issues…
 
I’m a woman. I guess that’s why I’m more concerned about life issues than economic issues…
But the pressing question? Can you name the baseball player that shares the same name as you? Great pitcher played for both Texas teams…
 
The problem with electricity as cars go is that it is great for stop and go traveling. But as far as highway driving goes (being in Texas cities are spread out) it is less than practical to take it out of the 40 mile range. Where gasoline is not good at stop and go commuting but affective at highway speeds. Its a catch 22 as of right now. You cant have one without the other.

I will concur that the tech is getting better but by no means practical for my situation here in rural north Texas.

DLG
The way I think about it is that most families nowadayus have 2 cars. One could be electric and the other ICE for longer trips. Bec we also have a business that requires us to have a van, our sedan is a Volt – which is the best of both worlds: we drive more than 95% on 100% wind powered electricity, the have it also from longer trips.

Or, we could have bought a Leaf for around town, then rented a Prius for longer trips.

I heard the batteries are already improving and within a few years, you’ll probably be able drive you EV 100 or so milies, then to charge it up at a service station within 15 minutes…
 
May I reply to this thread with an article I wrote for a newspaper a few years ago? Okay, Thanks! 😉

Global Conspiracy against Humanity

Bill Walsh

“Behold a black horse, and he who was sitting on it had a balance in his hand. And I heard as it were a voice in the midst of the four living creatures, saying, “A measure of wheat for a denarius, and three measures of barley for a denarius and do not harm the wine and the oil”. ~The Apocalypse of St. John the Apostle.

I think the most serious potential problem facing humanity is the one looming due to the combined effect of the radical environmentalist movement and the global governance conspiracy.

An unholy trinity of radicals, media, and politicians has been successful in disseminating the deception of anthropogenic global warming on a worldwide scale. This myth declares that “manmade” carbon dioxide is the principle greenhouse gas and primary culprit in the current manifestation of global warming.

Water vapor, however, is the major component at 95 % of the greenhouse gases that, thank God, keep us from freezing to death when the sun goes down. Carbon dioxide comprises 3.6 % of the remaining 5 % of greenhouse gases. Carbon dioxide resulting from human activity is only 3.2 % of that or 0.12 % of all greenhouse gases in total.

Considerable evidence now suggests that higher carbon dioxide levels are generated by global warming rather than being its cause. The oceans that cover 75% of the planet remind one of a crock of fermenting beer. Put a lighted match into the space above the beer and the carbon dioxide extinguishes the flame. The beer needs to be warm enough for the yeast enzymes to work. If too cold, they become dormant and the fermentation ceases. Therefore, the carbon dioxide comes after the warming, is dependent on it, and the oceans are the principle source of carbon dioxide.

I do believe that the world has been warming but that it is almost entirely natural and much politicized. The world is not as warm as it was during the Roman or Medieval Warming periods when grapes from Italy thrived in Britain and when the Norse established farms in Greenland.

The Roman and Medieval Warming periods were times when the living was easy. Food production increased, population increased, productivity increased, trade flourished, empire expanded, cities were founded, cathedrals were built and universities were established.

The cold periods that followed the Roman and Medieval Warming were, on the other hand, catastrophic. Snow fell during the summer in southern Europe. During the winter of 800 – 801 A.D., the Black Sea froze over. The year 829 A.D. saw the River Nile edged in ice. Throughout the cold Dark Ages, chaos, desperation, and continual warfare destroyed all but the remnant and recollection of Classical Civilization sequestered and nurtured in the monasteries of the Church. Growing seasons shortened, crops failed, people starved and disease decimated populations.

The current warm period began about 1850 and who can argue but that the human race has prospered and increased and multiplied as never before? Modern times are warm, comfortable and blessed with health and longevity to an unprecedented degree. We are on the verge of seeing this prosperity spreading even to the struggling populations of the less developed portions of the world. Optimism should be our byword.

Yet, on the left, the nattering nabobs of negativism are pessimistic. They see the prosperity and seek to sap it. They see the human population increase, multiply and strive for a share of the good life and seek to suppress it. This is exactly what the “carbon footprint” nonsense means. Call it “Cap and Trade” or whatever you wish but it will ultimately become a global tax on carbon, the physical basis of all living organisms, and the very stuff of life.

If we could eliminate all human by-production of carbon dioxide, we would reduce the population of the world to a miniscule remnant left to eke out a bare survival in the tropical regions of the planet. Their only carbon footprint would be a faint one made by the occasional roasting of a fish or other small creature over a campfire. Their only satisfaction would be the dubious notion that the world might be less warm by one twelfth of a degree Celsius.

I am, of course, engaging in hyperbole. None but a deranged few would want to see the world’s population devastated by famine but there is, on the left, a persistent push for global governance, against nationalism and patriotism and in favor of internationalism. Green is the new Red. They seek to impose global governance on us not by force of arms but by instilling fear.

The following article recently appeared in The “Daily Mail”. It is peculiar, I might add, that when the Pope says something disconcerting, it gets little ink in the USA. Here it is:

“Pope Benedict XVI on Global Warming as a Religion.”

“Pope Benedict XVI has launched a surprise attack on climate-change prophets of doom, warning them that any solutions to global warming must be based on firm evidence and not on dubious ideology.” The leader of more than a billion Roman Catholics suggested that fears over man-made emissions melting the ice caps and causing a wave of unprecedented disasters were nothing more than scare-mongering.”

How prescient was FDR’s “We have nothing to fear except fear itself”?
 
KSU… Jayhawk? or Initials?

I did not think that at all. I did read your posts but I guess the 2 strikes stuck in my head or great minds think alike…

The only thing to do is pray for lynn that God opens his/her eyes…

A little of topic… but the reason I had to put his/her above is my favorite baseball player has lynn as his first name and my neice has that as her first name so I never know if it is a man or woman…

Can anyone name the baseball player? hint greatest pitcher of all time
KSU… I noticed I put jayhawk as opposed to wildcats…

I hopeinge case is initials or that old familiar taste of foot will be my dinner
 
Hey, DLG,

Lynn Nolan Ryan may have been a great Texas pitcher, but I never cared much for his brand of steaks. I lived in North Texas for about a dozen years after I retired, but a while ago my wife talked me into moving out of state:( to be close to the grand kids. 🙂

Not Kansas, however. KSU are initials for something of many happy memories.

Which reminds me: as I said above, oil and gas industry people I met or knew about were solid citizens, for the most part. But I never liked the ranchers I met in Texas. Every time I scouted for and found a good pasture or cut field to hunt dove the next day, the rancher opened it up for his cattle just before I got there.

Just kidding, DLG, although that did happen a couple of times. I never met a Texas rancher I didn’t like; they all seemed to be good people who stayed close to the land, whether they had a lot of money or not.
 
So – sorry to be a pain in the ____, but I’m telling you, ACC is killing people and will be killing huge portions of humanity in the future if we fail to mitigate. If you have ears and hearts to hear this, then go to it and mitigate ACC. If not, well, I’ve done my Christian duty to you.
The problem is, that you are not alone in saying this, nor alone in saying the opposite. As of yet, I am not a believer, primarily because I do not see the connections with death (historically, raised temperature has increased life), nor a significant connection with Man, when the planet produces changes on a scale that diminishes our contribution. I look back over the past billion years.
 
I’m a woman. I guess that’s why I’m more concerned about life issues than economic issues…
I think it is good that you are. I did not mean from my previous post to diminish the importance of environmental issues, though I do not see it as a life issue on a global scale. Locally, I admit Man can destroy the local environement and cause death, and this should be abhorrent to all.
 
KSU… I noticed I put jayhawk as opposed to wildcats…

I hopeinge case is initials or that old familiar taste of foot will be my dinner
This was supposed to say I am hoping the case is initials… Trying to type on the iphone is maddening.
 
Hey, DLG,

Lynn Nolan Ryan may have been a great Texas pitcher, but I never cared much for his brand of steaks. I lived in North Texas for about a dozen years after I retired, but a while ago my wife talked me into moving out of state:( to be close to the grand kids. 🙂

Not Kansas, however. KSU are initials for something of many happy memories.

Which reminds me: as I said above, oil and gas industry people I met or knew about were solid citizens, for the most part. But I never liked the ranchers I met in Texas. Every time I scouted for and found a good pasture or cut field to hunt dove the next day, the rancher opened it up for his cattle just before I got there.

Just kidding, DLG, although that did happen a couple of times. I never met a Texas rancher I didn’t like; they all seemed to be good people who stayed close to the land, whether they had a lot of money or not.
KSU

I agree most farmers & ranchers are some of the best stewards of the Earth. They have to work with God and the Earth to get a bounty of crops to feed the planet.

I currently reside in NT where where you at?

On a side note if you are ever down this way my family has plenty of dove hunting spots. We have a place where if you are a decent shot you can limit out in 20 minutes or so.
 
But the pressing question? Can you name the baseball player that shares the same name as you? Great pitcher played for both Texas teams…
Absolutely not. You’ve heard of sports widows. Well, I was a sports orphan (both parents were zonked into it), and have steered my husband (who is from India & was a badmitton champ in school) away from sports…though I insisted we watch the Chicago Bears in the Superbowl in 1985 (I think), and had to explain the rules of the game to him, praying he wouldn’t get hooked.

And my father took me to the very 1st San Diego Chargers game.

My grandmother’s name was Neil (short for Cornelius) Fairbrother, and one time when we were packing up things in old newspapers in India I saw the name Neil Fairbrother on the sports page. It seems there is/was a soccer player (or some other sport) by the name of Neil Fairbrother in England (could be some distant relative).
 
…as I said above, oil and gas industry people I met or knew about were solid citizens, for the most part…
I have nothing agains oil and gas people (my relatives were into it). I was really happy with BP’s “Beyond Petroleum” ad, despite later finding out about neglected leaky pipes in AK and the big spill in the Gulf.

They have been providing a product that I have been using. We have reached peak oil and the oil hereafter will be more and more expensive to extract. We need to move on to something more sustainable (even if extracting and buring oil did not cause enviro problems).

It is our responsibility as consumers to strive to reduce our consumption of it, and there are many many ways of doing that without harming our pocketbook, our living standard, or the economy. We just need to pray and seek and solutions will be given unto us.
 
If we have really reached “peak oil,” then there is no need for all the worry. When oil gets too expensive or too scarce to extract, the market will price it too high for comfort and alternatives will become economically feasible and will be developed. It won’t require a national policy.

If we have not reached peak oil, and oil continues to extracted in abundance, prices will tend to stay low, though they will always be affected by international events, as will the price of any commodity.
 
If we have really reached “peak oil,” then there is no need for all the worry. When oil gets too expensive or too scarce to extract, the market will price it too high for comfort and alternatives will become economically feasible and will be developed. It won’t require a national policy.
You’re right. Environmentalists are not as worried about conventional oil (which is running out) as they are about coal, tar sands (bitumen), and oil shale. These could wreak havoc both in terms of local pollution and global warming.
 
If we have really reached “peak oil,” then there is no need for all the worry. When oil gets too expensive or too scarce to extract, the market will price it too high for comfort and alternatives will become economically feasible and will be developed. It won’t require a national policy.
Another thing that concerns me is that due to the heavy subsidies given oil, there might come a time when the amount of energy units (like btu’s) going into extracting/processing/shipping oil (like tar sands, oil shale etc), might end up being equal to or even more than the energy units we get out of using that oil. Right now I understand it is something like 1:4 or 1:2 for the tar sands (I may be wrong…I just heard it somewhere).

In other words we taxpayers could end up paying for a big fat boondoggle, that is not only costly, but also harmful to the environment…destroying potable water (which we cannot live without) and our agri-friendly climate and food (also which we cannot live without).
 

Many of the people who are most vigorous in denying climate change have no scientific training and so cannot make an independent evaluation of the evidence.
It’s not up to them to prove it is not true; it’s up to the advocates to prove it is. To date, most advocates appear to lack the same training and rely on fear instead. The only thing they have in the way of authority is name recognition due to fame. Some authority.
 
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