If I'm partially Cafeteria should I leave the church?

[Mickey]

I believe in staying put so strongly that I stay put even in Protestantism.

I may completely off base here, (and I usually am), but I have a strange inclination that you will be a convert to Catholicism one day (sooner than later).

 

[Contarini]

I may completely off base here, (and I usually am), but I have a strange inclination that you will be a convert to Catholicism one day (sooner than later).

Well, my Catholic acquaintances have been waiting for this day for ten years now. It’s not like I haven’t been close–I even was admitted as a candidate at one point and then got cold feet. But certainly I’ll never be able to dismiss the idea entirely, and my only justification for being Protestant is that I hope and pray and work for the reunion of Christians.

Edwin

 

[Mommyof02green]

As far as getting to church myself, I always managed to do that, I agree that it’s not that hard to get to church, but I also understand that for some people their lives are very exhausting, they suffer from depression or are undisciplined people and can’t get to church every week. Some people just have a very difficult time sticking to something by the virtue of their inborne natures.

It sound more like these are my values, this is what I believe, but what right to have to “impose” my values on you??? We all fall into that trap on many issues.

However, I think the key here is: Are this “my” rules or these God’s rules???

Also, we “impose” values and God’s rules in society already. It’s wrong to murder. It’s wrong to steal and society will even say it’s wrong to commit adultery. We expect our children to respect the elders and to show respect to those in authority (Honor your Mother and Father).

With that in mind it is not wrong to tell your fellow Catholic-Christian, hey you know that you need to go to Mass. We are simply living by God’s rules.

When I went to see the priest, he said that we go to church not to get anything out of it, but to honor God. I agree with that, but it’s also nice to come away inspired. He also said that even if we have doubts or disagree, that the Eucharist will fortify us.

He is right in many ways… and you are right it is nice to come away inspired. May I suggest the book: “The How to Book of the Mass”. If you ever wished the Mass were more exiting, this is the book that will make it exciting for you. click here for the book: How to Book of the Mass

As far as the birth control issue, it’s not a pressing problem for me unless I remarried, which I don’t know if I would want to do anyways. I was more speaking theoretically. We did use birth control a few times in our marriage (condoms) but then stopped doing so for much of our marriage, but we were having children and I did not mensturate due to extrended breastfeeding.

Fine, but I would still to the research on the issue. Do look into those links I gave earlier, do some more reading on it. Pray about it. Also this article might be a good read birth control

As far as going to confession, that happens to be one perk of the Catholic church that I alway found helpful. There are alot of positives of the Church that I haven’t mentioned. Anyways thanks for all the imput.

Amen!!!

Yes, the Old Testament has always troubled me in some parts because it’s full of bloodshed and tribalism.

May I suggest some of the Bible Studies done by Scott Hahn. Especially the ones from his Apologetics Foundations Track and Biblical Theology Track. For the Bible Studies click here.

 

[buffalo]

Why would anyone want to leave the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church Jesus founded and protects from error?

Pray, study and learn.

Practicing your faith means just that. Practice till you get it right.

 

[Mickey]

Well, my Catholic acquaintances have been waiting for this day for ten years now. It’s not like I haven’t been close–I even was admitted as a candidate at one point and then got cold feet. But certainly I’ll never be able to dismiss the idea entirely, and my only justification for being Protestant is that I hope and pray and work for the reunion of Christians.

Peace be unto you.
smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/17/17_1_29.gif

 

[RCCDefender]

I just wanted to say to Edwin that I thought the advice you gave to her was very nice. Especially considering that you aren’t Catholic yourself (yet - crossed fingers?!).

 

[tom.wineman]

Don’t leave. Come back.

 

[a_cermak]

By silly people do you mean those people “silly” enough to actually believe what the church teaches? I find it humorous that one who cant even bring himself to join the One True Church is lecturing one who has already left the Church in every way but name to stay put.

The people on this board are no more nor less the Church than all the people who attended Mass at all the Catholic Churches last Pentecost. In other words, what people on this board say and what their opinions are, is not necessarily the words and opinions of the Church.

How has this person left the Church? They said they have doubts. Not that they have decided the issue and that the Church is wrong. Last I checked, having doubts wasn’t enough to get you drummed out of the Church.

 

[mikew262]

I think it unlikely there is a Catholic on earth who isn’t just a bit “cafeteria”.

I suspect this is very true, although there is some that would never admit it about themselves.

My advice is too stick with the Church, even if you don’t agree with all of it.

 

[mikew262]

If you’re a Cafeteria Catholic, you are a Protestant or something else.

I totally disagree. Who are you to judge who is a Catholic and who is not?

 

[Stephen_C]

Off topic for a sec…

I just wanted to say to Edwin that I thought the advice you gave to her was very nice. Especially considering that you aren’t Catholic yourself (yet - crossed fingers?!).

I agree as well. Need a little less finger pointing and “what is your aganda for saying that” replies. Sometimes we need to take things at face value.

back on topic…
Being Cafeteria anything is not good. You need to grow. Just keep praying and let the holy spirit guide you. Do not settle, try and seek the truth.
May God bless you. You are in my prayers.

 

[fix]

I think it unlikely there is a Catholic on earth who isn’t just a bit “cafeteria”. At least it’s true in the sense that we all rebel, in one way or another.

I disagree completely. The term cafeteria Catholic intends that the person rejects the authority of the Church for whatever reason. We all sin, but not all reject Church authority. I think the distinction is important.

It is one thing for a person to sin, accept they sin, and seek confession. It is very different thing to sin, claim it is not a sin, and see no reason to repent.

I am not accusing the OP of this, I am trying to make a clear distinction.

 

[fix]

The people on this board are no more nor less the Church than all the people who attended Mass at all the Catholic Churches last Pentecost. In other words, what people on this board say and what their opinions are, is not necessarily the words and opinions of the Church.

It is not an opinion if they post Church documents.

How has this person left the Church? They said they have doubts. Not that they have decided the issue and that the Church is wrong. Last I checked, having doubts wasn’t enough to get you drummed out of the Church.

I would agree that doubts do not *necessarily *break full communion.

 

[wisdom_3_5]

Yes, the Old Testament has always troubled me in some parts because it’s full of bloodshed and tribalism.

I suggest you listen to Our Father’s Plan. You will be **amazed **and understand better the OT better.

OURFathersPlan

You can download it or listen at the computer. It is excellent and a good way to begin.

 

[Strider]

What about someone like myself who is questioning the Church on some things. For instance I think, I think it’s okay, I think. I suspect I just can’t believe, I also think. I don’t really think. I think. I think.

Do you notice anything, here?
True freedom is making the free decision to accept everything the Church teaches and do your besdt to live up to that.
“He who receives you receives me, and he who receives me receives him who sent me.” Mt10:40
Read the Catechism, slowly and carefully. Maybe the Compendium wouuld be a better place to start. They both explain much about the reasons for the dogma and doctrine of the Church.
Accepting the teachings of the Church, if you believe them, is liberatring. It’s hard being your own god…"I think, I think, I suspect…etc.
Also, a little self-discipline goes a long way.

 

[bankerdavid]

What about someone like myself who is questioning the Church on some things. For instance I think it’s ok to miss Mass just because of many things and it’s not a mortal sin. If you’re exhausted and want to stay home on Sunday I think it’s okay, since the original thing God wanted was for people to rest. Some people just can’t bear to leave their home on Sunday and they want to sleep.

I believe this is a question of intent. Also a matter of scheduling, since you can find a Catholic Mass at just about any time, not to mention Saturday Vigil Mass. On the question of intent, you should intend to attend mass every week. Sometimes things do come up, but if you make every effort to attend, but still fail, it’s not a mortal sin. If you “just don’t feel like going today”, that is a mortal sin. Solution-go to Saturday Vigil Mass, or find a mass early Sunday afternoon.

Also, I think birth control use isn’t a mortal sin. I look at it more as an ideal, but there are alot of variables. Some people are just so darned fertile, they have strong sexual desires. Sex is a strong instinct, but it’s just not practical to have alot of kids these days and not everyone is disciplined enough to be organized to do the natural way.

Someone else said that this is an individual choice, and this is true-we all have free will. God gave it to us. But to interfere with the natural process, with chemicals, is against God’s will.

I suspect that Christ is probably present when other churches have their communion. I just can’t believe the Jesus would not come to them too, even if they don’t believe in the Catholic Church.

Could be, if they acknowlege that “This IS my body” and This IS my blood". They also need to use correct media-leavened bread and grape juice do not suffice.

I also think that people purely get saved by grace, and that it doesn’t matter if they’re bapitized, and that God is easy going and doesn’t want people in Hell.

How can you believe God is easy going when he made the Jews wander the desert for 40 years before allowing them into the Promised Land?
That being said, it is again a matter of intent. Someone without knowlege of Jesus can still go to heaven by grace. But to deny baptism with knowlege of Jesus is essentially denying what Jesus did to save us.

another thing is that I don’t really think that the Old Testament is divinely inspired. I think the Old Testament Jews had alot of archaic and superstitious customs, and were to harsh in their laws. I think alot of those old Jewish laws were purely cultural. After all, they don’t even mention the Trinity in the Old testament.

There was no Trinity known to men prior to the birth of Christ. The OT is, to use a superficial term, mainly historical, thought the Pentateuch was divinely inspired-how else would the writer know that God saw the light, and said it was good? Much of the rest of the OT is historical and allegorical, and prophetic, and we believe the prophetic parts, especially, are divinely inspired.

No, you shouldn’t abandon the faith, just study it and learn the hows and whys.

 

[Pug]

Could be, if they acknowlege that “This IS my body” and This IS my blood". They also need to use correct media-leavened bread and grape juice do not suffice.

I’m not sure where you are going with this, but leavened bread can be consecrated. It is rightly done all the time. It is not done in the Latin rite, however.

 

[Ridgerunner]

It is very different thing to sin, claim it is not a sin, and see no reason to repent.
.

Maybe I don’t get around enough, but I don’t think I know anybody who hasn’t done that. “Cafeteriaism” is usually a matter of rationalizing what we want to do, so we do not have to admit it’s sinful. It’s practically the cornerstone of protestantism, but it’s hardly limited to protestantism. I have always understood that the Particular Judgment is an event in which our sins will appear in the full panoply of their evil. Sin is a remarkable thing. It’s like a stone thrown into a pool. It ripples, then rebounds, then ripples some more. We might make some cruel remark to someone at age 16, and that person hits his wife 20 years later because the remark, buried in his consciousness, still stings. Their child might see the blow and doubt the wisdom of marriage because of it. On and on and on. We might have long forgotten the remark after having decided that it was really okay to make it because it was good for the victim to be “taken down a peg”.

Life is so full of that kind of thing, I am kind of surprised at your comment. To a degree, “Cafeteriaism” can be said to be part of the process whereby we find a way to accept the unacceptable by constructing a world in which it is acceptable. The unacceptable, of course, is the sense of having sinned. St. Therese of Lisieux proposed that in the Particular Judgment, we see, for the first time, the full reality of everything we ever did. It is, she said, utterly devastating. We are then offered forgiveness. But forgiveness requires admission. Some, she said, find such forgivness demeaning of our inflated sense of ourselves, and choose, quite freely, to seal ourselves in a world in which we choose self-worship as the only means of remaining self-justifying. That world, of course, is hell.

That is why it is so important to develop a sense of admitting to “being wrong”, and to guard against self-justification. But again, I submit that all people do this to one degree or another. I believe Jesus said something to the effect that even the just man sins seven times a day. And sometimes that just man does not admit that some of them were sins.

 

[mommyof4]

Just this weekend, my pastor gave a homily on the rich young man. He related it to…Cafeteria Catholics, oddly enough. He did not say that they ought to leave the Church.

Remember how Jesus told the man that he lacked one thing, to sell all he had and come follow him? Anything that is keeping us away from Jesus, we should “sell” and go follow him. Anything you leave behind, mothers, brothers, houses, etc. will all come back to you, even more than you had. Some of the Cafeteria issues are hard and involve giving something up.

So you know where to look the parable up, it is in Mark10:17-30 abouts.

Wow - I never thought of that passage in that way! I think I like it…

 

[Denise_Shae]

Maybe I don’t get around enough, but I don’t think I know anybody who hasn’t done that. “Cafeteriaism” is usually a matter of rationalizing what we want to do, so we do not have to admit it’s sinful. It’s practically the cornerstone of protestantism, but it’s hardly limited to protestantism. I have always understood that the Particular Judgment is an event in which our sins will appear in the full panoply of their evil. Sin is a remarkable thing. It’s like a stone thrown into a pool. It ripples, then rebounds, then ripples some more. We might make some cruel remark to someone at age 16, and that person hits his wife 20 years later because the remark, buried in his consciousness, still stings. Their child might see the blow and doubt the wisdom of marriage because of it. On and on and on. We might have long forgotten the remark after having decided that it was really okay to make it because it was good for the victim to be “taken down a peg”.

Life is so full of that kind of thing, I am kind of surprised at your comment. To a degree, “Cafeteriaism” can be said to be part of the process whereby we find a way to accept the unacceptable by constructing a world in which it is acceptable. The unacceptable, of course, is the sense of having sinned. St. Therese of Lisieux proposed that in the Particular Judgment, we see, for the first time, the full reality of everything we ever did. It is, she said, utterly devastating. We are then offered forgiveness. But forgiveness requires admission. Some, she said, find such forgivness demeaning of our inflated sense of ourselves, and choose, quite freely, to seal ourselves in a world in which we choose self-worship as the only means of remaining self-justifying. That world, of course, is hell.

That is why it is so important to develop a sense of admitting to “being wrong”, and to guard against self-justification. But again, I submit that all people do this to one degree or another. I believe Jesus said something to the effect that even the just man sins seven times a day. And sometimes that just man does not admit that some of them were sins.

St. Therese of Lisieux proposed that in the Particular Judgment, we see, for the first time, the full reality of everything we ever did. It is, she said, utterly devastating.

Now that is a sobering thought. <cringe>

May God have mercy on us.

God Bless!