If the church was in hiding ...

[ParkerD]

i am amazed by these statements of yours. you believe these things but you dont believe that Jesus kept His promise that the gates of hell would not prevail against His Church. that His Church is still here. you know the One that gave you the Bible and you claim that she cannot enterpret it.

Wisdom Seeker,
As I have stated before, “against it” means “against this rock” not “against this church”, and “against this rock” means “against Christ, the rock, the chief corner stone.” The gates of hell will absolutely, positively not prevail against Christ. Christ holds the keys to the gates of hell, and will open them at the end of the Millenium, and the “prisoners shall go free” out of their prison, through and because of Jesus Christ, their Redeemer.

 

[wisdomseeker]

Wisdom Seeker,
As I have stated before, “against it” means “against this rock” not “against this church”, and “against this rock” means “against Christ, the rock, the chief corner stone.” The gates of hell will absolutely, positively not prevail against Christ. Christ holds the keys to the gates of hell, and will open them at the end of the Millenium, and the “prisoners shall go free” out of their prison, through and because of Jesus Christ, their Redeemer.

“So the Churches grew stronger and stronger in the faith and increased in numbers daily.”
Acts 16:5

“But the Word of the Lord continued to grow and spread.” Acts 12:24

"Then the Apostles and the Presbyters (priests) with the whole Church decided to select representatives and to send them to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas. Acts 15:22

“For from you the Word of the Lord has been spread Abroad, not only in Macedonia and Achaia, but in Every Place Your Faith In GOD Has Gone Forth, so that we need say nothing further.”
1Thess 1:8

“Go, therefore and make disciples of All Nations…” Matt 28:19

“And they continued steadfastly in the teaching of the Apostles and in the Communion of the Breaking of the Bread and in Prayers.” Acts 2:42

dont you see anything wrong wiht your belief system?
do you know where the Bible came from? tell me who has the authority in this earth to declare that the Church of the Living God, the Pillar and Bullwark of the Truth is not the Catholic Church?

 

[placido]

We differ profoundly if you think only members of the Catholic church do good in the world.

There you go, making your habitual assumption. Show me where I ever said “only members of the Catholic church do good in the world”. You cannot show where I said that and you know you can not, right?
To the rest of your post I will respond later. I am going out now.

Placido

 

[ParkerD]

“So the Churches grew stronger and stronger in the faith and increased in numbers daily.”
Acts 16:5

“But the Word of the Lord continued to grow and spread.” Acts 12:24

"Then the Apostles and the Presbyters (priests) with the whole Church decided to select representatives and to send them to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas. Acts 15:22

“For from you the Word of the Lord has been spread Abroad, not only in Macedonia and Achaia, but in Every Place Your Faith In GOD Has Gone Forth, so that we need say nothing further.”
1Thess 1:8

“Go, therefore and make disciples of All Nations…” Matt 28:19

“And they continued steadfastly in the teaching of the Apostles and in the Communion of the Breaking of the Bread and in Prayers.” Acts 2:42

dont you see anything wrong wiht your belief system?
do you know where the Bible came from? tell me who has the authority in this earth to declare that the Church of the Living God, the Pillar and Bullwark of the Truth is not the Catholic Church?

Wisdom Seeker,
No. It is founded in a knowledge of Christ and His saving and redeeming mission.
Yes, from the inspiration of the Holy Ghost to prophets who wrote down that inspiration, and to Christ who taught the truths of the gospel He wanted the world to understand.

Who? The Holy Spirit does. Christ does. They have that authority. It is Their message–it is not the Catholic church’s message, although an institution may pretend to “own” the message.

 

[ParkerD]

There you go, making your habitual assumption. Show me where I ever said “only members of the Catholic church do good in the world”. You cannot show where I said that and you know you can not, right?
To the rest of your post I will respond later. I am going out now.

Placido

Placido,
Here were some of your recent statements:

“He (the father of all lies) can also lead people to do seemingly “good things” if that serves him well in the long run. Atheists can do charity work; pagans can be opposed to abortion and murder, etc.”

“Yes, but don’t forget that the devil as the father of chaos and confusion can be driving power behind both sides … just to cause further confusion.”

“That is exactly how he wants you to think … that is part of his tricks.”

Those statements, and your reaction to an honestly told experience of my great great grandmother, led me to a conclusion that seemed reasonable to me about your point of reference for when people do “good things.” Perhaps you would care to explain further…

 

[wisdomseeker]

Wisdom Seeker,
No. It is founded in a knowledge of Christ and His saving and redeeming mission.
Yes, from the inspiration of the Holy Ghost to prophets who wrote down that inspiration, and to Christ who taught the truths of the gospel He wanted the world to understand.

Who? The Holy Spirit does. Christ does. They have that authority. It is Their message–it is not the Catholic church’s message, although an institution may pretend to “own” the message.

you and 35000 others claim the same. LDS, Baptists, SDA, Presbyterians, JWAs, A of God, and all others denominations agree in one thing, the refusal to acknowledge the CC is the True Church. yet, as Catholics we can point out to you who found your religions and when, but none of you can say who found the CC. why is that?
because you hold the Bible, it does not give you or any one else the right to preach the Gospel. it is fair to say that many of you does not care if the message is correct or not as long you can use the Bible as a pretext to claim authority. be honest and tell me, is this the plan of God? that so many claim to have the Holy Spirit to enterpret Holy Scriptures yet none of you cant agree not even when to baptize someone? all of you claim the other is false. there is no authority among you. do you know why? because Jesus did not give it to you. you all read the Bible and try to imitate the characters of the Bible but it will not work. the Bible cannot ordain any man. there is a live line of succession until this day in the Church of God. and no, the Church of God was never in hiding. if God wanted to hide His Church, it would have been before His Apostles had died. why would Jesus waited for His Apostles to die of horrible deaths and then hide His Church? please. come up with something better, would you.

what happened to the CC? it depends who you ask. this sounds familiar to you?

and no Parker, the CC does not pretend to own the message. God wills that His message be given through His Church, the CC.

now,

 

[ParkerD]

you and 35000 others claim the same. LDS, Baptists, SDA, Presbyterians, JWAs, A of God, and all others denominations agree in one thing, the refusal to acknowledge the CC is the True Church. yet, as Catholics we can point out to you who found your religions and when, but none of you can say who found the CC. why is that?
because you hold the Bible, it does not give you or any one else the right to preach the Gospel. it is fair to say that many of you does not care if the message is correct or not as long you can use the Bible as a pretext to claim authority. be honest and tell me, is this the plan of God? that so many claim to have the Holy Spirit to enterpret Holy Scriptures yet none of you cant agree not even when to baptize someone? all of you claim the other is false. there is no authority among you. do you know why? because Jesus did not give it to you. you all read the Bible and try to imitate the characters of the Bible but it will not work. the Bible cannot ordain any man. there is a live line of succession until this day in the Church of God. and no, the Church of God was never in hiding. if God wanted to hide His Church, it would have been before His Apostles had died. why would Jesus waited for His Apostles to die of horrible deaths and then hide His Church? please. come up with something better, would you.

what happened to the CC? it depends who you ask. this sounds familiar to you?

and no Parker, the CC does not pretend to own the message. God wills that His message be given through His Church, the CC.

now,

Wisdom Seeker,
I hope you haven’t thought I have been writing that “God wanted to hide His church.” God wants everyone to have His church and the truths of the gospel of Salvation through Jesus Christ. Christ called apostles to carry that pure and simple message of Salvation to all the world. People turned away from following the apostles, but God did not cause that to happen. This thread has discussed this very topic.

The book of Revelation shows that the dragon or serpent or beast were given power to overcome the righteous saints, but that this power was not going to last for the whole history of the world. The everlasting gospel was going to be given to the world by another angel flying in the midst of heaven “to preach unto them that dwell on the earth.” Just because God foresaw the conditions that led to the church going into the wilderness, does not mean He “wanted to hide His church.” He wants every person on earth to have as much light, truth, knowledge, and goodness as they desire in their own heart and are willing to seek for. The Bible is clear that God does want it to be sought for–not assumed to require no effort on the part of each person. Searching for truths of the gospel requires effort, commitment, faith, and seeking the guidance of the Holy Spirit through personal, sincere prayer.

 

[wisdomseeker]

Wisdom Seeker,
I hope you haven’t thought I have been writing that “God wanted to hide His church.” God wants everyone to have His church and the truths of the gospel of Salvation through Jesus Christ. Christ called apostles to carry that pure and simple message of Salvation to all the world. People turned away from following the apostles, but God did not cause that to happen. This thread has discussed this very topic.

The book of Revelation shows that the dragon or serpent or beast were given power to overcome the righteous saints, but that this power was not going to last for the whole history of the world. The everlasting gospel was going to be given to the world by another angel flying in the midst of heaven “to preach unto them that dwell on the earth.” Just because God foresaw the conditions that led to the church going into the wilderness, does not mean He “wanted to hide His church.” He wants every person on earth to have as much light, truth, knowledge, and goodness as they desire in their own heart and are willing to seek for. The Bible is clear that God does want it to be sought for–not assumed to require no effort on the part of each person. Searching for truths of the gospel requires effort, commitment, faith, and seeking the guidance of the Holy Spirit through personal, sincere prayer.

i guess what you are really saying here is that the Church is not really a Church that is supposed to teach people but it is only what people want to believe.

So, whatever enterpretation of the Bible you can come up with is fine with God. He will let it be. i think what you are really saying here is that there is no Truth. truth is only whatever you want to believe. for example if i say that there is no Trinity than i am ok of God. God doesnt really teach what He wants people to believe but God will agree with me on anything i want to believe. based on your statements, that is my conclusion.

 

[Bill_Pick]

Why do most protestants and Paker take certain books of the bible very much literallysuch as Genesis creationism Vs evolutionismm but clain that the whore of Babylon in the book of REV is the Cathloic Church, Why is one book teaken literally yet another not

 

[NDN]

The Catholic Church compiled the bible, in a council of over 400 bishops, in the 4th century. The Church was not in hiding, except from persecution from the Romans and the Jews, until Constantine legalised the faith. The whole concept of a faithful remnant who became the baptist is not history, it is fantasy. Where are the writings of the early baptist fathers?

 

[ParkerD]

Why do most protestants and Parker take certain books of the Bible very much literally such as Genesis creationism Vs evolutionism but claim that the whore of Babylon in the book of REV is the Catholic Church, Why is one book taken literally yet another not

Bill,
It is evident from Revelation 17-18 that the “whore of Babylon” has to do with commerce and governments that are self-serving, and with pompousness and arrogance. I haven’t said nor do I believe that those descriptions fit the Catholic church. But those chapters can serve as a warning to people about seeking to really love God with all of their heart and not to love outward appearances or the treasures of the earth.

 

[Bill_Pick]

Bill,
It is evident from Revelation 17-18 that the “whore of Babylon” has to do with commerce and governments that are self-serving, and with pompousness and arrogance. I haven’t said nor do I believe that those descriptions fit the Catholic church. But those chapters can serve as a warning to people about seeking to really love God with all of their heart and not to love outward appearances or the treasures of the earth.

I was think I seen you say the CC was a whore of badylon if it was not you I,am sorry please for give me.

 

[wisdomseeker]

Parker says that the Church existed only till the death of the last Apostle. somehow he came to the conclusion that after the death of all the Apostles, God could no longer keep His Church in Truth. so, God had to wait until JS was born to build His Church again. now we have the Truth in the mormon church.

the CC compiled the Bible so that JS could be the sole enterpreter.

like i said before, what happened to the CC? it depends who you ask.

parker has lots of talk but no history to back him up. no witnesses.

even though history shows that Christians were being killed throughout the history of the Church for the Faith, parker decided to believe that the Church was no longer here. they were just mere people that had no business in carrying on the Faith.

remember Parker what Jesus said: “no servant is greater than His Master.” hope you understand what this means.

we treasure the Fathers of the Church. do you know any of them?

 

[ParkerD]

Parker says that the Church existed only till the death of the last Apostle. somehow he came to the conclusion that after the death of all the Apostles, God could no longer keep His Church in Truth. so, God had to wait until JS was born to build His Church again. now we have the Truth in the mormon church.

the CC compiled the Bible so that JS could be the sole enterpreter.

like i said before, what happened to the CC? it depends who you ask.

parker has lots of talk but no history to back him up. no witnesses.

even though history shows that Christians were being killed throughout the history of the Church for the Faith, parker decided to believe that the Church was no longer here. they were just mere people that had no business in carrying on the Faith.

remember Parker what Jesus said: “no servant is greater than His Master.” hope you understand what this means.

we treasure the Fathers of the Church. do you know any of them?

No, but I thought the last pope was a good person.

 

[wisdomseeker]

No, but I thought the last pope was a good person.

do you know who are the Fathers of the Church?

:byzsoc:

 

[placido]

Placido,
Here were some of your recent statements:

Those statements, and your reaction to an honestly told experience of my great great grandmother, led me to a conclusion that seemed reasonable to me about your point of reference for when people do “good things.”
Perhaps you would care to explain further…

What about the fact that I did not mention the Catholic church? How come you include the Catholic Church in your “resonable” conclusion?
It seems you can’t stop making (wrong) assumptions.

placido

 

[placido]

Placido,
People use words other people are familiar with when they are trying to explain a concept that may be unfamiliar to those other people.

I am an adult person. When speaking to an adult, you don’t just assume he won’t understand you. You just talk what you want to talk. If you find that he doesn’t understand, then (only then) you adjust your language to his level of understanding. But no, the first thing you do is to first of all underestimate the level of understanding of the other person, thereby insulting his intelligence.

How difficult would it have been for you to say, “Parker, I am familiar with the fact that the LDS belief is that John was a translated being”?

No, it is the other way round. It was up to you to talk freely, using the terms you are familiar with. And if you find that I don’t understand, you adjust.

placido

 

[placido]

Christ was talking about hypocrisy, such as portraying one characteristic (honesty or sincere love for neighbor) when deep-down acting in a deceptive or misleading or non-loving, self-serving way.

Like you have been doing here, telling us you believe “this” but in reality you believe the opposite.

placido

 

[ParkerD]

do you know who are the Fathers of the Church?

Hi, Wisdomseeker,
I know Who is supposed to be the Father of the church, because those who become new creatures are spiritually begotten of Him and become His sons and His daughters, and He continues the relationship as they become sanctified through the Holy Ghost and with fire. He is Jesus Christ, the living Son of the living God.

Good people have lived throughout the ages. God will reward every one of their good actions. His plan includes all humankind, and not a hair of their head will have fallen to the ground unnoticed. God will reward your good actions, as well. Peace to you.

 

[placido]

We have not been having an honest conversation, I agree with that, because I didn’t use a term I thought you wouldn’t be familiar with and you withheld the fact that you were already familiar with the whole concept of “translated beings” in “LDS lingo” and that John was one of those.

Any deliberate failure to use proper terms is tantamount to deception.

placido