If you are a Christian, what is the real reason for you not being a Catholic? - 2

[Pixie_Dust]

If you are referring to ancient history, a lot of those are anything but “facts”. so yeah, its not gonna convince an anti-catholic.

I was referring specifically to Church history.

 

[Memaw]

Became an atheist at age 14/15 and was so for a year and a half until a Baptist friend took him/her to church and s/he mentioned in another post that s/he “got saved” just last September, which would make Blood Washed approximately 16, maybe 17 years old right now, if I’m doing the math correctly.

My point with your post was that Blood Washed, as a brand-new believer, would have no idea that what they were posting was the “Same old anti -Catholic nonsense thats been batted around by anti -catholics for many years” nor does Blood Washed admit to knowing much at all about Church history.

I’m not saying don’t speak the Truth, I’m just suggesting that you speak the Truth in love, otherwise, as St Paul says, we are “a resounding gong or a clashing cymbal.” The best way to get an anti-Catholic to think about their position is to ask questions, not bombard them with cold, hard facts. Setting them on the defensive immediately is just going to turn them away from Christ’s Holy Church, and that’s the last thing we want to do!

This was written by Bloodwashed awhile back, does it sound like a young kid? They know full well what they are doing and these threads are full of it. I have very little symphathy for anti-catholic bigots. If you try to tell them they are wrong about the Catholic Church they just throw more garbage at you. They just can’t face the truth.

Bloodwashed’s Post.
My reasons for leaving Catholicism have absoloutely no personal weight and are completely biblical. I was raised Catholic, and I became an atheist somewhere between 14 and 15, and was an atheist for about a year and a half. My baptist friend drug me along to church with her, and I got saved. Understand this: I /hated/ Christianity in its entirety for that year and a half when I was an atheist, and the Lord Jesus has changed me into just as much of a Bible-thumper as the young people who were raised in my Independant Baptist church.

I take offense to the statement that Christians are trying to do things on their own terms and not on God’s by rejecting Catechism. What are you going to do with the Bible? The Bible simply SCREAMS rejection of the Roman Catholic Church.

The main issue with Catholocism is that the Church rejects the faith alone doctrine. As my username states, I am a blood washed Christian. When I got saved, I got washed in the blood and my sins were gone. I don’t need baptism, I don’t need confirmation, I don’t need confession, I don’t need Mary. I need the blessed Lord Jesus.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. Ephesians 2:8-9

The Apostle Paul wrote that. What are you going to do with Ephesians 2:8-9? Those two verses say you’re saved by FAITH, not of works that I hath done. I’m sorry, but I refuse to take the word of the Pope over the word of my Lord who died for me.

I could write essays more, and I will if challenged to, but this is the major issue with Catholicism verses the blood washed church. And excuse me if someone posted this, but I wasn’t about to read all those pages.

 

[BloodWashed]

This was written by Bloodwashed awhile back, does it sound like a young kid? They know full well what they are doing and these threads are full of it. I have very little symphathy for anti-catholic bigots. If you try to tell them they are wrong about the Catholic Church they just throw more garbage at you. They just can’t face the truth.

For the record, I am 16 years old. I don’t know if you consider me a young kid, that’s up to you. And I would fully appreciate if people here would stop calling me anti-Catholic! I love Catholics. Both sides of my family are Catholic. I have tons of Catholic friends. I live in a neighborhood wihere 95.5% of Christians are Catholics. I DONT HATE THEM! I am here for one reason, and one reason only: To share the biblical plan of salvation that the heavenly father has imparted in my life with others. That’s it.

Just one more time for emphasis.

I am not anti-Catholic.

 

[Memaw]

Now I’m not sure if I’m clear on where each of us stands on grace/faith/works.

Grace/Faith: Necessary to go to heaven
Works: Only pleasing to God if done by someone on their way to heaven, and in no way necessary to get there.

Yeah, we read a passage of Bible and then have the preaching. But Jesus didn’t just recite scriptures: He preached on them.

I know Jesus said to baptize, but he never said it was necessary. If there is a verse that says it is necessary, it is probably talking about the baptism of spirit.

And as for all the Bible versions, I’m no scholar. I believe that the Lord preserved his word in the KJV, and that’s good enough for me. And when I said Bible-believers have always been around, ok you got me on a technicality. I guess maybe I did mean Baptists. Again, I’m not a historian.

Jesus said," NO ONE can enter the Kingdom of God without being born of “water” and the Spirit." John 3-5

The KJV didn’t not even come into existence till after the printing press was invented and Martin Luther did his thing in the middle 1500’s.

 

[JustaServant]

For the record, I am 16 years old. I don’t know if you consider me a young kid, that’s up to you. And I would fully appreciate if people here would stop calling me anti-Catholic! I love Catholics. Both sides of my family are Catholic. I have tons of Catholic friends. I live in a neighborhood wihere 95.5% of Christians are Catholics. I DONT HATE THEM! I am here for one reason, and one reason only: To share the biblical plan of salvation that the heavenly father has imparted in my life with others. That’s it.
Just one more time for emphasis.
I am not anti-Catholic.

I believe you, you appear to be very sincere and honest. I’m glad to see that. At the same time, it makes me sad because it is the honest ones who are hurt the most.
Son, speaking as a former independent fundamental baptist preacher (for 14 years), I can only tell you that you will regret throwing away your Catholic heritage. You’re being fed a load of manure from your preacher. Take my word for it, you’re in a den of vipers and the longer you’re in, the greater the chance you will be bitten. That’s a gaurentee.
READ, the Bible as it was intended, not from the point of view of your preacher. READ, church history, I gaurentee you will be shocked at what you find. READ what people other than fundamentalists have to say. The more you read, the less of a fundamentalist you will be.
You’re only 16? RUN, don’t walk away. Seriously. You better know what you’re throwing away before you do it. Don’t be like me, I wasted 20 years of my life in fundamentalism. You can read my story on my blog:
thetrailhome.blogspot.com/2008/02/trail-home.html
You’ll remain in our prayers.

 

[Memaw]

For the record, I am 16 years old. I don’t know if you consider me a young kid, that’s up to you. And I would fully appreciate if people here would stop calling me anti-Catholic! I love Catholics. Both sides of my family are Catholic. I have tons of Catholic friends. I live in a neighborhood wihere 95.5% of Christians are Catholics. I DONT HATE THEM! I am here for one reason, and one reason only: To share the biblical plan of salvation that the heavenly father has imparted in my life with others. That’s it.

Just one more time for emphasis.

I am not anti-Catholic.

Bloodwashed says: “The bible simply screams rejection of the Roman Catholic Church.” “I’m a blood washed christian, I don’t need baptism, I don’t need confirmation, I don’t need confession, I don’t need Mary. I need the blessed lord Jesus.”

He says he could write essays and I bet he can, full of the same nonsense. If he has all these Catholic friends and relatives, why don’t they try to help him. It would be very interesting to see how anti-catholic this young man really isn’t.
PS, I didn’t say he “hated” Catholics, (Thats his word)

 

[meandean]

No contradiction. I do not believe, and the Church does NOT teach, that it’s necessary to be ROMAN Catholic to be saved. The Latin Rite is one of several Rites that are all Catholic, and while it’s the largest and most publicized Rite in the Catholic Church, the Latin Rite **alone **does not have a monopoly on salvation. That’s all I’m saying and that’s exactly what the Church teaches. Anyone and everyone who is saved and gets to Heaven, gets there by the Grace of God.
I am a recent convert, and the little I know about both John Paul II and Benedict XVI (the only two Popes I’ve known in my life) is that they both are/were very humble men with a heart for serving the servants of Christ. I know from a brief study that not all the Popes the Church has had in the past were perfect, some of them were down-right scoundrels. What is amazing is that their actions did not affect the teachings of the Church. I know of one Pope (I’ll have to look up the name later if you really need to know) who had told someone prior to his appointment as Pope that, if he became Pope, he would change the teachings of the Church so as to uphold a certain heresy that was rampant at the time. Once he actually became Pope he refused to do so!

I could be wrong, but I’m fairly certain that the Pope is accountable to the Magesterium. Hopefully someone who’s been Catholic longer than I can affirm or correct me as needed.

heres the problem with those popes who loved to be scandelous, jesus said to watch out for false prophets. they come to you in sheeps clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. by their fruit you will recognize them. do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?likewise,every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. a good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. so how much of these corrupted popes teachings are you willing to keep?

 

[Memaw]

I believe you, you appear to be very sincere and honest. I’m glad to see that. At the same time, it makes me sad because it is the honest ones who are hurt the most.
Son, speaking as a former independent fundamental baptist preacher (for 14 years), I can only tell you that you will regret throwing away your Catholic heritage. You’re being fed a load of manure from your preacher. Take my word for it, you’re in a den of vipers and the longer you’re in, the greater the chance you will be bitten. That’s a gaurentee.
READ, the Bible as it was intended, not from the point of view of your preacher. READ, church history, I guarantee you will be shocked at what you find. READ what people other than fundamentalists have to say. The more you read, the less of a fundamentalist you will be.
You’re only 16? RUN, don’t walk away. Seriously. You better know what you’re throwing away before you do it. Don’t be like me, I wasted 20 years of my life in fundamentalism. You can read my story on my blog:
thetrailhome.blogspot.com/2008/02/trail-home.html
You’ll remain in our prayers.

AMEN:thumbsup:

I have a question for you JustaServent,
How is it even possible for them to put so much “manure” into so young a mind when 14 years of Catholicism didn’t seem to do any good for this young man. Are we not brainwashy enough???

 

[MelanieAnne]

I have a question for Bloodwashed ~ if baptism is not important then why did Jesus have John the Baptist baptize him? Just for something to do? Jesus obviously was sinless, so it’s more likely He was setting a pattern for us to follow. If you say you are following Jesus then why not follow the pattern He set for us in regards to Baptism?

 

[Memaw]

heres the problem with those popes who loved to be scandelous, jesus said to watch out for false prophets. they come to you in sheeps clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. by their fruit you will recognize them. do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?likewise,every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. a good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. so how much of these corrupted popes teachings are you willing to keep?

If what you say is true then explain to me how the Catholic Church has survived and thrived, for 2.000 years, with a line of 265 Popes since Peter, still teaches the very same doctrine that Jesus taught His Apostles , and has all 7 of the Sacraments, has Apostolic Succession for 2,000 years, is the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic church founded by Jesus himself. He promised HIS church would never error. No Pope has ever altered the Doctrine of the Catholic Church and no Pope ever could!!. We trust Jesus to keep HIS word and he has done that for us. Jesus prayed for unity. In the last 500 years or so since the protestant reformation, the protestant denominations have divided and divided into over 40,000 different sects. Thats not unity, and all because they think the Bible is all they need and they can interpret it to suite themselves. When will we ever learn !!!

 

[Madaglan]

Originally Posted by meandean:

heres the problem with those popes who loved to be scandelous, jesus said to watch out for false prophets. they come to you in sheeps clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. by their fruit you will recognize them. do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?likewise,every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. a good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. so how much of these corrupted popes teachings are you willing to keep?

Is it possible for a person completely corrupt in moral conduct to preach the Truth (albeit hypocritically)? This is the question at hand. If this allowed as a possibility, then you need to distinguish between what the person preaches and what that person is.

 

[Madaglan]

Originally Posted by Memaw:

If what you say is true then explain to me how the Catholic Church has survived and thrived, for 2.000 years, with a line of 265 Popes since Peter, still teaches the very same doctrine that Jesus taught His Apostles , and has all 7 of the Sacraments, has Apostolic Succession for 2,000 years, is the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic church founded by Jesus himself. He promised HIS church would never error. No Pope has ever altered the Doctrine of the Catholic Church and no Pope ever could!!. We trust Jesus to keep HIS word and he has done that for us. Jesus prayed for unity. In the last 500 years or so since the protestant reformation, the protestant denominations have divided and divided into over 40,000 different sects. Thats not unity, and all because they think the Bible is all they need and they can interpret it to suite themselves. When will we ever learn !!!

I can see you as a 16th century Jesuit.

 

[JustaServant]

AMEN:thumbsup:

I have a question for you JustaServent,
How is it even possible for them to put so much “manure” into so young a mind when 14 years of Catholicism didn’t seem to do any good for this young man. Are we not brainwashy enough???

Fundamentalists exist and count on the ignorance of their congregations.
I had 18 years of Catholic teaching. I can easily blame the KIND of Catholic teaching I had. But it all came down to the fact that I just wasn’t listening. I was looking for greener pastures.
He might be taken in by all the smoke and mirrors. Hey, the music is great!! Makes me tap my toes and get all excited for Jesus! The preacher? He seems confident as he waves his Bible and ‘tells it like it is’.
The problem is, it’s all an illusion.
The sad part is, when young men like him discover that, they walk away from ALL religion.
He better know what he’s throwing away before he winds up for the pitch.

 

[Madaglan]

Originally Posted by JustaServant:

Fundamentalists exist and count on the ignorance of their congregations.
I had 18 years of Catholic teaching. I can easily blame the KIND of Catholic teaching I had. But it all came down to the fact that I just wasn’t listening. I was looking for greener pastures.
He might be taken in by all the smoke and mirrors. Hey, the music is great!! Makes me tap my toes and get all excited for Jesus! The preacher? He seems confident as he waves his Bible and ‘tells it like it is’.
The problem is, it’s all an illusion.
The sad part is, when young men like him discover that, they walk away from ALL religion.
He better know what he’s throwing away before he winds up for the pitch.

Very interesting. A fundamentalist Baptist Christian missionary pastor friend of mine and his wife invited me to dinner. They seem to really want me to join their Bible study too, for me to give my (name removed by moderator)ut. Do you think they are trying to get me to convert? They are great people, very friendly, and my friend keeps on talking about how good God is and how God’s grace has been active in his life. It makes me feel guilty, because many times I fail to recognize God’s grace in my life.

What do you think?

 

[Pixie_Dust]

heres the problem with those popes who loved to be scandelous, jesus said to watch out for false prophets. they come to you in sheeps clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. by their fruit you will recognize them. do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?likewise,every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. a good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. so how much of these corrupted popes teachings are you willing to keep?

Ah, but that’s the beauty of seeing Christ’s promises come to fulfillment. Those “corrupted popes” never taught anything contrary to the Church teachings. They might not have lived the faith perfectly (who among us does?) but the teachings of the Church remained unscathed. They have/had to face God for the sins they committed, as we all will, He alone is their judge.

 

[MelanieAnne]

Very interesting. A fundamentalist Baptist Christian missionary pastor friend of mine and his wife invited me to dinner. They seem to really want me to join their Bible study too, for me to give my (name removed by moderator)ut. Do you think they are trying to get me to convert? They are great people, very friendly, and my friend keeps on talking about how good God is and how God’s grace has been active in his life. It makes me feel guilty, because many times I fail to recognize God’s grace in my life.

What do you think?

They want to show you the error of your ways, albeit very lovingly and well intentioned.

 

[JustaServant]

Very interesting. A fundamentalist Baptist Christian missionary pastor friend of mine and his wife invited me to dinner. They seem to really want me to join their Bible study too, for me to give my (name removed by moderator)ut. Do you think they are trying to get me to convert? They are great people, very friendly, and my friend keeps on talking about how good God is and how God’s grace has been active in his life. It makes me feel guilty, because many times I fail to recognize God’s grace in my life.

What do you think?

Yes, they are. But don’t hold it against them, they honestly think they are trying to help you.
In fundamentalist circles Catholic=non-Christian.

 

[Pixie_Dust]

In fundamentalist circles Catholic=non-Christian.

An online friend of mine, also an I/F Baptist turned Catholic, was told by her Baptist pastor that he would no longer be praying for her and her family, since they were clearly apostate and beyond any hope of salvation - just because they became Catholic.

 

[Madaglan]

Originally Posted by Pixie Dust:

Ah, but that’s the beauty of seeing Christ’s promises come to fulfillment. Those “corrupted popes” never taught anything contrary to the Church teachings. They might not have lived the faith perfectly (who among us does?) but the teachings of the Church remained unscathed. They have/had to face God for the sins they committed, as we all will, He alone is their judge.

The Roman Catholic Church teaches Papal Infallibility, but this is not the same thing as teaching that the Pope cannot and has never erred.

St. Robert Bellarmine, a Doctor of the Church, held out the possibility for a Pope to be a heretic, in which case the Pope would cease being Pope. Pope Honorius I was condemend as a heretic by III Constantinople. Pope Leo II agreed with the Council and anathematized Honorius. His case obviously was important at Vatican I.

As I understand it, the “orthodox” position of the Roman Catholic Church is that Honorios did not deliberately teach the heresy of Monothelitism.

 

[Madaglan]

Originally Posted by JustaServant:

Yes, they are. But don’t hold it against them, they honestly think they are trying to help you.
In fundamentalist circles Catholic=non-Christian.

This should be interesting; they know that I was Roman Catholic, but they don’t know that I’ve become Orthodox. Maybe I should throw them for a loop.