If you ran this country poll..

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Hi Flopfoot, i find it amazing you can say the hirarchy of the Church is like a good Samarition, when every Diocese in England ,Ireland, Brazil and most of them in the U S A , are being sued, because most of the hirarchy were like the Scribe and Pharisees who turned thier backs on the needy , you will say how do you know this , its because im helping people who the hirarchy turned their backs on yours michaelmac
 
Hi ComradeAndrei before you try to insult some one i suggest you read the good Samaritian , till your like the Good Samaritian you will never be a Christian yours michaelmac
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Insult? Wow…I carefully worded my statement in order that one could not misinterpret it as an insult but I guess I failed. :rolleyes:
Hi ComradeAndrei the Catholic church does a better job than i , in shooting it self in the foot or head,
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OK…?
after reading the Good Samaritian ,tell me how many of the hirarchy of the church can claim to be Christian , I question every thing to find out the truth . I read and ask questions , I have a problem with trust because of my childhood , so I question every thing yours michaelmac
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You might want to do a little research and see for yourself how much charitable work the Catholic Church does around the world, and how much charitable work the Catholic Church has done in the past. The Church is the foundation of charitible work!

What specifically does the hierarchy do that is not in line with the Good Samaritan (assuming you understand it correctly)?
ps I did not get an EDUCATION like most people so im learning all the time
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That is fine, but then don’t come harping on the Catholic Church like you know it all. The Church has produced some of the finest minds that have ever lived, men and women of which I freely admit that I cannot hold a candle to. I always find it odd when your average Joe thinks he can prove the Church wrong, as if the “problem” he has with the Church hasn’t been dealt with by the Church at sometime in the past 2000 yrs. by these same men and women of great intellectual ability and saintly disposition.
Hi Flopfoot, i find it amazing you can say the hirarchy of the Church is like a good Samarition, when every Diocese in England ,Ireland, Brazil and most of them in the U S A , are being sued, because most of the hirarchy were like the Scribe and Pharisees who turned thier backs on the needy , you will say how do you know this , its because im helping people who the hirarchy turned their backs on yours michaelmac
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That is a pretty general blanket statement, and something I’d challenge you to back up with any sort of facts.

So, what praytell do you think that the hierarchy of the Catholic Church should do in order to be “good Samaritans”?
 
Hi ComradeAndrei ,what would you call turning your back on the welfare of children, what do you call using children as slaves ,what would you call using girls and women as slaves up to 1996 in Ireland , what would call allowing children to be sexualy abused , then lieing about it and promoting those who covered up the abuse , every bishop in Ireland covered up abuse in every Diocese, most bishops archbishops and Cardinals in the U S A COVERED UP ABUSE, these are FACTs, not fiction, there is a picture of a Cardinal in the Cathedral in London England , who covered up abuse , any more facts yours michaelmac
 
Hi all Which English Diocese has gone to the high Court today , to try to use the statute of limitations to stop it paying compansation to victims of abuse, and to make sure victims cannot get any reddress for the abuse they suffered yours michaelmac
 
Hi ComradeAndrei ,what would you call turning your back on the welfare of children,
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I would call it another one of your baseless assertions. Care to point out in the Catechism that it teaches that the Church deems it right to “turn our backs on the welfare of children”?
what do you call using children as slaves ,what would you call using girls and women as slaves up to 1996 in Ireland
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So, all those bulls and encylicals the popes have issued throughout the centuries were in fact supporting slavery? We are the only Church that seriously opposed slavery. Read this users.binary.net/polycarp/slave.html
what would call allowing children to be sexualy abused , then lieing about it and promoting those who covered up the abuse , every bishop in Ireland covered up abuse in every Diocese, most bishops archbishops and Cardinals in the U S A COVERED UP ABUSE, these are FACTs, not fiction, there is a picture of a Cardinal in the Cathedral in London England , who covered up abuse,
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Seems like we like to play armchair bishop. There is something called charity, and there is also something that says that we can’t judge people. How do you know that these men purposely and maliciously hid abuse? We are all weak human beings, and maybe some bishops didn’t live up to the high expectations of their office. When one judges the hearts of others, they put themselves in the same boat. Judge not lest ye be judged.

Furthermore, it is certainly true that there are sinners in the Church. The Church is a hospital for sinners, not a museum for saints. That is the way it was and always will be. Jesus Himself chose Judas as one of His apostles, knowing full well that he would betray Him. There have been bad bishops, there have been weak bishops and there have been strong and saintly bishops. Nothing changes the fact that the Catholic Church alone is the One, Holy, Universal and Apostolic Church set up by Christ Himself and that Christ promised us that the gates of hell shall never prevail against it.
any more facts yours michaelmac
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Generally facts entail sources, not assertions and spin. Nothing you’ve said proves that the Church is wrong or false, all you prove is the very thing we admit-that there are sinners in the Church. That does not take away from the fact that it is the True Church.

It seems you are of the type that blames the Church for every failure of humanity. If your faith is too weak to see the bigger picture and not get hung up on details, I sincerely pray for you. If you just have questions, I also pray for you. However, do not fall into the same sin you accuse others of.
Hi all Which English Diocese has gone to the high Court today , to try to use the statute of limitations to stop it paying compansation to victims of abuse, and to make sure victims cannot get any reddress for the abuse they suffered yours michaelmac
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So, the whole diocese should go broke and everything will be fine and dandy if the victims get lotsa cash? That is just rediculous. A fair secular “Compensation” would be for the perpetrator of the abuse to get his proper punishment and if one could actually prove that the bishop or diocese was truly responsible for maliciously protecting and inabling abusers then they should be held responsible for treatment costs, etc. However, nothing justifies bankrupting a diocese and depriving the faithful of its ministry.

The big payouts are because of greedy lawyers smelling blood in the water and dare I say stubborn victims who are out for revenge. Neither is justifiable.
 
Hi ComradeAndrei , i know the person in this court case , he was given a small some of money, the court case was not about money ,it was about accountability , what was wrong about saying the hirarchy turned their backs on children, how did children get abused then, get your self a copy of the inquiry into the Diocese of Ferns Ireland , get the reports into the inquiry into the Diocese of Dublin Ireland when it starts , Write to every Diocesen office in England and ask why their being sued, I KNOW WHY , I also know he will win the court case and why, remember do not judge a book by its cover , one thing when i talk about slavery and the Catholic church, i know what im talking about , yours michaelmac
 
one thing when i talk about slavery and the Catholic church, i know what im talking about
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Sure…did you read over the site I posted?

As to the whole abuse thing, that still doesn’t prove that the Catholic Church isn’t the True Church-the only True Faith and only True Religion.
 
Hi ComradeAdrei Generally facts entail sources, not assertions and spin. Nothing you’ve said
proves that the Church is wrong or false, all you prove is the very thing we
admit-that there are sinners in the Church. That does not take away from the
fact that it is the True Church.
I HAVE QUOTED YOU HERE FOR ONE REASON, to show you your arrogance. has destroyed your credability , when the hirarchy of the Church world wide , have gone against Christs teaching, even those in the Vatican and all their words does not make it true, i suggest you read up on TORTURE, till the faithful get rid of those who are in charge of the Church who are involved in torture , if the faithful refuse to speak out and do some thing ,their actions back torture ,i am talking about basic human rights , if i use the human rights act from the U N ,I CAN PROVE EVEN THE POPE IS INVOLVED IN TORTURE, AND THERE IS NO DEFENCE AGAINST USING TORTURE , YOURS MICHAEL MCMANUS
 
I HAVE QUOTED YOU HERE FOR ONE REASON, to show you your arrogance. has destroyed your credability,
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What else did I say? That the Church is the hospital of sinners, thus there will be problems and things that “make us look bad”. However, I take heart in the Word of God when He says that “hell shall not prevail against it (the Church)” and that He will send His Spirit to be with us, even until the end of time.
when the hirarchy of the Church world wide , have gone against Christs teaching,
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OK, so who says they’ve (and we’ve) gone against Christ’s teaching? You? Now who’s being arrogant?
even those in the Vatican and all their words does not make it true,
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Again, who says? You?
i suggest you read up on TORTURE,
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I have. The Church roundly condemns it.
till the faithful get rid of those who are in charge of the Church who are involved in torture
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First of all, the faithful cannot “get rid of those in charge”-God has chosen them to fulfill their respective offices. The Church is not a democracy-Deo Gratias!
if the faithful refuse to speak out and do some thing ,their actions back torture,
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What is this “torture” nonsense?
i am talking about basic human rights , if i use the human rights act from the U N
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Oh, the UN…the secular humanist UN…what a hoot! :rolleyes: I’m talking about salvation…
I CAN PROVE EVEN THE POPE IS INVOLVED IN TORTURE, AND THERE IS NO DEFENCE AGAINST USING TORTURE
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Go ahead, make my day. :rolleyes: If I use the Catechism and the Bible, I can “prove” that you are in serious need of an attitude adjustment.
 
Hi ComradeAndrei, the Church might condemn TORTURE AND SLAVERY ,ONLY IT DOES NOT MEAN THEY ARE NOT INVOLED IN THE PRACTICE , SLAVERY , MAKING SOME ONE WORK FOR NOTHING , A TEN HOUR DAY OR MORE AND REFUSING TO FEED THEM PROPERLY ,WHEN THIS WAS EXPOSED THE CARDINAL, NOW POPE SAID THIS WAS LIES , TO DENY THE TRUTH IS TORTURE OF THOSE WHO SUFFERED , TO DENY THE ABUSE OF CHILDREN AND THE COVERUP WORLD WIDE , AND ATTACK THE VICTIMS WHEN THEY WANT HELP THIS IS TORTURE, TO PROMOTE THOSE WHOSE ACTIONS LEAD TO CHILDREN BEING SEXUALY ABUSED IS TORTURE ,IS TORTURE OF THE ABUSE VICTIMS , YOU SAY I HAVE AN ATTITUDE PROBLEM, I HAVE THATS BECAUSE THREE 3 SIBLINGS YOU KNOW BROTHERS AND SISTERS COMMITED SUICIED, BECAUSE THEY WERE SEXUALY ABUSED AND SO WAS I , I KNOW WHAT TORTURE IS DO YOU YOURS MICHAEL MCMANUS
 
hI ComradeAndrei, to answer another question of yours or quote the Church will not be entered from out side no it will not, it will be destroyed from within , by actions of those who claim to be Christian and are not , yours michael mcmanus
 
Hi ComradeAndrei, the Church might condemn TORTURE AND SLAVERY ,ONLY IT DOES NOT MEAN THEY ARE NOT INVOLED IN THE PRACTICE,
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Give me a concrete example of how the Church is involved in “slavery” or “torture”.
SLAVERY , MAKING SOME ONE WORK FOR NOTHING , A TEN HOUR DAY OR MORE AND REFUSING TO FEED THEM PROPERLY ,WHEN THIS WAS EXPOSED THE CARDINAL, NOW POPE SAID THIS WAS LIES,
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“When this was exposed”-what was exposed, praytell?
TO DENY THE TRUTH IS TORTURE OF THOSE WHO SUFFERED,
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Do defend the truth against baseless accusations is to protect the honor of the Church and the Faithful from assine scandal.
TO DENY THE ABUSE OF CHILDREN AND THE COVERUP WORLD WIDE,
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Sexual abuse perpetrated by priests is very rare, protestant minister, professionals in other fields etc. have higher rates of this sort of abuse.
AND ATTACK THE VICTIMS WHEN THEY WANT HELP THIS IS TORTURE, TO PROMOTE THOSE WHOSE ACTIONS LEAD TO CHILDREN BEING SEXUALY ABUSED IS TORTURE ,IS TORTURE OF THE ABUSE VICTIMS
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Attack? Nope. However, we must diligently inquire into the truthfulness of the matter. I will not accept an accusation at face value. Furthermore, when some victims go after the Church financially that is not right. Two wrongs don’t make a right.
YOU SAY I HAVE AN ATTITUDE PROBLEM, I HAVE THATS BECAUSE THREE 3 SIBLINGS YOU KNOW BROTHERS AND SISTERS COMMITED SUICIED, BECAUSE THEY WERE SEXUALY ABUSED AND SO WAS I , I KNOW WHAT TORTURE IS DO YOU YOURS MICHAEL MCMANUS
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I’m sorry, but that still says nothing about the truthfulness of Christ’s Church. It is not the Church’s fault that these kind of things happen. Do you think that the Church is superman or something? The Pope can’t be looking over everyone’s shoulder at every moment of every day.
hI ComradeAndrei, to answer another question of yours or quote the Church will not be entered from out side no it will not, it will be destroyed from within , by actions of those who claim to be Christian and are not , yours michael mcmanus
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The Church will never be destroyed-from without or from within-that would make Christ a liar.
 
Hi ComradeAndrei , you want proof of those who coveredup abuse promoted ,one the leader of the church in England and Wales , two got Rome ask who is the head of ST Marys Major Bascilica , both were friends of THE LAST POPE, when you call people liars who are victims of abuse and slavery ,which you are doing, your no different THAN there abusers , did you go to the web site of the Catholic diocese of Dublin and see how many priests who have abused children are on it, this is from the Archbishop of Dublin 102 priests ,only there is no mention of the orders of brothers and nuns who were involved in slavery , every diocese in Ireland has admited they coveredup abuse ,this come out after the end of the Diocese of Ferns inquiry in Ireland , when my friend who were abused in Ireland , see words like Christian , Mercy and Charity ,it reminds them which orders of Catholics brothers and nuns who abused them , if i was a member of the Catholic church and some one wrote , members of my faith were involved in slavery and the coverup of abuse of children , i would not attack the sender of the messege , i would do my upmost to find out if what was being writen is true or false , not to do this and accuse the sender of the messege of falsehoods , shows the person does not believe in the truth or want to , one very simple question for you , why did the Catholic church open a retreat in Stroud in 1959 where abuseive ptriests where sent and not tell the POLICE ABOUT THESE PRIESTS, CAN YOU TELL ME HOW THIS IS NOT COVERING UP ABUSE YOURS MICHAEL MCMANUS, PS WHEN WE ALLOW A LIE TO STAND AS THE TRUTH, WE TELL VICTIMS OF ABUSE THEY ARE NOTHING
 
Hi ComradeAndrei this next article is from the head of the Archdiocese of Dublin,CATHOLIC CHURCH IN IRELAND ADMITS HOW BAD CHILD ABUSE BECAME
Written by Administrator
Friday, 10 March 2006
The Catholic Church in Ireland made its biggest admission yet: 102 of its Dublin priests, past and present or 3.6 % of the total are suspected of sexually abusing children. This disclosure comes a week before the government convenes an investigation into how the church and state authorities conspired by negligence and design, to covert up decades of child abuse within the Dublin priesthood.

The church will have to sell its property to pay the bills for at lest 40 lawsuits and potential claims from hundreds more. The government probe will follow the same methods used when they investigated abuse by clergy in the diocese of Ferns where the government exposed a catalog of abuse, including a priest who molested a group of First Communion girls on the altar but was never punish.

“The vast majority of priests don’t abuse, they do good work, they’re extremely upset and offended by what’s happened,” states Archbishop Diamuid Martin, a Vatican diplomat assigned to Dublin in 2003 to address the problem in Ireland’s largest Catholic congregation.

He said, “It’s very frightening for me to see that in some of these cases, so many children were abused. It’s very hard to weigh that up against anything” 60 years of covering up abuse of children yours michaelmac
 
michaelmac said:
“The vast majority of priests don’t abuse, they do good work, they’re extremely upset and offended by what’s happened,” states Archbishop Diamuid Martin, a Vatican diplomat assigned to Dublin in 2003 to address the problem in Ireland’s largest Catholic congregation.
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This is what you refuse to accept. You are judging the whole Church and lumping me in with the scum who abused. :mad:
 
Christus Rex, how many victims of clerical abuse do you know , in England every Diocese is being sued because of abuse , this is for one reason only every Diocese has turned its back on abuse victims , its not about money its about accountability ,the people who fill the pews are backing the Diocese against the victims of abuse by their actions , their silence is deafening to abuse victims yours michaelmac
 
How on earth do you know what every person in the pews thinks? What arrogance.
 
Christus Rex , what arogance, where, how, why, do you know who is sueing every Diocese in England, do you know how many diocese have offered help , none, you quoted from my earlier post about the Diocese of Dublin, why did you not quote the end of my post , is it to pain full to know the leadership of the diocese have allowed children to be abused for 60 years , or more, can you tell me who is helping abuse victims , how many Catholics who sit in the pews are helping those who harm them selves because of abuse , take my friend from the south coast of England who from the Catholic church is helping her come to terms with the suicide of three siblings like me , no body , its funny non of the familys i know who have had three suicides have any help from the Catholic church , even though all are from Catholic familys , can you tell me why this is , You talk about my arogance , i do not say im from the one true church, that has covered up abuse of children world wide , and have the nerve to say im from a Christian church yours michaelmac
 
Hi all , some great news for you A married Catholic priest takes over as Chancelor, in Fort Worth Catholic Diocese Texas yours michaelmac
 
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