I'm a former atheist. Ask me anything.

[yankee_doodle]

Even if it’s a christian apologetics cite it has tons of references to books, websites, historians and the like, please won’t you just take a look.

but I suppose the Christian apologist Origen was lying?

At any rate I know there’s considerable debate about Horus, however, you’re right I don’t give much credence to apologetic web sites. I’d rather rely on secular sources. Sorry, but I just don’t trust biased sources, since there’s an obvious conflict of interest (albeit I try to avoid sites biased towards atheism as well, since I’ve seen plenty of misinformation on those sites just as I’ve seen plenty of misinformation on Christian and Catholic sites).

The fact is there’s enough virgin birth motifs and parallels (not only with Horus, but with several other ancient Egyptian, Persian, Greek, and Roman gods) that create a persuasive case against Christianity (and earlier mythology i.e. Mesopotamian myths, create the same sort of doubts regarding Judaism). However, this is only one piece of evidence out of many that shape my personal views in this matter.

 

[CWBetts]

Similarity does not indicate a causal relationship.

 

[yankee_doodle]

Similarity does not indicate a causal relationship.

not conclusively no. But it has excellent probative value.

 

[yankee_doodle]

I would like to point out that the greatest learning institutions were endorsed by the Vatican itself back in the medieval period. To say that secular learned people solely possess intelligence is prejudice by far and to make the assertion that religious people cannot be intelligent or as intelligent is an offense.

No one said theists are dumb outside of matters concerning their religion.

 

[yankee_doodle]

cite

it’s site (you spell it cite when you’re referring to a citation); and I did take a look at the site when you initially posted the link

 

[humble_maid]

No one said theists are dumb outside of matters concerning their religion.

You are very reticent to accept proven religious theories; these discussions can go on and on. There is much evidence to prove you wrong. Nonetheless you do your bidding we will continue ours.

However an atheist such as yourself is at least trying to converse with us; althoughbeit you don’t seem to have a sincere care for what we say. Compared to what your commarades say on the atheist forum it is deplorable; not even a shred of intellect in what I observed; just complete and utter hate that is unjustified.

The real reason you cannot accept is not based on knowledge but you have a morbid fear of believing. Forgive me if I am psychoanalyzing here; I would gather it’s because of my indoctrination from secular studies in university. I too hold degrees from prestigious universities.

God Bless and we shall continue to pray for you!

 

[humble_maid]

We have no atheist television programming (although we should), we have no churches, no army of evangelists pounding on doors around the nation, no radio stations, nothing (except for Bill Maher on HBO, if he still has a show).

You have the mass media and politics on your side: I would say that is enough.

 

[humble_maid]

I would like to know if you studied with other christian denominations? And what enlightment does the Holy Spirit offer you?

 

[josie_L]

it’s site (you spell it cite when you’re referring to a citation); and I did take a look at the site when you initially posted the link

That’s a case of typing before thinking (I know it should be written with an “s”), but thank you for pointing out my error. What do you mean by you took a look at the site? Did you notice the references at the end of the page, did you notice the scholars that were quoted? Did you read the article? What did you think about it?

 

[josie_L]

but I suppose the Christian apologist Origen was lying?

At any rate I know there’s considerable debate about Horus, however, you’re right I don’t give much credence to apologetic web sites. I’d rather rely on secular sources. Sorry, but I just don’t trust biased sources, since there’s an obvious conflict of interest (albeit I try to avoid sites biased towards atheism as well, since I’ve seen plenty of misinformation on those sites just as I’ve seen plenty of misinformation on Christian and Catholic sites).

The fact is there’s enough virgin birth motifs and parallels (not only with Horus, but with several other ancient Egyptian, Persian, Greek, and Roman gods) that create a persuasive case against Christianity (and earlier mythology i.e. Mesopotamian myths, create the same sort of doubts regarding Judaism). However, this is only one piece of evidence out of many that shape my personal views in this matter.

But that’s where you’re wrong, that site that I posted I found on webskeptic (it’s posted in my thread, maybe you missed it). Furthermore, you are wrong in assuming parallels with Christianity and cults (they are few and far between), in fact, the resurrection which is propounded to be copied by some (with the rising and dying Gods in myths of old) is not so. The resurrection is unique to Christianity (do not confuse the resurrection with the vegetation cycle that many religions revolved their beliefs around?). I will provide you with detailed information. God bless.

p.s. How are you by the way?

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

Has anyone grown tired of this thread yet? :yawn:
And where has the original poster gone?

(So impressed with Josie’s efforts and knowledge. Go girl!)

Also, I don’t know where Humble Maid Lives but the point about the media is so true in my case. Here in the UK at the moment there are no quality religious programmes anywhere. (The BBC people would probably rather die than give some air time.) There is so much anti-religious stuff out there and the moment there is a tiny churchy voice speaking in public there are many hateful responses to it. Us Catholics are truly taking over the world LOL

 

[josie_L]

Has anyone grown tired of this thread yet? :yawn:
And where has the original poster gone?

(So impressed with Josie’s efforts and knowledge. Go girl!)

Also, I don’t know where Humble Maid Lives but the point about the media is so true in my case. Here in the UK at the moment there are no quality religious programmes anywhere. (The BBC people would probably rather die than give some air time.) There is so much anti-religious stuff out there and the moment there is a tiny churchy voice speaking in public there are many hateful responses to it. Us Catholics are truly taking over the world LOL

Thank you for the compliment but just so you know that post containing the Horus description is something I copied and pasted (but at least I can take credit for good researching skills ).

 

[CWBetts]

yankee_doodle;5634277:

We have no atheist television programming (although we should), we have no churches, no army of evangelists pounding on doors around the nation, no radio stations, nothing (except for Bill Maher on HBO, if he still has a show).

You have the mass media and politics on your side: I would say that is enough.

Absolutely. In TV, the evangelicals have a half dozen cable channels or so, we Catholics have EWTN, and the Atheist minority controls the rest.

 

[NoWings]

But that’s where you’re wrong, that site that I posted I found on webskeptic (it’s posted in my thread, maybe you missed it). Furthermore, you are wrong in assuming parallels with Christianity and cults (they are few and far between), in fact, the resurrection which is propounded to be copied by some (with the rising and dying Gods in myths of old) is not so. The resurrection is unique to Christianity (do not confuse the resurrection with the vegetation cycle that many religions revolved their beliefs around?). I will provide you with detailed information. God bless.

p.s. How are you by the way?

Granted, there may not be an immediate relationship between the Resurrection and the fertility cycle, but there is definitely an overlap due to the mixing of cultures.

Christ rises in the spring when everything is blossoming, and holdovers from old pagan Easter worship are still there in the form of the Easter bunny (secular) and colored eggs. He goes into the cave (the womb) with death and comes out with renewed life. I’m aware of the myth of Mary Magdalene and the red egg, but I daresay most folks are not.

That’s why I’ve said that I don’t understand why people would be pagan. Christianity has an equivalent to almost everything in paganism with pages and pages of commentary on any subject you can think of.

 

[Sunflower15]

I was an atheist for years before recently finding faith again. If you have any questions about “the atheist lifestyle,” I’d be happy to try to answer them.
.

My main question would be whether or not you think that one can go from atheism to believing in God by reason alone [logical proofs for the existence of God].

My sons have several atheist/agnostic friends and have never been able to persuade them by reason alone, not even with Aristotle’s or Aquinas’ proofs. They believe that there is need for at least a minimal ‘leap of faith’ prior to the conversion.

Then, the question would be: How to minimize the ‘leap of faith’ so that it is as small as possible? [before engaging in arguments by reason]

 

[josie_L]

Has anyone grown tired of this thread yet? :yawn:
And where has the original poster gone?

(So impressed with Josie’s efforts and knowledge. Go girl!)

Also, I don’t know where Humble Maid Lives but the point about the media is so true in my case. Here in the UK at the moment there are no quality religious programmes anywhere. (The BBC people would probably rather die than give some air time.) There is so much anti-religious stuff out there and the moment there is a tiny churchy voice speaking in public there are many hateful responses to it. Us Catholics are truly taking over the world LOL

Contra Mundum, may I ask what your name is?

 

[josie_L]

Granted, there may not be an immediate relationship between the Resurrection and the fertility cycle, but there is definitely an overlap due to the mixing of cultures.

Christ rises in the spring when everything is blossoming, and holdovers from old pagan Easter worship are still there in the form of the Easter bunny (secular) and colored eggs. He goes into the cave (the womb) with death and comes out with renewed life. I’m aware of the myth of Mary Magdalene and the red egg, but I daresay most folks are not.

That’s why I’ve said that I don’t understand why people would be pagan. Christianity has an equivalent to almost everything in paganism with pages and pages of commentary on any subject you can think of.

I’m not sure what you mean by “equivalent to almost everything in paganism”, but the beliefs and/or theology set by the Church since Christ has not changed, which cannot be said for the mystery religions that apparently “influenced” Christianity? God bless No wings.

 

[miguel]

…I wouldn’t mind becoming Christian if it actually made sense to do so.

Here’s why it makes sense to me. Architectures are evidence of an architect. A living organism is an architecture. Did inanimate matter form itself into a living organism? Inanimate matter can’t. It’s inanimate. Does inanimate matter know anything about food, mobility, digestion, reproduction to assemble itself into a living organism. Inanimate matter doesn’t know anything. It comes down to believing what is less absurd. Either inanimate matter did it or God did it. Once your reason takes you to God’s existence, then you’re open to other things that God revealed to us about himself.

 

[youngsaint]

Welcome Home, what made you choose the Catholics over the christians?

 

[CWBetts]

Welcome Home, what made you choose the Catholics over the christians?

Catholics are Christian. In fact we were the first Christians.