I think historic Protestant theology on the doctrine of justification brings out the finished work of Christ differently than Catholic theology on the doctrine of justification. So, yes in practical life, one view gives greater assurance and rest in the finished work of Christ than the other… IMO.
Unfortunately, the Protestant view of justification by Faith Alone comes from a misunderstanding of Romans. When St. Paul wrote of “Works of the Law” he meant ceremonial observances (circumcision, animal sacrifices, etc). He never meant that we were no longer bound by the Moral Law.
Protestant.
The only ones who claim this is Catholics. I beleive we are all one in Christ.
Not to mention that the word “alone” was added to the canon! You would think that that alone (pun intended) would mean something, but I suppose that if you choose to ignore it you can justify it.
If Protestant, Catholic or Orthodox isn’t essential to being a Christian, then why assert that one is “better” (which you still haven’t defined that criteria) than the other? Either what you believe as a Christians is non-essential since what separates these three faith traditions are doctrinal matters or it doesn’t. If it doesn’t, then I don’t see why one would be better than the other if where we attend church is non-essential. Since you are asserting that Protestantism is better than Catholicism, then what believe and what faith tradition we are does matter.
So if Protestantism is preferable, then how can we be one in Christ with no division? There are only two ways to resolve this argument:
It is funny though, how disagreements like this distract us from the point.So you hold to what the separated church believes. We Catholics pray for unity of the flock as Jesus desired it in every Mass celebrated, CarlanThe only ones who claim this is Catholics. I beleive we are all one in Christ.
We are close to unity with the Orthodox, Pope Benedict is working very hard on it. We pray!
Carlan
Hmm, I don’t want to burst your bubble but even if the Pope were able to get some Orthodox bishop(s) to agree to join the RCC most of the laity and clergy wouldn’t go for it. Remember the Council of Florence? Either the Orthodox will have to agree that the RCs are right, or the RCs will have to agree that the Orthos are right; or the two parties will have to agree that their differences don’t matter. Short of an unprecedented miracle, do you really see any of those three things happening? Realistically?We are close to unity with the Orthodox, Pope Benedict is working very hard on it. We pray!
I think what we are trying to accomplish is to open our minds that other Christian communities and traditions than the one that we attend are not evil. We are One in Christ with much tension between our traditions, yet we are still one because there is only one body of Christ.
Maybe God’s moral law is a reflection of God’s holiness which cannot change. So, we are always accountable to God’s holiness in His law which demands punishment when we break it. God’s moral law shows us our sinfulness, driving us to Jesus Christ as Christians. It was never meant to be a means of salvation by keeping it. So, what do you mean by being bound by the moral law, and in what sense… since when we break a moral law we are in sin?
For unity between two churches claiming to be the One True Church, would one group give up the claim as being the One True Church? Will the Orthodox Church break with tradition and submit to the Catholic understanding of apostolic succession?We are close to unity with the Orthodox, Pope Benedict is working very hard on it. We pray!
I don’t believe the Protestant Reformation was evil, rather it was the will of God. If it wasn’t the will of God, then how did it come to pass?Maybe here is what I am trying to say?
I am a Catholic. I believe that when it happened, the Protestant break was an evil. Nothing that causes division in the Body of Christ can be called anything other than an evil. I think everyone agrees on this last statement.
However, Jesus Christ is good. The Protestant tradition has the Word of God in the Bible, so in that sense it is good. It becomes more good when Protestants focus on Jesus and what he tells us to do. So, through Jesus Christ, an evil becomes a good. I don’t think that anyone could deny that many Protestants are very good people, and have become so through Jesus Christ.
I think that now, even when we are doing so in the name of unity, focusing on our differences rather than what we agree on is still an evil. This thread is a perfect example of this. Protestants are saying what Catholics are doing that they don’t like, and Catholics are saying the same about Protestants.
Saying that Protestantism and Catholicism are the same would cause me to have to renounce all the parts of Catholicism not contained in Protestantism, parts which I know to be true. As a Catholic, I cannot do that.
However, at the heart of both is faith in Jesus Christ, and I don’t think he would like this kind of discussion. Jesus just wants us to work on ourselves. We can do that no matter what anyone else thinks about whether we do or do not believe the same things, and the neat thing is that the more we do it, the more we do believe the same things.
If we can’t agree, I think we should just focus on what mutual respect there is. I’m sure I am continually failing to do this myself.
But intellectually if not always in my own practice, that’s the way I would interpret this:
"The Church knows that she is joined in many ways to the baptized who are honored by the name of Christian, but do not profess the Catholic faith in its entirety or have not preserved unity or communion under the successor of Peter."322 Those “who believe in Christ and have been properly baptized are put in a certain, although imperfect, communion with the Catholic Church.”
To me, imperfect communion is still better than no communion, which is what results when we focus on our differences. And we have to focus on our differences in order to try to resolve them in this way.
There is only room for One True Church and one apostolic succession in that kind of theology.
I think that many things come to pass that are evil. Therefore we can’t say that God never allows anything evil to come to pass; otherwise we would have to say that there is no evil in the world.
I don’t understand what you mean by this.
Everything that happens isn’t always the will of God. If it was so, why are babies being aborted, women raped, families burned alive in pakistan? Is that the will of God?
:thumbsup:Carlan