in love with a muslim

  • Thread starter Thread starter epl92
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
I can’t work out your first point. You note what Islam teaches. And you note that most are ignorant of their own faith. This might off-set what Islam teaches, but it’s still there for the ‘faithful’ to follow.

Islam teaches that non-Moslems perform evil. As a Moslem you’re allowed to marry a non-Moslem but with strict rules to ensure her own faith is stifled and that the kids grow up instructed only in Islam.
Of course, you’ve noticed the seeming contradictions in Islam between what is taught and what is believed. An important thing to note is that in Islam, there is no hierarchy to tell you what the proper interpretation of the Qur’an is, so its system reflects that of the Protestant world. There are four or so main schools of Islamic thought, ranging from very western and progressive to extremist and orthodox. We see this in the countries where Islam is predominent as well: In Turkiye, the Muslims are very western and progressive (the exception is in the far eastern part where the Kurds live), but in Saudi Arabia, they are much more orthodox and have “religious police,” etc.

There are imams, but they are more like pastors or preachers and teach whatever they have learned or whatever they have interpreted the Qur’an to teach. So basically, one may interpret the Qur’an according to their own presuppositions and will obey or disobey the Sharia law and/or Hadith based on their own will; even if they are taught and instructed to obey it anyway.

I don’t know if this clears anything up; it probably raises only more questions, but I am not an expert by any means…😉

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius:cool:
 
Of course, you’ve noticed the seeming contradictions in Islam between what is taught and what is believed.
That happens everywhere. It would be wrong to suggest that because there’s disagreement on the periphery, one can’t know what Islam stands for.

Most Moslems follow the Koran and the Hadith. The Hadith says a Moslem should not even take a non-Moslem as a close friend.
An important thing to note is that in Islam, there is no hierarchy to tell you what the proper interpretation of the Qur’an is, so its system reflects that of the Protestant world. There are four or so main schools of Islamic thought, ranging from very western and progressive to extremist and orthodox. We see this in the countries where Islam is predominant as well: In Turkey, the Muslims are very western and progressive (the exception is in the far eastern part where the Kurds live), but in Saudi Arabia, they are much more orthodox and have “religious police,” etc.
In Sunni Islam as far as jurisprudence there are four schools none of these is ‘very western’ or ‘progressive’

They are Maliki, Hanbai, Hanafi and Shafi’i
There are imams, but they are more like pastors or preachers and teach whatever they have learned or whatever they have interpreted the Qur’an to teach. So basically, one may interpret the Qur’an according to their own presuppositions and will obey or disobey the Sharia law and/or Hadith based on their own will; even if they are taught and instructed to obey it anyway.
Ah, so you are trying a relativist argument! That is, you’re suggesting that there’s such a wide-range of interpretations to Islam that one can’t criticise ‘an’ aspect of it, because it won’t necessarily represent “Islam” for all Moslems.

For example…

A Christian is someone who believes Christ is God. Not just that they ‘believe in’ Christ. Or else the Dalai Lama would be ‘Christian’ (because he views Jesus as a great teacher).

Islam has several pillars of faith. And, as noted the Koran and Hadith are of central import.

Your argument is as flawed as saying “We can’t condemn Nazism, because not all Nazis hated the Jews. In fact, Oskar Schindler (a Nazi-party member) saved them!”

One of these liberal notions, encouraged by Islamic people is that Islam is progressive, because it enshrined rights for women. Further, that men and women are equal in Islam. There is a germ of truth in this, but it is such a superficial treatment that it’s not worth repeating by liberals.

Islam did in fact give limited inheritance rights to women, and Muhammad ordered the cessation of female infanticide.

However, noble as these are, how are women treated in Islam? Are women equal in Islam? “Men have fear of your Lord, who created you from a single soul. From that soul He created its mate and through them He bestrewed the earth with countless men and women” (Sura 4:1). This clearly suggests that men and women were created from the same substance. Muslims will point to this as ‘proof’ that men and women are considered equal in Islam. However, Sura 2:228 states “Women shall with justice have rights similar to those exercised against them, although men have a status above women.” However this difference in status runs much deeper. In legal testimony, “Call in two male witnesses from among you, but if two men cannot be found, then one man and two women whom you judge fit to act as witnesses” (Sura 2:282), in other words a woman’s testimony is worth half of a man’s. Although the case was a contractual one, it does not state that such a ruling shall be limited to this type of case only; a fact that is accepted by many Muslim scholars; that it is a general rule for most court cases.

Can Muslim women be beaten? “Good women are obedient. They guard their unseen parts because God has guarded them. As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them and send them to beds apart and beat them” (Sura 4:34) (though some Islamic scholars claim that this is a symbolic ‘beating’ only where-by the husband just ‘taps’ his wife on the arm. Although the wording does not say it should be but a symbolic tap, it should be noted anyway that it still points to male domination over women. So they can differ on the degree of administration, but it is not ‘incorrect’ in Islam to beat one’s wife.
 
If I had it to do again, I would never marry a nonCatholic. I advice my daughters to marry Catholics. If you were my daughter I would say, Marry a Catholic. You will be sorry if you don’t.
 
If I had it to do again, I would never marry a nonCatholic. I advice my daughters to marry Catholics. If you were my daughter I would say, Marry a Catholic. You will be sorry if you don’t.
An Orthodox man I know married a Catholic and she converted. It’s hard to have a mixed marriage if you take religion seriously.
 
An Orthodox man I know married a Catholic and she converted. It’s hard to have a mixed marriage if you take religion seriously.
That was my point! This man obviously doesn’t take Islam seriously if he is willing to compromise his faith for marriage, That is another reason why I asked her if her faith is strong - she will live with this man for the rest of her life. Would I ever marry someone of another faith? No, but then again if they were Orthodox, it wouldn’t bother me at all to convert. If they were Protestant (likely case), I would want to have a valid marriage - most likely they would convert, but this mess is a pain to deal with…

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius:cool:
 
hello,
im a female in love with a muslim. Ive been with with him for a year now. we both respect each others religions and love each other dearly. we have both discussed our beliefs and im worried that i will not get the acceptance from my family as they are prejudiced against muslims. how do i tell my parents about him without this destroying the realtionship with my parents. i would appreciate your advice greatly.
god bless
Here’s what the Vatican has to say about that…

841 The Church’s relationship with the Muslims. “The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.”
 
Here’s what the Vatican has to say about that…

841 The Church’s relationship with the Muslims. “The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.”
Unfortunate statement because the Moslem ‘god’ is not God
 
hello,
im a female in love with a muslim. Ive been with with him for a year now. we both respect each others religions and love each other dearly. we have both discussed our beliefs and im worried that i will not get the acceptance from my family as they are prejudiced against muslims. how do i tell my parents about him without this destroying the realtionship with my parents. i would appreciate your advice greatly.
god bless
I wonder some members here who have answered this sister indeed intend to confuse her instead of helping her how to convince her parents to accept that man. maybe Allah love this sister thats why he send this man and maybe he will be the reason to guide this lady to the true path.

May allah bless you sister and guide you to the tructh.

Peaceeee…
 
do muslims even date?

I had a roomate my first semester of college that wouldn’t even shake a womens hand because of the laws against touching women your not married to.
As a student I lived in a sharehouse with a Muslim male for two years. He seemed quite unconcerned about sharing with an unattached Catholic female and would let me borrow his computer on occasion and stuff.

His family and friends were also unconcerned - some of them visited while he was here.

I’d say average dating practices wouldn’t have bothered him if he’d met a girl he liked while he was here (he didn’t)

Obviously there are varying degrees of strictness among Muslims just as there are among Catholics.
 
As a student I lived in a sharehouse with a Muslim male for two years. He seemed quite unconcerned about sharing with an unattached Catholic female and would let me borrow his computer on occasion and stuff.

His family and friends were also unconcerned - some of them visited while he was here.

I’d say average dating practices wouldn’t have bothered him if he’d met a girl he liked while he was here (he didn’t)

Obviously there are varying degrees of strictness among Muslims just as there are among Catholics.
I love relativist argument!
 
I love relativist argument!
Montalban, you’re sadly misguided if you can so badly misconstrue a comment about how Muslims and Catholics put their faith into practice as to think it means I’m being relativistic. Go buy a dictionary and read it.
 
It is not a requirement, as some have noted, for the wife to convert to Islam if she is from “People of the Book”. But it is greatly encouraged, and some advise that any religious activity be performed in secret by the wife so as not to influence the children.

I do not know how conservative your boyfriend is:sometimes they are not, but their families are, and so they buckle under the pressure, just as you are wantingto maintain the relationship with your parents. Of course, living in a Muslim country, the pressure I see here is obviously more intense.

(I do not know how ‘conservative’ they are in Australia anyways: certainly here, according to Islamic law they can punish male-female sharing flats if you’re not married, and a significant number of people don’t shake hands with those of the opposite sex. But I suppose even there, though it may be less strict, there might be pressure from the community at the mosque. They usually don’t make allowances for questions like mixed-marriages)

But the end result is that, if that does come about, is that your children will be raised Muslims. Which is not a really ideal situation for a Catholic (just as probably having the children raised Catholic would not be an ideal situation for a Muslim)

A semi-personal anecdote: When I was a Protestant, there was a lady who came to the church office for counseling: she had married a Muslim (Pakistani) and he had been willing for her to bring her children to the church (they were for a short while enrolled in the sunday school), and he also took them to the mosque. When her in-laws found out about it, they started applying all sorts of pressure (all the way form Pakistan!) until she stopped. And then they started, through a relation, to try and stop her from coming to church claiming it was a bad example for the children. Ultimately that marriage ended in divorce, and according to the law, the husband got the children, and overall it was a very sad situation.
 
Montalban, you’re sadly misguided if you can so badly misconstrue a comment about how Muslims and Catholics put their faith into practice as to think it means I’m being relativistic.
You are, by implying that singular examples are representative of their faith.
Go buy a dictionary and read it.
I read the dictionary. The Zebra does it in the end.
 
You are, by implying that singular examples are representative of their faith.
I implied no such thing in the slightest. You need your head read. I was simply saying there are individuals professing every faith who are more or less strict in their practice of their faith, and offered one example from my experience. Never said nor implied that he was representative of anyone but himself.
I read the dictionary. The Zebra does it in the end.
You clearly skipped this important bit:

rel·a·tiv·ism (rĕl’ə-tĭ-vĭz’əm)
n. Philosophy.
A theory, especially in ethics or aesthetics, that conceptions of truth and moral values are not absolute but are relative to the persons or groups holding them.

How I was in any way commenting on the TRUTH of what Muslims believe, is beyond me. I was commenting on how ONE Muslim practices his professed faith, nothing more.
 
I implied no such thing in the slightest. You need your head read. I was simply saying there are individuals professing every faith who are more or less strict in their practice of their faith, and offered one example from my experience. Never said nor implied that he was representative of anyone but himself.
Then what you’re saying is you offered a truism.

“Some Moslems believe…x

Then of course, you’re right. Thanks for stating that. 👍
 
Then what you’re saying is you offered a truism.

“Some Moslems believe…x

Then of course, you’re right. Thanks for stating that. 👍
I offered an observation that was true rather than a truism … I made a point that needed making, at least to some of my learned and loyal Catholic colleagues (the one who wondered if Muslims would even be allowed to date as we understand dating, for example …)
 
I offered an observation that was true rather than a truism … I made a point that needed making, at least to some of my learned and loyal Catholic colleagues (the one who wondered if Muslims would even be allowed to date as we understand dating, for example …)
What is your point? Some Moslems are nice. Great.

How’s this related to Islam in general?

Oskar Schindler was a Nazi Party member who saved many Jews. This is true. Does it in any way negate the general way Jews were treated by Nazis? It doesn’t.

Oh, and you offered a truism. Not all Moslems are bad people.
Not all are. To quote you…
Obviously there are varying degrees of strictness among Muslims just as there are among Catholics.
tru·ism [troo-iz-uhm] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun a self-evident, obvious truth.
dictionary.reference.com/browse/truism
 
On friends…
Koran 5:51
O you who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians as Auliya’ (friends, protectors, helpers, etc.), they are but Auliya’ to one another. And if any amongst you takes them as Auliya’, then surely he is one of them. Verily, Allah guides not those people who are the Zalimun (polytheists and wrongdoers and unjust).

Allaah has forbidden the believers to take the kaafireen (disbelievers) as friends, and He has issued a stern warning against doing that.
islamqa.com/index.php?ref=59879&ln=eng
 
These aayaat and ahaadeeth clearly indicate that it is haraam (forbidden) for men to have any kind of friendship or relationship with non-mahram women (women to whom they are not closely-related and to whom they could get married). The evil consequences and misery caused by such relationships are obvious to anyone who observes real life
islamqa.com/index.php?ref=1114&ln=eng

Out of compassion and caring for your sake, please allow me to reproach a particular aspect of your question, which is that you did not indicate any regret on your part regarding the sinful and forbidden relationship of taking a girlfriend and continuing with her in a friendship that angers and displeases Allah regardless of the extent of that friendship.
islamqa.com/index.php?ref=182&ln=eng
 
On friends…
Koran 5:51
O you who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians as Auliya’ (friends, protectors, helpers, etc.), they are but Auliya’ to one another. And if any amongst you takes them as Auliya’, then surely he is one of them. Verily, Allah guides not those people who are the Zalimun (polytheists and wrongdoers and unjust).

Allaah has forbidden the believers to take the kaafireen (disbelievers) as friends, and He has issued a stern warning against doing that.
islamqa.com/index.php?ref=59879&ln=eng
Indeed but His Almighty Eminence the owner of the site is only interpreting the verse in line with his train of belief.
There are waaay more moderate interpretations of the Sura 5 also taking into account other verses in that Sura and the rest of the Koran-ranging from the “different kinds of friendship” approach to the “depends-on-the-person-is he-going-to make-you-lose-your-faith” approach.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top