In mid-90s, Pope connected marriage crisis with homosexuality

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JimR-OCDS said:
There is a causal relationship of immorality and collapse of a society. You can go look back at history and every fall of a society was preceded by a collapse of moral order.
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Societies collapsed because of poor military strategy/invasion, political upheaval, disease, and unsustainable growth. Morality hasn’t had anything to do with those factors or the collapse of any society. Would you contend that the rise an fall of the Papal States is attributable to immorality?
 
EmperorNapoleon said:
Societies collapsed because of poor military strategy/invasion, political upheaval, disease, and unsustainable growth. Morality hasn’t had anything to do with those factors or the collapse of any society.
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Moral collapse precedes everything else.

Once the society is incapable of making moral decisions, it loses it’s ability to govern properly.

Jim
 
qui_est_ce said:
Have you read it? I was thinking about getting it for my Kindle.
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Yes, I did read it–on the Kindle. It pretty thoroughly documents what we all knew intuitively was happening over the past 40 years as a result of the sexual revolution.
 
JimG said:
Yes, I did read it–on the Kindle. It pretty thoroughly documents what we all knew intuitively was happening over the past 40 years as a result of the sexual revolution.
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P.S. The actual results of the birth control revolution seem to me to be the most effective argument against artificial birth control, and in favor of the Catholic position. The results have been not only as bad as predicted in Humanae Vitae, but much worse.
 
JimG said:
P.S. The actual results of the birth control revolution seem to me to be the most effective argument against artificial birth control, and in favor of the Catholic position. The results have been not only as bad as predicted in Humanae Vitae, but much worse.
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I have always thought it all began with the Pill.

Humanae Vitae is very mild in its wording, but the predictions are spot on. Back then, no one could have imagined the sanctioning of men “marrying” men.
 
EmperorNapoleon said:
Societies collapsed because of poor military strategy/invasion, political upheaval, disease, and unsustainable growth. Morality hasn’t had anything to do with those factors or the collapse of any society. Would you contend that the rise an fall of the Papal States is attributable to immorality?
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Can anyone respond?
 
qui_est_ce said:
What were the Romans doing while they paid the Barbarians to fight their wars for them? What was Nero doing with little boys and teen-agers while Rome was burning?
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You might be thinking of the Greeks. I don’t recall reading that Romans had a reputation for homosexual behavior. They did for heterosexual behavior, though.
 
EmperorNapoleon said:
Societies collapsed because of poor military strategy/invasion, political upheaval, disease, and unsustainable growth. Morality hasn’t had anything to do with those factors or the collapse of any society. Would you contend that the rise an fall of the Papal States is attributable to immorality?
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Societies rise and fall for a variety of reasons. Morality certainly has been a factor in the collapse of many societies. Morality, although not necessarily the Catholic version, is a sign of ordered society. Without order there is chaos and eventual collapse.

Name one political issue that didn’t involve someone lying, cheating, or stealing?
 
Rich_Olszewski said:
You might be thinking of the Greeks. I don’t recall reading that Romans had a reputation for homosexual behavior. They did for heterosexual behavior, though.
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I was referring to immorality, whether heterosexual or heterosexual.

Nero did have a penchant for boys. I believe he “married” his male slave.

The Romans had drunken orgies. Calligula anyone?
 
Dawnia said:
Societies rise and fall for a variety of reasons. Morality certainly has been a factor in the collapse of many societies. Morality, although not necessarily the Catholic version, is a sign of ordered society. Without order there is chaos and eventual collapse.

Name one political issue that didn’t involve someone lying, cheating, or stealing?
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The Israelis evicting Palestinians with force in 1948 in order to take their land.
 
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