In RCIA, losing interest

[mcmitton]

RCIA is only as “good” as the teacher and the matters discussed and the manner in which they are discussed. I’ve sat through several - some great, some good, and then … not so good. I know how a leader can focus on one aspect of belief ad nauseam, whether argumentative or not.

Healthy discussion is good, but our church is soooo much more than anti-abortion, etc.

Could you attend RCIA elsewhere?

Don’t give up. RCIA should be informative, a pleasant and even exciting time to discover our church and faith.

Find another RCIA :newidea:

 

[DJK100]

For clarification, by “egalitarian,” I mean that my fiance and I want to make decisions in unison, with no one of us having the ultimate power of final decision over the other. This differs from Church teaching that the man is to have the final decision in family matters.

Hi,

Please read these…

catholic.com/quickquestions/what-is-the-catholic-view-of-women
catholic.com/tracts/abortion

… I think they answers some of your concerns.

Hope this helps.

 

[Te_Deum]

This is good and bad. Good in that now you wont let mere emotion dictate to you about the Church. The Catholic faith really isn’t an emotional one and it’s dangerous to enter into it like that. You get your expectations built up, the magic moment… you are about to communion with God… why aren’t the angels present walking with you? Where’s Saint Michael with a banner proclaiming the awesomeness of this event… what will Jesus say to me when He is present in me? It’s finally here… finally… that’s it… … … that’s it? Well… … that was a waste of a few months… … oh look, that Baptist Church looks lively, I might just take a dander and see what it’s like…

Our faith is not dictated by emotions. It’s all about the will. When we communicate, for example, we don’t expect to have a merry conversation with Jesus. We excite our wills for the moment when He is present, He may not announce Himself, but we still have faith that He is there because we choose to have that faith, to cooperate with God’s gift of grace.

It’s bad in the sense that you now have to persevere through the dryness. Pray to God for the grace necessary for this. Don’t expect to be “on fire” again. Just expect a sense of… well… stubbornness?

Regarding marriage, it is Catholic teaching that the husband is the end. He’s the last word in your marriage. However you are not obligated to to exercise such a relation. If you want to make all the decisions between you, fire away. However, if he pulls rank, he pulls rank and is perfectly within his authority to do so. Don’t enter into marriage lightly. Do you trust him? If you trust him, you should trust him enough to know that when he makes a decision, it will be the best for both of you. If not…

 

[Incomplete]

I looked up reviews on that book. It seems like there is some good (like some suggestions on finances) and some not-so-good. This is from a review of the book by a Catholic (who later also touches on the “submission” issue):

It’s quite unfair to the church for Kippley to summarize her teaching on openness to children by indicating that a couple is likely to get bored with each other if they don’t have children. And certainly the Catholic Church does not teach that women should never wear denim jeans.
If a Catholic couple reads this book, I hope they discuss what it says with their priest. I certainly hope that no non-catholics read this book, since they will get a pretty odd view of what the Catholic church teaches.

I read a couple of other things in a review, too, one that indicates that the authors suggest a wife be submissive so her husband doesn’t leave. sigh

It sounds like you could benefit from an RCIA class that needs to teach the beauties of Catholicism. I have not read the book, but if this review is accurate, it is not an accurate representation of Church teachings.

 

[DJK100]

For clarification, by “egalitarian,” I mean that my fiance and I want to make decisions in unison, with no one of us having the ultimate power of final decision over the other. This differs from Church teaching that the man is to have the final decision in family matters.

Also, please see…
1645 “The unity of marriage, distinctly recognized by our Lord, is made clear in the equal personal dignity which must be accorded to man and wife in mutual and unreserved affection.”

1601 “The matrimonial covenant, by which a man and a woman establish between themselves a partnership of the whole of life, is by its nature ordered toward the good of the spouses and the procreation and education of offspring; this covenant between baptized persons has been raised by Christ the Lord to the dignity of a sacrament.”

2206 The relationships within the family bring an affinity of feelings, affections and interests, arising above all from the members’ respect for one another. **The family is a privileged community called to achieve a "sharing of thought and common deliberation by the spouses as well as their eager cooperation as parents in the children’s upbringing."

2335 Each of the two sexes is an image of the power and tenderness of God, with equal dignity though in a different way. The union of man and woman in marriage is a way of imitating in the flesh the Creator’s generosity and fecundity: “Therefore a man leaves his father and his mother and cleaves to his wife, and they become one flesh.” All human generations proceed from this union.

scborromeo.org/ccc/ccc_toc2.htm

… I skimmed through the Catechism to try and address your concern regarding egalitarianism and it seems that is what the Catechism only teaches. It teaches about partnerships, respect and digninty for the spouse. The above are just a select few qoutes that I hope try to show this and alleviate your concern.

 

[Incomplete]

And then there’s John Paul II’s thoughts in Theology of the Body. I’m only quoting a couple of things, but it’s enough to give you a more proper idea of Church teachings on the relationships between a man and wife in marriage. The whole “submission” thing is not that simplistic:

“The mutual relations of husband and wife should flow from their common relationship with Christ.” (TOB Aug. 11, 1982) p. 309
“Love excludes every kind of subjection whereby the wife might become a servant or a slave of the husband, an object of unilateral domination. Love makes the husband simultaneously subject to the wife, thereby subject to the Lord himself, just as the wife to the husband… It is certain that when the husband and wife are subject to one another ‘out of reverence for Christ’,a just balance will be established, such as to correspond to their Christian vocation in the mystery of Christ.”

 

[Incomplete]

It sounds like you could benefit from an RCIA class that needs to teach the beauties of Catholicism. I have not read the book, but if this review is accurate, it is not an accurate representation of Church teachings.

I meant to say “that teaches the beauties of Catholicism.” Oops!

Regarding abortion and gay marriage, that’s another issue. As another poster said, “define rabid.” If you disagree on these issues, you should not join the Church yet. If it’s just that your class focusses on them, then it might be a problem with the class.

These issues should be taught with love in your class, but not made a focus of it. We do not hate the person who has had an abortion, or the person who has decided to live a homosexual lifestyle.

 

[hilde_the_dog]

Egalitarianism and unison - it sounds like a socialist convention circa 1880 . In my humble expierence I do not know how many of the decisions my wife and I make are in “unison”. Generally, decision are made by those who are best able to make them - thus I stay out of the color of the tile and how towash her clothes. Then again remember someone is always more equal than the others.

 

[anp1215]

Egalitarianism and unison - it sounds like a socialist convention circa 1880 . In my humble expierence I do not know how many of the decisions my wife and I make are in “unison”. Generally, decision are made by those who are best able to make them - thus I stay out of the color of the tile and how towash her clothes. Then again remember someone is always more equal than the others.

That’s great if it works for you two. Not every woman is great at choosing the color of the tile and washing clothes. Some men might be better at that. Some women might be better at handling finances. My mom deferred to my dad on handling of finances, and they ended up filing for bankruptcy.

To the OP: There’s not a laundry list of “to do’s” for marriage (wife: cooks, cleans, watches children; husband: makes financial decisions, works outside the home, pays bills). You are free to work out between the two of you how you will divide your household duties, and who is responsible for what.

Best of luck in your marriage and RCIA classes, whatever your decision is.

 

[meltzerboy]

Hello, everyone. So I don’t know what to do- I’m in RCIA now, and only a couple of weeks ago I was really passionate about Catholicism, but now I have no interest in it whatsoever. I find the rabid anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage stance of the Church quite draining, and I just want some peace. Further complicating matters is the fact that I am getting married next August, and I was going to get married in the Catholic Church. Now, I don’t know if I should stick through with the RCIA classes just in case I feel interested in Catholicism again, or if I should just get married outside of the Church. Any (name removed by moderator)ut?

As an outsider to Catholicism and Christianity and with no vested interest in your continuing your studies, I would still suggest you stick with it. You may be under some stress at the moment due to your approaching marriage. Besides, I’ve heard that people who attend such faith training and education often have their doubts at times, but these pass later on. Even after becoming Catholic, don’t expect clear sailing for the rest of your life: people have doubts about various facets of whatever religion they are members of, whether by birth or conversion. Give yourself more time, and even if you don’t now agree with some of the issues you raised, you may come to change your mind in the future through prayer, reason, and further knowledge about the Church’s teaching. Remember too that nothing really worth achieving comes easy.

 

[FormerWarrior]

Hello, everyone. So I don’t know what to do- I’m in RCIA now, and only a couple of weeks ago I was really passionate about Catholicism, but now I have no interest in it whatsoever. I find the rabid anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage stance of the Church quite draining, and I just want some peace. Further complicating matters is the fact that I am getting married next August, and I was going to get married in the Catholic Church. Now, I don’t know if I should stick through with the RCIA classes just in case I feel interested in Catholicism again, or if I should just get married outside of the Church. Any (name removed by moderator)ut?

Good luck in your search.

It is true that the Church is having a very difficult time these days. It holds out the promise of a coherent moral theory, which people usually find to be less than advertised, once they understand it.

Look at it this way, you have at least learned enough to make an informed decision as to what is right for you. Otherwise, you would not have known. In that your experience clarified your moral values, you are a better person for it.

 

[puzzleannie]

just offering observations after reading the discussion and responses.

OP says he is losing interest in RCIA, yet continues to ask questions that are properly answered during the RCIA process, especially questions about specific Church teachings which should be explained during RCIA. So why, this RCIA catechist asks herself, is someone who has RCIA - type questions not interested in participating to learn the answers? That is why I ask, what else is going on with RCIA in your parish that turns you off? If it is a matter of rejecting specific Church teachings, or the way they are being presented, is it not premature to do so without first learning the teaching in more depth?

 

[silicasandra]

just offering observations after reading the discussion and responses.

OP says he is losing interest in RCIA, yet continues to ask questions that are properly answered during the RCIA process, especially questions about specific Church teachings which should be explained during RCIA. So why, this RCIA catechist asks herself, is someone who has RCIA - type questions not interested in participating to learn the answers? That is why I ask, what else is going on with RCIA in your parish that turns you off? If it is a matter of rejecting specific Church teachings, or the way they are being presented, is it not premature to do so without first learning the teaching in more depth?

I remember that when I went through RCIA, it was very strongly suggested that RCIA was only for those who intended on completing the Sacraments. If you were just “questioning,” it was suggested that you weren’t ready to be in RCIA yet - and that’s how I ended up quitting the first time. I understand now that that’s not what should have happened, but from reading here I’ve learned a lot about what RCIA is supposed to be and a lot of it I never got. This may be the situation for the OP, unfortunately - especially if she’s getting some kind of crazy information about the meaning of marriage.

 

[Ahimsa]

It holds out the promise of a coherent moral theory…

Do you mean Thomism?

 

[hilde_the_dog]

Puzzleannie do you remember Parisblues? deja vu

 

[ChinaMission99]

Dear Life in Sunshine,

My wife and I have been married for over 21 years. We have followed God’s plan for marriage and it’s been a great blessing! I would encourage you to study the Bible passages about marriage for yourself, and then discuss them with your pastor. God’s way is always best! You and your future husband as persons are equal in every way in God’s eyes, but in the institutions of marriage and the Church, God has assigned different roles for men and women. Out of love for our Lord we should humbly obey Him. Obedience brings blessing, disobedience brings sorrow and regret. May the Lord guide both of you in your journey of faith!

 

[benedictus2]

Hello, everyone. So I don’t know what to do- I’m in RCIA now, and only a couple of weeks ago I was really passionate about Catholicism, but now I have no interest in it whatsoever. I find the rabid anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage stance of the Church quite draining, and I just want some peace. Further complicating matters is the fact that I am getting married next August, and I was going to get married in the Catholic Church. Now, I don’t know if I should stick through with the RCIA classes just in case I feel interested in Catholicism again, or if I should just get married outside of the Church. Any (name removed by moderator)ut?

You know what? If there is anyone the devil puts the pressure on, it is on those who have decided to follow Christ into His Church. This is probably that time when the devil is working damnably hard to get you to quit. Will you follow him? Pray that you may overcome.

Have you ever thought that if abortion and homosexuality are wrong we should be passionately against it? Should one equivocate about something totally depraved? Don’t you feel passionately against about those you think are so morally wrong? Or is everything the same to you?

 

[benedictus2]

Look at it this way, you have at least learned enough to make an informed decision as to what is right for you. Otherwise, you would not have known. In that your experience clarified your moral values, you are a better person for it.

Has he indeed learned enough? What do you mean by " your experience clarified your moral values, you are a better person for it". What is this clarification that has made him a better person? How do you know he is a better person after this clarification?

 

[fall_fox]

Hello, everyone. So I don’t know what to do- I’m in RCIA now, and only a couple of weeks ago I was really passionate about Catholicism, but now I have no interest in it whatsoever. I find the rabid anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage stance of the Church quite draining, and I just want some peace. Further complicating matters is the fact that I am getting married next August, and I was going to get married in the Catholic Church. Now, I don’t know if I should stick through with the RCIA classes just in case I feel interested in Catholicism again, or if I should just get married outside of the Church. Any (name removed by moderator)ut?

fall fox

Please don’t base your entry into the Church on anything but your conviction that the Catholic Church is the one true Church of Jesus the Christ. The Church that Peter and Paul, the Apostles and all the Saints have defended for 2000 years. Do you know that of the Apostles, only John died a natural death, the rest were martyred for the Faith. I am a cradle Catholic and went through 12 years of Catholic Education. To be quite honest, I have learned more in the last 10 years on my own, I started out looking at the people that were with Jesus. Who were these people that were willing to give their lives for THIS Church that came from what Jesus taught. That was passion, that was commitment, that was the love of Jesus. The church isn’t a smörgåsbord where you can Pick and choose what you want to believe. It just doesn’t work that way.
I have found that the majority of converts to the Faith, make the best Catholics. Both my in-law-kids are converts. Absolutely no pressure was on them to join the Church.
My son and daughter are very good Catholics, and I think that it was through their example and dedication to the Church and the Sacraments that my in-law-kids wanted what they had. Both are wonderful Catholics.
What do you do on your own to grow in knowledge of the Faith? I’ll tell you something, I have been to RCIA twice once with a Priest and once with Lay instructors. For the life of me, I couldn’t glean enough there to foster a belief in God or the Church. RCIA isn’t a cannon that will shoot you into Catholicism. You need to build on what they are saying. You need to work on your faith yourself. We have the INTERNET that has a plethora of sites you can learn from. Your on one right now, but there are a lot of opinions on here that might be questionable. There is a web site I find that is very good called " THE CATHOLIC TREASURE CHEST " check it our I think it will help you.
Rabid anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage. Rabid ??? Good for them. It is Gods law. Thou shalt not kill, actually we use the word kill when it was written murder. Abortion is just that from conception to partial birth abortion, it’s murder ! ! ! Am I being " RABID "
Noooo, it is what it is. That’s a child so don’t fool yourself or make a fool of yourself thinking it is just some kind of blob.
You know, everyone wants love in their lives. I don’t understand what happens in the lives of gay folks, but something is wrong, something happened. You just don’t see that in nature.
We all have to answer for how we live our lives, we don’t know when that day will arrive, we must be ready.

 

[Jesus_123]

+God’s precious Holy :bible1: Word encourages us to study and learn . . .

:bible1:
Carefully study to present thyself
approved unto
**God, **
a workman that needeth not to be ashamed,
rightly handling the word of truth.
- 2 Timothy 2:15

Reading the original post from LifeInSunshine . . . :coffeeread:. . . I was reminded of the sturdy . . . little-red single-room schoolhouse . . . our extended family purchased and relocated onto our families meadow land for meetings . . . when all the surrounding area’s families children started taking the bus into the closest town to attend school in the consolidated school system established there . . . *where they were divided up into separate grade levels to better serve their educational needs. * During the . . . little-red school house days . . . the teacher’s class was made up of a variety of different ages of children . . . all progressing on different levels of their education . . . from first on up through sixth grade . . . and within the church our RCIA classes . . . like the one large class in the age of the many little-red-schoolhouses across our nation . . . are also often made up of individuals who are . . . widely varied . . . as to their spiritual ages, growth, emotional strengths, spiritual development and knowledge of God and His ways . . . and the specifics of the Catholic Church and her teachings for God’s children about our Wonderful God . . .

It is enormously important . . . for both the teachers and students of RCIA classes . . . to keep . . . focused . . . on the true mission of the RCIA class which is . . . seeking knowledge of God and a closer deepening walk with Him through our Holy Mother Church . . . and keeping the eyes and ears of the students souls open, centered and focused on introducing . . . our God and His marvelous holy nature and ways . . . and encouraging the development of a deeper awareness and the gaining of greater knowledge of God and a close loving relationship with Jesus . . . the Blessed Christ . . . and our Holy Mother Church . . . class by class . . . for those who may already have some knowledge and relationship with our Lord . . . as well as for those new to the Christian Faith . . .

An RCIA class is primarily there within the Church to teach individuals seeking the Lord . . . opening up saving knowledge as to His nature and His provision of holy pathways of life wherein we are to walk with Him . . . as revealed to our Apostolic Holy Roman Catholic Church . . . St. Thomas Acquinas beautifully shared this seeking for God in the below prayer . . .

. . . . . .
Give to me,
O Lord my God,
understanding of You,
diligence in seeking You,
wisdom in finding You,
discourse ever pleasing to You,
perseverance in waiting for You,
and confidence in finally embracing You.​

Dealing with the truths of the grave disorders and mortal sins of such heavy subjects as homosexuality and abortion . . . certainly should NOT be allowed to be the main conversation nor be allowed to dominate the first two weeks of a healthy RCIA class . . . and a good teacher should . . . firmly and tactfully . . . defer exploration of any depth of such matters of grave sin to a much later date . . .

LifeInSunshine . . . from reading your original post . . . it appears that the eyes of your soul were distracted from staying focused on the . . . Lord . . . and His good purpose for your life as a child of God . . . and a wholesome holy Catholic marriage as a goal for your future . . . I would encourage you to continue with the RCIA class . . . and share your concerns with the teacher of the class if this type of distraction toward such grave sin-dominated subjects as discussion topics continues . . . your class is a brand new RCIA class . . . and you all have so very . . . much . . . **much ** . . . more . . . that is . . . marvelously good . . . about Christ . . . and His Church . . . to learn and delight in . . .

God bless . . .

. . . all for Jesus+
. . . Sweet Spirit of our Holy God+
. . . guide, teach, protect and help this young soul+
. . . thank You Dear Lord+
. . . Blessed Virgin Mary our Mother+
. . . please pray for these dear ones in the RCIA class+​