Indulgences explained

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Ok, question for you Indulgence Man!!

This thread has helped me, so I’ll join in with the others who have thanked you for your time spent on this effort.

I’ve also read Cardinal Gibbons chapter on indulgences, and found it extremely helpful. But in none of my reading have I found an answer to this question. Maybe it’s because it’s not there, and I’m reading something into Indulgences that isn’t there. Here it is:

Are the criminal and or physical punishments of sin to be considered remitted in obtaining Indulgences? Like, I’d seriously think that they arent’, but though the question sounds silly, I am asking it with a seeking heart and I really would like to know the answer

For example : Say a person (a Catholic) falls into horrible sin through temptation, and has sex with a minor, and gets an STD from that person. Ok, they’ve got this disease, and also they are rightfully charged with statutory rape (I think that’s the right kind). If they are truly repentant and sorry, will they be cured of the disease and innocent of the rape charge, at least in God’s eyes and the Church’s eyes? Indeed, those two things are temporal consequences of that sin.

I would think that the releasing of sin’s consequences aren’t extended to those areas, but that’s a question I’ve got.

Thanks
 
Reformed Rob:
Are the criminal and or physical punishments of sin to be considered remitted in obtaining Indulgences? Like, I’d seriously think that they arent’, but though the question sounds silly, I am asking it with a seeking heart and I really would like to know the answer

For example : Say a person (a Catholic) falls into horrible sin through temptation, and has sex with a minor, and gets an STD from that person. Ok, they’ve got this disease, and also they are rightfully charged with statutory rape (I think that’s the right kind). If they are truly repentant and sorry, will they be cured of the disease and innocent of the rape charge, at least in God’s eyes and the Church’s eyes? Indeed, those two things are temporal consequences of that sin.

I would think that the releasing of sin’s consequences aren’t extended to those areas, but that’s a question I’ve got.

Thanks
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Not as far as I know. Yes, both are temporal consequences of sin.

As far as the rape charge, that is up to the state, not the church. God can heal someone of a disease, but it may be more important to that person’s salvation to have the disease to draw him closer to God. Remember, God chastises those who he loves (Hebrews 12:5-11).
 
Reformed Rob:
Ok, question for you Indulgence Man!!

Are the criminal and or physical punishments of sin to be considered remitted in obtaining Indulgences? Like, I’d seriously think that they arent’, but though the question sounds silly, I am asking it with a seeking heart and I really would like to know the answer

I would think that the releasing of sin’s consequences aren’t extended to those areas, but that’s a question I’ve got.

Thanks
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Perhaps your question arises from the location of the “temporal” punishment. Purgatory is a “place,” and it exists in “time.” The temporal punishments remitted by an indulgence are those of Purgatory. The earthly consequences of sin, which you name, remain.

See how easy that was?
 
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mercygate:
… Purgatory is a “place,” and it exists in “time.” …
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Are you sure about that? I was under the impression that it existed outside of time. Otherwise how could masses offered for departed ones NOW help to release loved ones from purgatory YEARS AGO?
 
Sir Knight:
Are you sure about that? I was under the impression that it existed outside of time. Otherwise how could masses offered for departed ones NOW help to release loved ones from purgatory YEARS AGO?
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Because they’re still there?
 
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mercygate:
Because they’re still there?
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It was explained to me that a Mass which we have offered up for a loved one tomorrow may have been instrumental in getting that person released from purgatory yesterday (or last month, or last year).

In order for that to make sense, purgatory needs to exist outside of the normal timeline.
 
Are you sure about that? I was under the impression that it existed outside of time. Otherwise how could masses offered for departed ones NOW help to release loved ones from purgatory YEARS AGO?
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Because God in His infinite wisdom knew the prayers would be offered?
 
Actually, didn’t the Pope recently speak on Purgatory? Wasn’t it something along the lines that Purgatory is not actually a place but …? What did he call it? A state?
 
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MariaG:
Actually, didn’t the Pope recently speak on Purgatory? Wasn’t it something along the lines that Purgatory is not actually a place but …? What did he call it? A state?
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Purgatory is not a place in the physical or material sense. It is a state of being that has not been defined by the Church. Some theologians have speculated that the anguish of Purgatory is separation from the direct presence of God. Others have conjectured that Pugatory is a place of torment and punishment. Probably the best approach is to sin as little as possible, go to Confession regularly, and gain as many indulgences as possible. The good news about Pugatory is that eventually the soul is freed to proceed to his heavenly reward. Because Purgatory exists outside of the material realm–and therefore outside of human experience–we should not think of it in terms of the actual passage of physical time but more as a state of subjective mental awareness of our being cleansed from all stain of sin.
 
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MariaG:
Actually, didn’t the Pope recently speak on Purgatory? Wasn’t it something along the lines that Purgatory is not actually a place but …? What did he call it? A state?
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Whether it is a place or a state, it does not outlast time. When time is no more, neither will there be Purgatory.
 
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mercygate:
Perhaps your question arises from the location of the “temporal” punishment. Purgatory is a “place,” and it exists in “time.” The temporal punishments remitted by an indulgence are those of Purgatory. The earthly consequences of sin, which you name, remain.

See how easy that was?
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Ok, that helps, and yes that was easy. But I thought that from earlier in the thread that Indulgences also remitted or lessened the time one was to not receive the Eucharist (temporal punishment) and that somehow, the temporal punishment of the desire to continue in sin was remitted or lessened.

From CCC 1472 and 1473

On the other hand every sin, even venial, entails an unhealthy attachment to creatures, which must be purified either here on earth, or after death in the state called Purgatory.

While patiently bearing sufferings and trials of all kinds and, when the day comes, serenely facing death, the Christian must strive to accept this temporal punishment of sin as a grace. He should strive by works of mercy and charity, as well as by prayer and the various practices of penance, to put off completely the “old man” and to put on the "new man

I’m not arguing against something here, I’m just wanting to make sure I’m correctly understanding what the Catechism is teaching.
 
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RNRobert:
Concluded…

“The act of gaining indulgences is nothing more than external religiosity.”

Can getting indulgences be nothing more than a legalistic ritual? Yes, it can be abused in that way. But, so can many other things, including things we share with our Protestant brethren, such as churchgoing, Bible reading, and prayer. These things are good and necessary in our Spiritual life, but like indulgences, merit us nothing unless we use them to draw close to God and allow him to transform our lives. How many people (Catholic and Protestant) go to church often, carry a Bible around (and perhaps even read it) or say their prayers daily, yet remain unchanged? Just because they can be abused, does not negate their purpose.

Conclusion

Why do we need indulgences? Because our Heavenly Father knows we are creatures of habit. As someone once told me, “Bad habits are easy to make and hard to break, while good habits are hard to make and easy to break.” Therefore, Christ (through his Church) gave us indulgences as a way to foster good spiritual habits (prayer, reading of Scripture, almsgiving, reception of the Eucharist, etc) in order to transform our lives and be united with Christ.
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Hi Robert,
Wow what a mammoth work.
In 1478 you have the words, granted her by Christ Jesus. This “her” I understand as being the Church. Can you tell me why the church is refer to as " her"
After reading these pages and scratching my head , I am pleased I am not catholic, bound by so many complications open to misunderstanding and seemingly like laws.
You finish on " Christ gave us indulgences etc." I am blessed, because He gave me the Holy Spirit who leads me to Jesus who has consecrated Himself to meet my every need.
To me, Roman catholics are on the hard road to Christ. I love you and feel for you.
Christ be with youhttp://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon7.gif
walk in love
edwinG
 
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edwinG:
Can you tell me why the church is refer to as " her"
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edwinG, Am I confusing you with somebody else? I thought you were an Anglican. Anglicans know that she is “she” because “She” is the Bride of Christ. I beg your pardon if I have misidentified you.
To me, Roman catholics are on the hard road to Christ. . . . edwinG
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Right! Our Lord said it would be a hard road, so we wouldn’t have it any other way. Paradoxes all over the place: “My yoke is easy” . . . “take up your cross” . . .

Things like indulgences actually ease the journey.
 
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mercygate:
Right! Our Lord said it would be a hard road, so we wouldn’t have it any other way. Paradoxes all over the place: “My yoke is easy” . . . “take up your cross” . . .

Things like indulgences actually ease the journey.
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:amen:

Nobody said following Christ would be easy. Although, since becoming Catholic the journey has become easier since I have the ALL the tools for holiness that Jesus placed at our disposal: Eucharist, confession, indulgences, etc…
 
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edwinG:
Hi Robert,
Wow what a mammoth work.
In 1478 you have the words, granted her by Christ Jesus. This “her” I understand as being the Church. Can you tell me why the church is refer to as " her"
After reading these pages and scratching my head , I am pleased I am not catholic, bound by so many complications open to misunderstanding and seemingly like laws.
You finish on " Christ gave us indulgences etc." I am blessed, because He gave me the Holy Spirit who leads me to Jesus who has consecrated Himself to meet my every need.
To me, Roman catholics are on the hard road to Christ. I love you and feel for you.
Christ be with youhttp://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon7.gif
walk in love
edwinG
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Hi Edwin! 👋

As the Gipper said, “There you go again.” As in previous threads, you put the argument as a “Church versus the Holy Spirit” context, where in reality the Holy Spirit works through the Church (as well as the individual believer). When Jesus gave the power to retain and forgive sins in John 20:23, he wasn’t granting it to the individual believer, but to the Apostles. The granting of indulgences (not to mention the forgivesness of sins in Confession) is merely the Church using it’s Spirit-given authority to bind and loose.

I actually feel sorry for those who are NOT Catholics becuase they are missing out on all the blessings that the Holy Spirit has to give through the Church that Jesus founded.
 
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