Inquiries For Protestants

[Anna_Scott]

Thanks Anna. I thought Robert asked a very good question. As a fellow “evangelical Catholic”, it is one I ask myself. But the thread seemed to immediately change tones.
Jon

It’s amazing how quickly things can take a wrong turn. Sometimes things “take on a life of their own,” as the old saying goes.

Anna

 

[AmateurPianist]

Where was the Church from 100 A.D. to the 1500s?

Good question. Of course the church started in Jerusalem, and from there spread throughout the Roman Empire. One thing you might not be aware of is that is spread to India under St. Thomas and remained fairly automonous until discovered by the Oriental Orthodox in the 300s or so. One interesting study I would I would like to research is how many of these autonomous groups were in existence during this time period.

Speaking of which, the Oriental Orthodox in the 300s I think was the first major point where the church divided. The next big division was the eastern church in the 1000s or so. The final big division, the Protestant reformation was in the 1500s.

This does not include smaller divisions. Some of the smaller divisions were clearly heretical groups (gnostics and Arians). Some I would want to study about because there has been some debate that I have read (Donatists, Waldenses (spelling)).

But anyway, that is where the Church was from 100 AD to the 1500s.

Didn’t Jesus say He wanted the Church to be one? Didn’t He also say that a people divided against themselves shall not stand?

Luke 11:17
But he, knowing their thoughts, said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and a house divided against a house falleth.

Well yes. I sort of have my doubts whether what we see today is what Jesus had in mind when He designed the church.

The more interesting question in my mind though is what if anything is He going to do to fix it and from a personal standpoint will it be in my lifetime.

Have you ever read the Church Fathers?

Well yes I have as a matter of fact, although I do not consider myself an expert on the subject.

If so, why do you still deny the Catholic Church, despite the early Church teachings being in line with many modern Catholic teachings that Protestants do not uphold?

From my reading, I can not conclude that they are more anything than anything else. And I would not presume to speak for them as to what church they would prefer if you could somehow beam them up to this time period.

One thing that I do know is that the ECF were passionate for Jesus Christ. I would suspect they would choose the local church in their community that radiated the same passion for Jesus Christ that they had.

 

[Xavierlives]

Where was the Church from 100 A.D. to the 1500s?

Didn’t Jesus say He wanted the Church to be one? Didn’t He also say that a people divided against themselves shall not stand?

Luke 11:17
But he, knowing their thoughts, said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and a house divided against a house falleth.

Have you ever read the Church Fathers? If so, why do you still deny the Catholic Church, despite the early Church teachings being in line with many modern Catholic teachings that Protestants do not uphold?

Thank you.

The Jews questioned Jesus in a similar fashion. Their questions were both an attempt to snare and maybe simultaneously a weak attempt to understand.

They said in John 8:13
The Pharisees therefore said to Him, “You bear witness of Yourself; Your witness is not true.”

They are saying, you are testifying of your faith, but you cannot testify for yourself, because everyone knows, the Jewish law requires two witnesses to validate the truth.

Jesus answers them with John 8:14-18
14 Jesus answered and said to them, “Even if I bear witness of Myself, My witness is true, for I know where I came from and where I am going; but you do not know where I come from and where I am going. 15 You judge according to the flesh; I judge no one. 16 And yet if I do judge, My judgment is true; for I am not alone, but I am with the Father who sent Me. 17 It is also written in your law that the testimony of two men is true. 18 I am One who bears witness of Myself, and the Father who sent Me bears witness of Me.”

So personally, I only need one witness. I have three witnesses. My earthly witness comes from the blessing of marriage. While, I’d like to say their will be an army of witnesses I could select from when the time comes, I know that I can testify to my wife’s amazing faith. I also know she can testify to my faith. But, maybe that is not enough for you. I then have the witness of the scripture, I need only to look there so point toward as a constant witness. Then I have one final witness, who unlike other legal systems, happens to be my judge. I have the witness of my heart, Jesus Christ.

So to answer your questions:

1. I can only speak for my short time on this planet. I can speak to those around me. What happened from 100 AD to 1500 AD is relevant to those who lived in the time.
2. My house is not divided.

I leave you with Joshua 24:15
But if serving the LORD seems undesirable to you, then choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve, whether the gods your forefathers served beyond the River, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land you are living. But as for me and my household, we will serve the LORD."