Intelligent Design

[Bahman]

Baffling and incoherent.

Ed

That is not correct if you read throughly. Do you agree that (C) is correct?

 

[grannymh]

Is change intelligent?

Is change a design?

This cranky (feminine of snarky) granny can understand that discussing concepts like change can be very interesting because of the challenge. I would think that the real challenge would be to connect “change” with some kind of philosophical approach to the real existence of God as Creator. (Genesis 1: 1)
For me

For sharing

 

[Bahman]

Is change intelligent?

Is change a design?

This cranky (feminine of snarky) granny can understand that discussing concepts like change can be very interesting because of the challenge. I would think that the real challenge would be to connect “change” with some kind of philosophical approach to the real existence of God as Creator. (Genesis 1: 1)
For me

For sharing

I have a proof for that in here. But that provide a proof for existence of gods. God is pure existence hence it cannot be experienced at all also it cannot be deduced. You can read the proof for the second part in here.

 

[grannymh]

I have a proof for that in here. But that provide a proof for existence of gods. God is pure existence hence it cannot be experienced at all also it cannot be deduced. You can read the proof for the second part in here.

Please correct me…it now seems that the basic concept is existence instead of change. Or are we back to consciousness?

In order to use the deduction method, we need to choose a few basic facts or truths. From that we can deduce other truths. As we do this, we need to test each truth that we have deduced.

Let us start with a couple of truths. Here are some ideas which we can work with.

a. A human being is conscious of his own person.
b. A human being is conscious of his surroundings.

Note: a. and b. are based on a dictionary definition of conscious. “1. having an awareness of one’s environment and one’s own existence, sensations, and thoughts.”
In reality, a. and b. could be proofs for a number of things. This is because we can look at both ourselves and other human beings.

Usually, when we list a number of statements, such as those which appear in this thread, we have an idea of where we are headed or what our goal is. Thus, what is your goal and how are you going to get there? Is your goal to find God? Is your goal to understand God’s existence or to understand His power to create? Are you trying to understand what is happening around you? That could be changes. Are you looking for the cause of some particular change?

 

[Bahman]

Please correct me…it now seems that the basic concept is existence instead of change. Or are we back to consciousness?

Well. Consciousness is necessary for changes and it is primary. Existence is created by consciousness constantly to make sure changes can be experience hence existence is secondary. It could be argued that the existence and consciousness come together meaning that absence of change is just absence of existence but not nonexistence. I however have an argument that show that they do not come together and consciousness is primary. You can read about it here. This means that we have two series of E={ existence, nonexistence, …} and C={absence of existence, experience, …}. It is importance to know that existence comes with absence of existence and nonexistence comes with experience since the later situation grant the freedom of action. In simple word, we have the ability to create a situation only in nonexistence.

In order to use the deduction method, we need to choose a few basic facts or truths. From that we can deduce other truths. As we do this, we need to test each truth that we have deduced.

Let us start with a couple of truths. Here are some ideas which we can work with.

a. A human being is conscious of his own person. (through the reflection of reality in consciousness and not directly)
b. A human being is conscious of his surroundings. (surrounding including our bodies can be experienced directly)

Note: a. and b. are based on a dictionary definition of conscious. “1. having an awareness of one’s environment and one’s own existence, sensations, and thoughts.”
In reality, a. and b. could be proofs for a number of things. This is because we can look at both ourselves and other human beings.

I define consciousness as the ability to experience and affect existence the latter is crucial since otherwise we are only dealing with the absence of existence.

Usually, when we list a number of statements, such as those which appear in this thread, we have an idea of where we are headed or what our goal is. Thus, what is your goal and how are you going to get there?

To look for the truth and find the truth honestly. I am pretty sure that we are cognitively closed to most of the thing we have never experienced.

Is your goal to find God?

Being cannot be goal but the truth which hopefully endless since absence of new experience is the prison of thoughts. Real Hell.

Is your goal to understand God’s existence or to understand His power to create?

Only truth who some equates it with God which I disagree since God cannot be experienced hence truth if one equate them. The idea is search the truth, know the truth and truth shall set us free.

Are you trying to understand what is happening around you?

That is true and it is not bounded to what so called materialist world, it is boundless. One needs a clear mind and heart to get through.

That could be changes. Are you looking for the cause of some particular change?

Truth is the only reality that can be looked for.

 

[grannymh]

For general information.

The words in blue in the below quote are not part of my original post 1055.

Originally Posted by grannymh forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_khaki/viewpost.gif
*In order to use the deduction method, we need to choose a few basic facts or truths. From that we can deduce other truths. As we do this, we need to test each truth that we have deduced.

Let us start with a couple of truths. Here are some ideas which we can work with.

a. A human being is conscious of his own person. (through the reflection of reality in consciousness and not directly)*
b. A human being is conscious of his surroundings. (surrounding including our bodies can be experienced directly)

Note: a. and b. are based on a dictionary definition of conscious. “1. having an awareness of one’s environment and one’s own existence, sensations, and thoughts.”
In reality, a. and b. could be proofs for a number of things. This is because we can look at both ourselves and other human beings.

 

[magnet]

When a person is asleep, we say that he/she is unconscious. When a person is in a coma, he/she is unconscious. When a person faints, he/she is unconscious.

All of these are states of the brain. A week-old fetus does not have a brain. Therefore a fetus cannot be conscious.

 

[Bahman]

When a person is asleep, we say that he/she is unconscious. When a person is in a coma, he/she is unconscious. When a person faints, he/she is unconscious.

All of these are states of the brain. A week-old fetus does not have a brain. Therefore a fetus cannot be conscious.

What is your definition of consciousness?
How consciousness can affect brain if itself is a byproduct of brain?

 

[grannymh]

What is your definition of consciousness?
How consciousness can affect brain if itself is a byproduct of brain?

In my humble opinion, if one is going to answer the OP’s question
"Can anyone who is knowledgeable in this subject please explain the difference between Theistic Evolution vs Intelligent Design?’
one’s brain needs to be in the state of consciousness.