Interesting - Eucharistic Flash Mob

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It was planned, and you are in denial of that because it means everything you have said is a waste of time.
Planned as in the parish informed and the community knows?

Or do you mean a bunch of Friars got together and “Planned”?

Because if its the first, then there is no problem. That is not what the Brother has been saying though. Flash Mob which is the title of the thread doesn’t say the same either.

If its the 2nd, then there is obviously a problem which what is what that has been discussed here. There is no denial I am afraid except an objection.

If you want to defend, explain why it is a necessity to have the event Randomly.

God Bless 🙂
 
I don’t think he is taking it personally. I think he’s taking it seriously, because this person darko persists in a frustrating denial.

imo, darko seems to want to put mundane concerns first and foremost in all matters. This results in appeasement and the stripping of Catholicism of it’s treasures.

It’s radical liberalism, which is incompatible with anything traditional.
You think I am a radical liberal because I oppose Random Public Eucharist Adoration? :o

Would it hurt for you to actually understand my position. I am against the Random events. I am all for planned, informed public events.

As much as I may frustrate you, you should be able to show me why the randomness is a necessity. Neither you nor the Brother has managed to do so. As I understand, now you seem to even want to claim that it is planned?

God Bless 🙂
 
So public mass/adoration/rosary can certainly bring lapsed Catholics back to the church.
Is there a problem with random public Rosaries too? I’m sure those with Montfortian and Dominican spiritualities would disagree with you there.

Also, he might not be assigned to a parish. If that’s the case then there’s no parish to invite 🙂

And not everything needs to be planned. People don’t plan prophesy or visions, healings or other gifts. God works how God works.
 
Is there a problem with random public Rosaries too? I’m sure those with Montfortian and Dominican spiritualities would disagree with you there.
Actually no, there is no confusion with saying the Rosary. I just put that in for completeness in terms of possible public events. You can pray it silently whenever you want, anyway??
Also, he might not be assigned to a parish. If that’s the case then there’s no parish to invite 🙂
It’s not about assignment. It’s about informing. If someone is holding mass in the mall, don’t they want the faithful to come? So inform the parish. Thats my point. Otherwise it serves no one or is less effective.

Whats more effective in terms of turn-out and prepared participation? Having mass after telling the parishioners where and when its going to be or having it randomly in a random location at a random time?

So since there is more effect in planing and informing the people, I see no reason why someone should pursue random acts.
And not everything needs to be planned. People don’t plan prophesy or visions, healings or other gifts. God works how God works.
Sure, not everything needs to be planned. The question here is, having the full freedom to plan and inform, why must these good friars by pass all of that?

As far as I can see, there is no valid reason to justify randomness in this case.

God Bless 🙂
 
Someone asked. We all receive.

The narrator has a bit of an accent (to me), so there are some omissions and if someone wishes to double-check and make a correction, go for it!
Jesus Christ is in every book of the Bible.
In Genesis, Jesus is the seed of the woman.
In Exodus, He’s the Passover lamb.
In Leviticus, He’s the Priest, the altar and the lamb of sacrifice.
In Numbers, he is the pillar of cloud? by day and pillar of fire by night.
In Deuteronomy, Jesus is the prophet like Moses.
Come and kneel before Him now.
In Joshua, Jesus is the captain of our salvation.
In Judges, He is our judge and lawgiver.
In Ruth, He is our kinsman redeemer.
In 1 and 2 Samuel, He is our trusted Prophet.
In Kings and Chronicles, He is our reigning king.
In Ezra, He is the rebuilder of the broken down walls of human life.
Come and kneel before Him now.
In Nehemiah, Jesus is our restorer.
In Tobit, He is the messenger of new life.
In Judith, He is weakness turned into victory.
In Esther, He’s our advocate.
In 1 and 2 Maccabees, He is the leader who dies for God’s law.
Come and kneel before Him now.
In Job, Jesus is our ever-living redeemer.
In Pslams, He is our shepdarhed
In Proverbs, He is our wisdom
In Ecclesiastes, He is our hope of ressurcttion.
In the Song of Songs, He is our loving bride-groom.
In Wisdom, He is the emenation of God’s thought.
In Ecclesiasis, Jesus is our security.
Come and kneel before Him now.
In Isaiah, Jesus is the suffering servant.
In Jeremiah, He is the righteoud
In Lamentations, He is our weeping prophet.
In Baruch, He is mercy from the eternal one.
In Ezekiel, He is the one with the right to rule.
In Daniel, Jesus is the fourth man in the firing furnace.
Come and kneel before Him now.
In Hosea, Jesus is the faithful husband forever married to the sinner.
In Job, He is the one that baptizes with the Holy Spirit and fire.
In Amos, He is the restorer of justice
In Obadiah, He is mighty to save.
In Jonah, He is our great foreign missionary.
In Micah, Jesus is the feat? of one who brings good news.
Come and kneel before Him now.
In Nahum, Jesus is our stronghold in the day of trouble.
In Habakkuk, He is God my savoir.
In Zephaniah, He is the King of Israel.
In Hagggai, He is the ?
In Zechariah, He is our humble King riding on a coat.
In Malachi, Jesis is the son of righteousness.
Come and kneel before Him now.
In Matthew, Jesus is God with us.
In Mark, He is the song of God.
In Luke, He is the son of Mary, feeling what you feel.
In John, He is the bread of life.
In Acts, Jesus is the savoir of the world.
Come and kneel before Him now.
In Romans, Jesus is the righteousness of God.
In 1 Corrinthians, He is the resurection.
In 2 Corrinthians, He is the God of all comfort.
In Galatians, He is your liberty. He sets you free.
In Ephesians, Jesus is the head of the church.
Come and kneel before Him now.
In Philippians, Jesus is your joy.
In Collossians, He is your completeness.
In 1 and 2 Thessalonians, He is your hope.
In 1 Timothy, He is your faith.
In 2 Timothy, Jesus is your stability.
Come and kneel before Him now.
In Titus, Jesus is truth.
In Philemon, He is your benefactor.
In Hebrews, He is your perfection.
In James, He is the power behind your faith.
In 1 Peter, He is your example.
In 2 Peter, Jesus is your purity.
Come and kneel before Him now.
In 1 John, Jesus is your life.
In 2 John, He is your pattern.
In 3 John, He is your motivation.
In Jude, He is the foundation of your faith.
In Revelations, Jesus is your coming King.
He is the first and the last, the beginning and the end, He is the keeper of creation and the creator of all. He is the artichect of the universe, and the manager of all time. He always was, He always is, and He always will be unmoved unchanged undefeated and never undone.
He was bruised and brought healing. He was piereced and eased pain. He was persecuted and brought freedom. He was dead and brought life. He is risen and brings power. He reigns and brings peace.
The world can’t understand Him.
The armies can’t defeat Him.
Schools can’t explain Him
And the leaders can’t ignore Him.
Herod couldnt’ kill Him.
The pharises couldn’t confuse Him.
The people couldn’t hold Him.
Nero couldnt’ crush Him
Hitler couldn’t silence Him.
The New Age can’t replace Him
And Orpah and can’t exole Him away.
He is life, love, lengevity, and Lord. ???
He is Holy, righteous, mighty, powerful, pure. ?? His words eternal. His rules unchanging and his mind is un____?
He is my redeemer, He is my savoir, He is my God, He is my priest.
He is my joy, He is my comfort, He is My Lord, and He rules my life.
Glory to God!
 
I am not sure if you are aware, but people don’t make decisions like this based on one video.

Some people can show you a video where the Catholic church did some bad things in history. Does that mean the Catholic Church is bad? No.

So similarly, when someone makes a general claim about an action, to cite one occasion where it all went nice or bad does nothing.
Could you please cite any instance where anything like this has ever happened and it was confusing?

Right now, we just have one internet commenter insisting, “This is confusing and it made no sense,” while the people who were actually there on that day were obviously not confused and it did make sense to them. Are you now retreating to the position that this time it was understandable and made sense, but this video is probably an outlier and in the mine run of cases it would be confusing and make no sense? If so, do you have any support for that assertion?
If I were walking down the road, I would be confused as to what this man is doing. It is also possible for an imposter to do the same with a wafer and make a joke out of it.
If this presentation and witness could be confused with mockery, then bring on the mockers and scorners by the hundreds and thousands, I say. Just think of the countless people whose Catholic faith they will inadvertently inspire by being so accidentally effective at spreading the love of Christ and adoration of the Eucharist.
Now answer my question, what is the necessity for it to be Random? I see no valid reason for such events to be random.
Why are you so focused on the issue of “necessity”? I’m sure the friars would not claim that one mode or another of making such a presentation was “necessary,” and if you did the same thing but with a notice in the parish bulletin beforehand, I’m sure they would not say “Then you screwed it up, because it is necessary that it be random.” The fact was that they chose to do it this way.

You are the one who is making claims about necessity – that it is necessary to have anything like this scheduled in advance and carried out only at specified times and places. But this is a necessity of your own invention.
And for your information, I have no problem with the Tabernacle in the center and I actually prefer it that way.
Ironically, given my remarks above which were merely intended to show the poverty of a certain style of argumentation, I have seen people on this forum who were, in fact, deeply confused by the tabernacle about the nature of the Mass. Oh well.
 
Could you please cite any instance where anything like this has ever happened and it was confusing?

Right now, we just have one internet commenter insisting, “This is confusing and it made no sense,” while the people who were actually there on that day were obviously not confused and it did make sense to them. Are you now retreating to the position that this time it was understandable and made sense, but this video is probably an outlier and in the mine run of cases it would be confusing and make no sense? If so, do you have any support for that assertion?

If this presentation and witness could be confused with mockery, then bring on the mockers and scorners by the hundreds and thousands, I say. Just think of the countless people whose Catholic faith they will inadvertently inspire by being so accidentally effective at spreading the love of Christ and adoration of the Eucharist.

Why are you so focused on the issue of “necessity”? I’m sure the friars would not claim that one mode or another of making such a presentation was “necessary,” and if you did the same thing but with a notice in the parish bulletin beforehand, I’m sure they would not say “Then you screwed it up, because it is necessary that it be random.” The fact was that they chose to do it this way.

You are the one who is making claims about necessity – that it is necessary to have anything like this scheduled in advance and carried out only at specified times and places. But this is a necessity of your own invention.

Ironically, given my remarks above which were merely intended to show the poverty of a certain style of argumentation, I have seen people on this forum who were, in fact, deeply confused by the tabernacle about the nature of the Mass. Oh well.
Ok keep this simple.

A sample size of one video is not “experimental evidence” towards anything. Lets get that out of the way.

Now we are all gifted with reason. So lets take a look at this through the eyes of reason.

The point of having adoration or any other public event is to have participants and get non-believers become curious and ask the participants whats going on or do research etc.

Having an event randomly in a random location at a random time has less chance of having participants compared to having it at a designated time after informing the Catholics in that parish. I think this is common sense but it appears that not many see this for some reason.

In light of the above, and considering there is no justification for Randomness on its own, it is pretty clear that one must pursue public events after informing and organizing them properly.

Thats all I am saying. Is this that hard to understand or are you already fixated with thinking I am a radical liberal for making such claims and therefore I MUST BE WRONG?

God Bless 🙂
 
Ok keep this simple.

A sample size of one video is not “experimental evidence” towards anything. Lets get that out of the way.
You’re mistaken. You claimed, “It’s confusing to everyone.” One instance where it was not confusing at all is contrary evidence, much as the existence of a single black swan disproves the hypothesis that there are no black swans.
The point of having adoration or any other public event is to have participants and get non-believers become curious and ask the participants whats going on or do research etc.
Having an event randomly in a random location at a random time has less chance of having participants compared to having it at a designated time after informing the Catholics in that parish. I think this is common sense but it appears that not many see this for some reason.
Even if we did think that “the point” of adoration is to inspire curiosity (which is wrong, although it may be a side benefit), who would ever imagine that this is more likely to happen by scheduling it at some parish on some Tuesday than by taking it out into the public at an unexpected time? I’m trying to imagine you walking up to a street preacher and saying, “You know, you’d get your message out a lot more effectively if you scheduled a time for your sermon and did it in a church.” Or telling a local company, “Hey, instead of putting your ads on the sides of buses where they can only be seen randomly, you should try posting them all in one place and inviting people to see them at specified times. Why is the randomness so necessary? I see no justification for it.”

Probably the street-preacher analogy is the best one. Think of these friars as street preachers, and you will understand why your demands that they shuffle back to church don’t even compute.
In light of the above, and considering there is no justification for Randomness on its own, it is pretty clear that one must pursue public events after informing and organizing them properly.
Let’s list some reasons:
  • Perhaps, as friars, they don’t have a parish in the first place.
  • Doing it in public makes a powerful statement that God and Catholic worship belong in public, not confined to churches where only Catholics need be confronted with them.
  • Many people will not bother to go to scheduled adoration and may not even know what it is or understand why it should be important to them (certainly non-Catholics would virtually never go). For those there that day, this showed them.
  • It is sometimes nice to have things of beauty in public. We would, for instance, be poorer if all public art were shut up in museums. That’s not to criticize museums, but it makes no sense in the case of any single statue to demand, “What is the necessity of having this particular statue in public? If there is no necessity, it must be in museum. After all, it could be damaged in public.” Some things are not necessary, but are nice because they are beautiful and enriching for everyone.
Thats all I am saying. Is this that hard to understand or are you already fixated with thinking I am a radical liberal for making such claims and therefore I MUST BE WRONG?
God Bless 🙂
No, you just are wrong. If your claim was that it would be better if they scheduled it and kept it inside church doors, then that would be something that could be evaluated with pro- and con- arguments. I thought you were heading in that direction, but now you seem to have abandoned the “it’s too confusing” theory of argumentation for the logically flawed line, “Since you cannot prove that it is necessary that it be random, then it is necessary that it be scheduled.” Fallacy of the excluded middle, there.
 
Btw, I apologize because I actually did not know you were really a part of a religious order. I talked to you as if I were talking to a layperson and thought that you simply liked to be called brother or something. I’ve met others like that who even use Br., Fr. title in their names in this forum but are actually not so please excuse my confusion.
No, we are the real thing. That is how we came to be the OSF (Order of St. Francis). There are many Franciscan obediences that spring from one of the larger communities. In addition, more are emerging every day. This is one of the reasons. Vatican II commanded the religious orders to return to our roots and to the vision of our founders. Some orders had grown so huge and had deviated so far from the original vision that the only way to return is to do it in small numbers. While retaining the line of succession, one or more Friars, sisters, nuns or Secular Franciscans will gather into smaller communities preserving the rule and adopting the constitutions to fit the customs of prior to 1500.
Br. JR,

You know that I respect you tremendously but I think you are taking this too personally and you are making this all about your order.

A non-religious priest could have done this. It would be the same debate.
The reason that I’m taking this seriously is because MAY BE a violation of law on the part of the laity. I say may be, because to violate law you have to know that you’re doing so. Let’s take this objectively.

This is a Capuchin Friar. The Capuchins belong to the Franciscan Family. The Council of Trent declared that the Franciscans and several other orders that are not involved in this case are exempt for the intervention of both the bishop and the laity. It declared that the intervention of either was anathema. It specifically spelled out that the major superior of a religious order, if he is a priest, has the same authority as a bishop. If the major superior is not a priest, the religious order is assigned a Cardinal in Rome to protect it from the laity and the bishops.

When people try to dictate to these exempt orders, they are breaking the law, because the law prohibits this. It’s like when we told Black people not to drink water from fountains marked “white”. If there is a law that says that, we may not say that to them, then to say it is a violation of law.

The good thing is that church law is much more merciful than civil law. In the Church, ignorance of the law does excuse you. We always assume that people don’t know and we try to explain it so that they know for the future.
What I am opposed to is
  1. A friar/priest who wakes up in the morning and from his very good intentions decides drive or walk to a random location and have Eucharist Adoration.
I may not have helped either. I should have explained it more clearly. The custom is not new. It’s very old. There was never any regulation as to where the friars could do this. Francis opposed having too many regulations.

However, there are points that Francis includes in his rule that must be observed and they would apply here.
  1. You may not do anything that the bishop prohibits. This means that you can’t just get up and walk out with the Eucharist. You must make sure that this is OK with the bishop.
  2. Even if the bishop allows it, you may not do anything that Francis prohibits. You must make sure that he has permitted it either by writing it in his rule or by precedent. In other words, it was done by him or by someone else and he approved.
  3. The Guardian (local superior) must give his permission. He has to know what the plan is. No friar, in any obedience is allowed to engage in any ministry without the knowledge and blessing of the local superior. If the local superior has doubts as to whether the bishop or Francis would approve, he must ask the question of the right person, before he grants permission.
  4. If something proves to be a poor idea, the local superior or the bishop have the right to stop it. They agree that this is not a good idea and they superior delivers the message to the friars. It’s over. That simple. We don’t complicate your our lives and we hope that you will learn from us not to complicate your own.
This is not done without thinking or prayer. Francis simply wanted to keep this very simple. He sums it up in two simple rules. “The brothers must obey Francis.” In addition, “The brothers shall not minister without the permission of the local bishop.” Once you have both of those, you set to go.

We’re tending to put our 21st century mind into the head of a 13th century founder, whom the Church does not want us to change and whom the Church is demanding that his sons return to his way of thinking and seeing things.
 
That does not help much people and on the contrary, can lead even faithful to confusion as to whats going on.
The faithful are always going to be confused, because they don’t understand religious life and most of them have no interest in understanding male religious. Most people don’t care about charisms. They care about benefit. “What does a religious community do?” I’ll give you an example. Our own family has less priests than most. We have many friars who are not priests. We try to explain to people that a non ordained friar will be as much help as an ordained, unless they need to receive a sacrament, everything else they can get from a non ordained friar. We try to tell people that they cannot treat our non ordained friars as if they were second class religious or as if they were too dumb to be priests. Many of them are our superiors. Some are our formators in the novitiate and seminary. They’re doctors of theology and canon law. Some are physicians and administrators and some are cooks, carpenters and gardeners, but we are all equal in rank, rights and duties. Do you think that the average lay person every listens? They don’t even pray for our non-ordained brothers.

Ask them to pray for congregations of brothers such as the Alexians and Christian Brothers who are no needed. Most people don’t do it. They want a priest to hear their confession and celebrate their mass. The consecrated life of the male religious is something that is nice, but not important to the layperson. If they don’t make an effort to find out who these men are and just believe that everyone who wear a tunic is a priest and all priests are the same, then they’re confused. This is a chance to educate the Catholic rather than stifle the spirit of a religious tradition.

The fact that people get confused is not a good reason to stop something. It’s an opportunity to educate and convert the Catholic to the Catholic faith. This was something that Clare often said. She often told the friars that it was good for them to go to the foreign missions, but not to forget that Catholics needed to be converted to Catholicism. She understood that most Catholics did not know their faith or their history. They were not bad people. They were good people who were not well educated in the Catholic faith.
Why not inform the parish, and ask them to at least participate? What is the necessity for the Random nature of the act?
That takes you back to the exemption. They don’t have to inform parishioners. That does not mean that they cannot do so or that they did not do so. They do not have to do so. As exempt religious, they are free to do whatever is permitted by Canon Law, Diocesan Law and the Founder.

Also, we don’t know if these friars are even attached to a parish. Many friars are not attached to parishes. Most live in neighborhoods where their ministry is to walk the streets from the morning to the evening. Look at the Franciscans of the Renewal. They get up and walk the streets. They may take out a guitar and start jamming on a corner.

My community is not attached to any parish. We go to where there are pregnant people who want to abort babies, to the sick in hospitals who have no one to care for them, to the dying his hospice or at home. If night falls and we can’t get back to the community house, we ask people if we can sleep on their porch. Some of us work for the diocese and we go there or anywhere in the diocese where there is a need to proclaim the Gospel of Life. If you’re not attached to a parish, there’s no one to invite.

These are golden opportunities for people to learn about the different charisms that the Lord has given to the Church. They are golden opportunities for the non-Catholic to see the Lord going to them.

As I said, if the bishop and/or the superior feel that this is not a good idea, the friars drop the ministry. It’s that simple. You must learn to think like Francis. If God wants it, he’ll make it happen. If he doesn’t, he’ll speak through the bishop or the superior. You simply ask God what he wants and you go with whatever God tells you.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
This was awesome!

As for ddarko fear that nobody was touched other than the few who were kneeling… I guess you weren’t looking at that young asian girl who was wondering at the event. You just saw those wheels in her head turning, what’s to say that she wasn’t touched by this “random” event? Who’s to say that she didn’t go home and check out what happened?

I was also thinking on the “what if” it had been someone out to mock the Catholics by pretense? Guess what? I’d have knelt as well, although I might have only thought the wafer was actually Jesus, I would have been kneeling at who I thought was there. What matters is what Jesus thinks, not what the mockers think.
 
This was awesome!

As for ddarko fear that nobody was touched other than the few who were kneeling… I guess you weren’t looking at that young asian girl who was wondering at the event. You just saw those wheels in her head turning, what’s to say that she wasn’t touched by this “random” event? Who’s to say that she didn’t go home and check out what happened?

I was also thinking on the “what if” it had been someone out to mock the Catholics by pretense? Guess what? I’d have knelt as well, although I might have only thought the wafer was actually Jesus, I would have been kneeling at who I thought was there. What matters is what Jesus thinks, not what the mockers think.
I hear you. What happened there was good. It would be great to see it in every city every day.
 
I don’t think he is taking it personally. I think he’s taking it seriously, because this person darko persists in a frustrating denial.

imo, darko seems to want to put mundane concerns first and foremost in all matters. This results in appeasement and the stripping of Catholicism of it’s treasures.

It’s radical liberalism, which is incompatible with anything traditional.
My point is not about whether ddarko agrees or not. He has a right to his opinion.

However, I feel the conversation has taken a turn towards, are we against Franciscans and their traditions and I don’t think that is the gist of the discussion.

Because then one begins to be portrayed as anti-Franciscan and I don’t think that’s fair.

By the way, I think Saint Francis was and is awesome. 🙂
 
You’re mistaken. You the existence of a single black swan disproves the hypothesis that there are no black swans.
Oh I see I see. Ok my mistake for using “Everyone”. Lets change it to MANY. Does that sound good for you?

Let me readjust my point, your video is one instance. In that video, you see 100 people kneel. There would be another 100+ people who passed by confused. Another 100+ people who went out and said whats that idiot doing with a wafer. So to look at your video and say “oooh look at all these people who knelt” misses the point of how many didn’t kneel.

Do you think it right in the first place to go and kneel like that? What if I put on a brown robe, went to the middle with a piece of wafer and did the same thing? The people who would come and kneel will be committing idolatry.

Just spend an ounce of thought neutrally on this matter. If you were walking down the street in your mall, and you see an unknown guy, dressed like a priest pull something like in that video (prior to you watching it), would you know he was genuine?

The reasonable answer is NO. There can always be unreasonable people who would assume it is the real thing and do worship. But honestly, we both know how inappropriate that would be if it was just a wafer. So my point still stands, if it was organized, we wouldn’t have this problem. There is a guarantee and faithful can engage without suspicion in the activity.

Why you are stuck up on defending randomness, is really out of my grasp of comprehension.
Even if we did think that “the point” of adoration is to inspire curiosity (which is wrong, although it may be a side benefit), who would ever imagine that this is more likely to happen by scheduling it at some parish on some Tuesday than by taking it out into the public at an unexpected time? I’m trying to imagine you walking up to a street preacher and saying, …d inviting people to see them at specified times. Why is the randomness so necessary? I see no justification for it."
Ha? Is this just advertising? No right? I mean honestly, I what are you trying to prove here?

All I am saying is that you can do ADVERTISING AND give people the chance to Adoration by FIRST LETTING PEOPLE KNOW.

How on earth is this hard to comprehend? I can’t believe we are debating this.
Probably the street-preacher analogy is the best one. Think of these friars as street preachers, and you will understand why your demands that they shuffle back to church don’t even compute.
Street preacher is fine and dandy. But this is NOT preaching. As I said before, by all means, if that was preaching, what he did was acceptable. Stop making false equivocations.
Let’s list some reasons:
  • Perhaps, as friars, they don’t have a parish in the first place.
  • Doing it in public makes a powerful statement that God and Catholic worship belong in public, not confined to churches where only Catholics need be confronted with them.
  • Many people will not bother to go to scheduled adoration and may not even know what it is or understand why it should be important to them (certainly non-Catholics would virtually never go). For those there that day, this showed them.
  • It is sometimes nice to have things of beauty in public. We would, for instance, be poorer if all public art were shut up in museums. That’s not to criticize museums, but it makes no sense in the case of any single statue to demand, “What is the necessity of having this particular statue in public? If there is no necessity, it must be in museum. After all, it could be damaged in public.” Some things are not necessary, but are nice because they are beautiful and enriching for everyone.
Nothing you said above qualifies the need for randomness. At best, it shows why public adoration is good. And I wholeheartedly agree with you.

I am only against the randomness. Even if the friar has no parish, he can simply notify the parish priest.
No, you just are wrong. If your claim was that it would be better if they scheduled it and kept it inside church doors, then that would be something that could be evaluated with pro- and con- arguments. I thought you were heading in that direction, but now you seem to have abandoned the “it’s too confusing” theory of argumentation for the logically flawed line, “Since you cannot prove that it is necessary that it be random, then it is necessary that it be scheduled.” Fallacy of the excluded middle, there.
Are you seriously reading what you type?

My point is the following. Notifying and having a designated place is more efficient and effective.

Randomness can still be justified if one can show that it is MORE EFFECTIVE or that it on his own intrinsic nature provides something different.

But as we can see, Randomness does not have such qualities. So my point was that we stick to the latter.

I have no clue what you are going with fallacies of excluded middle. This is a comparison between two things. If one is more effective than the other, you choose the other one. The problem statement has already been defined as a comparison between Random vs. Organized.

Now if your point is that there might be something better than Organized, sure. But as we have seen here, that can’t be random because it is already disqualified as performing less compared to Organized.

God Bless 🙂
 
I believe that we have to understand something else too. Franciscans, like Benedictines, Missionaries of Charity, Missionaries of the Poor, Jesuits and several other religious communities are in very few parishes.

Most are assigned to community houses known as friaries. These are in a neighborhood, usually a poor one. The men in those houses may or may not be priests. If they are not priests, they would attend mass where ever they can find one or a priest is paid to come in. If there is a friar-priest, he celebrates the community mass. In other words, they have very little to do with the parish.

For example, I live in a house that is three miles form a parish. I go there for Sunday mass. During the week, I we attend mass at the chancery. We have nothing to do with the parish. We and the priests at the parish are friendly and we help them out when they need it. They do the same for us. But we don’t invite their parishioners to anything that we do and they don’t invite us. Functions thar are run by religious are posted in parishes only if the religious administer the parish. Otherrwise, it’s not meant for the parishioners. If they hear about it and come, they’er always welcome.

Just today, there is a new house of sisters opening up a few blocks from us. The local parish was not informed, nor were we. We heard about it through a mutual friend of ours and the sisters. This is a fuction of the religious community, not the diocese or the local parish. Therefore, they do not share it. It’s going to be a big thing, with three bishops and many lay people, etc. But the people who live in the area don’t know that it’s being erected. They’ll find out as they see it.

Those are the separations that exist between independent religious houses and parishes. My guess is that these friars are not attached to a parish or they would have brought company. I don’t know what house they belong to, so I have no way of saying for sure. Heck, I can barely keep track of my own house. There are over 1.7 million Franciscan men and women today. That’s with a shortage of vocations. We’re in 114 countries, subdivited into about 112 obediences. It may be more by the time I finish this post. We seem to have a new community being born every week.

While everyone else is lacking vocations, we’re opening new communities and new houses. There are five new ones in the USA alone in the last 10 years. They are all like the guys in the video. They are itinerant, not attached to parishes or bishops. They get permission from a bishop to live in his diocese and they go to the streets. It’s actually very beautiful ministry. I’ve done it.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
This was awesome!

As for ddarko fear that nobody was touched other than the few who were kneeling… I guess you weren’t looking at that young asian girl who was wondering at the event. You just saw those wheels in her head turning, what’s to say that she wasn’t touched by this “random” event? Who’s to say that she didn’t go home and check out what happened?

I was also thinking on the “what if” it had been someone out to mock the Catholics by pretense? Guess what? I’d have knelt as well, although I might have only thought the wafer was actually Jesus, I would have been kneeling at who I thought was there. What matters is what Jesus thinks, not what the mockers think.
What matters is that the same thing could have been done by notifying and organizing the event first.

My point has always been that when you compare
  1. Organizing and notifying the faithful of such an event and holding it in a public area
  2. Randomly flashing it in a public area
The first option (1) above is the most effective and option (2) does not give any advantage over (1) in terms of effect on non-believers.

(2) on the other hand has possible downfalls of confusing the faithful in the parish as to whats going on, whether it is genuine or not, whether it is some nut-case with a wafer or not etc.

Considering those, option (1) is the better option to pursue if someone is really seriously thinking about what they are doing. On the other hand, if its just to end up on a video, well go ahead, pull those kind of stunts. In the end, they benefit less people than if they had done it with option (1).

God Bless 🙂
 
You really need to READ what I WROTE.

I am all for public adoration, masses, Rosary etc and I participate in many where I am from.

But that has to be routine, designated and known to the parish people. I am against RANDOM Eucharist Adoration like the stunt pulled in this video.

Did you ever bother to read or is it just fun to keep attacking straw man position?

God Bless 🙂
Well, You might have watched, but did you listen? I heard preaching…😉
 
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