Irish priests say they will disobey new confession box law on child abuse

[GraceSofia]

This leads me to a question that I have been thinking about since this thread popped up. Why would any Catholic in his right mind even entertain the possibility of a priest in the confessional doing work for the State, much less revealing what he has heard?

The idea violates everything that the Catholic Church has taught about confession and absolution for 2,000 years. Christ never put conditions on people when he forgave their sins, much less did he turn them over to the authorities. “Go your sins are forgiven.” That was it, end of discussion.

Why would any well educated Catholic entertain the idea of doing it any differently from the way that Christ did it? Only Christ knew what he was absolving, no one else. That has been the practice to this day. Only Christ knows what he is absolving, no one else.

I am stunned that any Catholic would consider the possibility.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

It shows how well the ground has been prepared to demonise and marginalise the Church.

I am still stunned by, for example, how many people (mostly non-Catholics, but many Catholics) thought it was fine for Catholic adoption agencies to close and for the U.S. government to mandate violating our consciences. It is very sad… amazing really… how much has been done slowly, slowly by the leftist media and education.

 

[gus]

Absolution is forgiveness. It’s something that comes from the priest and is dependent only on the sincerity of the confessor. How can there NOT be absolution?

If pedofilia is not curable than the only way absolution can be achieved is by giving oneself up.

 

[Farsight001]

If pedofilia is not curable than the only way absolution can be achieved is by giving oneself up.

I think you need to look up the definition of absolution in the dictionary. To quote the great Inigo Montoya, “I do not think it means what you think it means.”

 

[Geist]

Its my understanding a priest can withhold absolution if a murderer refuses to confess to civil authorities, couldn’t a priest also withhold absolution in the case of a child sex crime as well?

 

[Corki]

Its my understanding a priest can withhold absolution if a murderer refuses to confess to civil authorities, couldn’t a priest also withhold absolution in the case of a child sex crime as well?

You are incorrect. A priest can only withhold absolution for two reasons. One is is the penitent is not contrite and the second is if the offense is one reserved to the Bishop or the Pope to absolve.

A preist may never require that someone reveal their sin to another as a condidtion of absolution.

 

[saveusfromhell]

I’ve heard a few in the secular media, putting forward this notion as a means of justifying the compelling, in law, priests to report from the confessional.

 

[LilyM]

If pedofilia is not curable than the only way absolution can be achieved is by giving oneself up.

Not at all. One can resolve to avoid contact with children (say by resigning as a teacher or sports coach or whatever, if one gains contact with potential victims that way, without needing to give the reason for the resignation).

One can perhaps anonymously help the victims or their families in some way, say by sending an anonymous letter of apology and/or anonymously offering to pay for counselling or other needs for the victim through the priest.

An inventive person can probably find many other ways in which one can make reparation and show true sorrow for and understanding of one’s sins against children without going to the police.

 

[JReducation]

If pedofilia is not curable than the only way absolution can be achieved is by giving oneself up.

Its my understanding a priest can withhold absolution if a murderer refuses to confess to civil authorities, couldn’t a priest also withhold absolution in the case of a child sex crime as well?

You are incorrect. A priest can only withhold absolution for two reasons. One is is the penitent is not contrite and the second is if the offense is one reserved to the Bishop or the Pope to absolve.

A preist may never require that someone reveal their sin to another as a condidtion of absolution.

Corki is correct.

NEVER, may a priest withhold absolution from someone who meets the requirements.

1. The penitent must be baptized.
2. The penitent must express contrition.
3. The penitent must be sane.
4. The penitent must be in communion with the Church.

The only sins that break one’s communion with the Church are schism and apostasy. That group is unlikely to go to confession, unless it’s looking to come back into the Church. Even heresy is questionable whether there is an actual break.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

 

[Geist]

You are incorrect. A priest can only withhold absolution for two reasons. One is is the penitent is not contrite

Isn’t refusal to turn oneself in proof contrition is lacking and thus absolution can be withheld?

 

[Julia_Mae]

Men of greater vision paint a much more disturbing realistic picture than yours. They say that the more active homosexuality is normalized - the easier it is going to be for pedophiles to ply their illness into mainstream society.

Again: 80% of pedophiles self-identify as heterosexual. That is: they are often married or have been to women, have children of their own (often molested) and have no homosexual proclivities.

Pedophiles don’t need any help “plying their illness” in society. Shrinks offices and suicide hotlines can testify to that. Pedophilia is not some rare condition, a surprising number of families know you don’t leave children alone with “Uncle Bob.” Of course, they don’t do a thing about old Bob being a scoutmaster. Pedophilia is so common to American culture, there are jokes about it.

“How do you identify a hillbilly virgin? She’s a girl who can outrun her father.”

 

[Corki]

Isn’t refusal to turn oneself in proof contrition is lacking and thus absolution can be withheld?

No, it’s not “proof” of anything. It’s up to the priest to determine if the person is contrite. I would say that in almost all cases, anyone who goes to Confession for something like this is already demonstrating contrition and a desire to restore him/herself to a state of grace.

 

[jmcrae]

Isn’t refusal to turn oneself in proof contrition is lacking and thus absolution can be withheld?

Would your refusal to disclose your sexual fantasies to your wife be a proof that contrition was lacking?

Just because someone doesn’t want to get slapped, or end up divorced, or be put in jail, doesn’t necessarily mean that they lack contrition.

 

[Elizabeth502]

Isn’t refusal to turn oneself in proof contrition is lacking and thus absolution can be withheld?

“Refusal” (even hesitancy) to turn oneself in is indicative of fear, not of lack of contrition.

In fact, it is more likely that having received absolution, and the sanctifying graces which accompany that – and the safe contact the offender has already made with one human being – the penitent will be possibly more disposed sooner or later to surrender to authorities, knowing that at least spiritually he has been embraced, which is strengthening (providing fortitude).

Sorry for the long sentence but hopefully you get the point. People tend not to surrender when they do not feel safe in any way. It is not rejection but acceptance which promotes further disclosure and cooperation. (Just as a psychological dynamic, even setting aside the grace of the sacrament.)

 

[NeedImprovement]

Pedophiles don’t need any help “plying their illness” in society.

I didn’t say they “needed help” plying their illness in society - what I said was :

Men of greater vision paint a much more disturbing realistic picture than yours. They say that the more active homosexuality is normalized - the easier it is going to be for pedophiles to ply their illness into ****mainstream society .

. . . and this, whether it’s “needed” or not.

 

[Spirithound]

Some might say that withholding information regarding hineous crimes such as child abuse/molestation is an obstruction of justice.

It is not. Obstruction of justice refers to interfering with the investigation. Withholding information does not amount to that.