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TrueLight
Guest
Well, I didn’t mean to bolster THAT belief, LOL.
No seriously, some protestant denominations are very liberal and some are very strict. Catholicism seems more strict to me though.
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No seriously, some protestant denominations are very liberal and some are very strict. Catholicism seems more strict to me though.
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tevans9129
Guest
OK, where does that statement say that baptism is what saved them? What did Paul tell him when he specifically asked, “what must I do to be saved”? Did Paul tell them, you must be baptized and have your sins washed away before you can be saved? I do not think so, according to the verses you quoted. After, they were saved, he first, "bathed their wounds, then, he baptized them.
??? So how does that have anything to do with the act of salvation?
What is so unreasonable about “water” referring to the natural birth and “spirit” being the spiritual birth from God? Or why could it not be referring to God’s word as it is used in other scripture.
Bear
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WCH
Guest
Goodbye.Again with the NT quoting!
Actually, I’m done messing with you, WCH. I know you didn’t really mean the above so I won’t bring it up again.
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WCH
Guest
Here is an expanded reference from 1Corinthians…Hi, WCH,
I joined late… and have been trying to catch up reading the posts. When I got to this one, it really stopped me cold! I think we really need to talk…
**12
As a body is one though it has many parts, and all the parts of the body, though many, are one body, so also Christ.
13
For in one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, slaves or free persons, and we were all given to drink of one Spirit.**I said the Spirit places the believer into Christ’s body, and cited the above verses.
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tqualey
Guest
Hi Tevans,
I have been always intrigued at the size of the NT - and how some can take some statement out of context and claim this is it! The NT is the size it is because salvation can not be summarized in 25 words or less. There is a real simplicity here: read the entire NT because there are several things to do as we follow Christ.
Do you recall that Christ told Nicademus that Baptism was necessary (John 3)
Christ told the Apostles to preach and baptize in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit (Matt 28:19)
From the Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC)
1257 The Lord himself affirms that Baptism is necessary for salvation. He also commands his disciples to proclaim the Gospel to all nations and to baptize them. Baptism is necessary for salvation for those to whom the Gospel has been proclaimed and who have had the possibility of asking for this sacrament. The Church does not know of any means other than Baptism that assures entry into eternal beatitude; this is why she takes care not to neglect the mission she has received from the Lord to see that all who can be baptized are “reborn of water and the Spirit.” God has bound salvation to the sacrament of Baptism, but he himself is not bound by his sacraments
Baptism removes Original Sin, and in the case of the adult, it also removes Actual Sin.
CCC: 1213 Holy Baptism is the basis of the whole Christian life, the gateway to life in the Spirit (vitae spiritualis ianua), and the door which gives access to the other sacraments. Through Baptism we are freed from sin and reborn as sons of God; we become members of Christ, are incorporated into the Church and made sharers in her mission: "Baptism is the sacrament of regeneration through water in the word."
We need to make a distinction between Redemption and Salvation. We (as in every human being - past, present and future) are all saved by the Blood of the Lamb - but in order to get to heaven we must cooperate with the Grace of God - and do what Christ told us to do if we claim to love Him (John 14:15)
God bless
I have been always intrigued at the size of the NT - and how some can take some statement out of context and claim this is it! The NT is the size it is because salvation can not be summarized in 25 words or less. There is a real simplicity here: read the entire NT because there are several things to do as we follow Christ.
Do you recall that Christ told Nicademus that Baptism was necessary (John 3)
Christ told the Apostles to preach and baptize in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit (Matt 28:19)
From the Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC)
1257 The Lord himself affirms that Baptism is necessary for salvation. He also commands his disciples to proclaim the Gospel to all nations and to baptize them. Baptism is necessary for salvation for those to whom the Gospel has been proclaimed and who have had the possibility of asking for this sacrament. The Church does not know of any means other than Baptism that assures entry into eternal beatitude; this is why she takes care not to neglect the mission she has received from the Lord to see that all who can be baptized are “reborn of water and the Spirit.” God has bound salvation to the sacrament of Baptism, but he himself is not bound by his sacraments
Baptism removes Original Sin, and in the case of the adult, it also removes Actual Sin.
CCC: 1213 Holy Baptism is the basis of the whole Christian life, the gateway to life in the Spirit (vitae spiritualis ianua), and the door which gives access to the other sacraments. Through Baptism we are freed from sin and reborn as sons of God; we become members of Christ, are incorporated into the Church and made sharers in her mission: "Baptism is the sacrament of regeneration through water in the word."
We need to make a distinction between Redemption and Salvation. We (as in every human being - past, present and future) are all saved by the Blood of the Lamb - but in order to get to heaven we must cooperate with the Grace of God - and do what Christ told us to do if we claim to love Him (John 14:15)
God bless
W
WCH
Guest
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mackbrislawn
Guest
Why be Christian if you can attain salvation by being pagan? This is a similar question. Why did the apostles go out and preach and baptize and found churches if it were unimportant? Jesus said, “You will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”OK. I am very confused!
Why does it matter if I am Catholic, if I can still attain salvation if I were Protestant? This has been driving me crazy for a VERY long time. Can someone please explain to me why it matters for me to be Catholic?
Within Protestantism, there are many points of view, so they cannot know for sure if they know the truth. That is not so within Catholicism.
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PRmerger
Guest
Indeed. Simply with one concept–baptism–there is a multitude of POVs, each claiming Scripture verses which putatively affirm their paradigm.
Some Protestants say it’s an ordinance; some say it’s a sacrament.
Some Protestants say it must be done by immersion; others say by sprinkling.
Some Protestants say it must be done using the Trinitarian formula; some say in “Jesus’ name” only.
Some Protestants say it must be done in adulthood; some say in infancy…
It truly boggles the mind.
In fact, whenever a Protestant here attempts to provide apologia for the “Protestant position” I must demur and contest–there* is* no “Protestant position.”
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tqualey
Guest
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WCH
Guest
I reject that those are sacraments; therefore I suppose my answer is, “no one works through those as sacraments.”Who do you think it is, who works through the Sacraments of Baptism, Confirmation, and First Holy Communion, to initiate us into the Catholic Church? It is the Holy Spirit.
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WCH
Guest
That doesn’t make any sense.
While there may be many views within Protestantism, I fail to see how that keeps people from knowing the truth.
Will you explain that further, please?
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WCH
Guest
You asked.
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WCH
Guest
I never asserted that my rejection of RC sacraments negated anything, did I?
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