Is America fallen?

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Recently read this article by the brilliant Dr. Peter Kreeft about the culture war. In the article he defines it, says who we are at war with, and how to win it.

integratedcatholiclife.org/2011/11/dr-kreeft-how-to-win-the-culture-war/

Really HIT me as an American catholic. I truly believe that the Catholic Church is Christ’s one Bride here on Earth, but you cannot deny the growth of Islam. I think I would find MUCH more in common with a Muslim brother than some of the characters here in America.

This also got me thinking…what does God think about America, the so-called greatest nation on Earth, the most powerful country the world has ever seen?

It seems to me God is not a fan of the powerful. How can He turn a blind eye to so much hatred/ a culture that has endorsed deaths to the unborn, denied him many times over, and promotes sin as nothing?

And now the war drums are beating against Iran. What do you think of this article and the direction America is heading toward?
 
We are universal. Countries are man made inventions. We should start focusing on what is best for the whole world, and what is best for America is not always going to be what is best for the world.

As Catholics we need to be considering what is best for God.
 
Great article. It’s just I feel that some of it could be used for justification how Vatican II was bad or whatever.
 
Is america fallen? Without question yes. Does that mean that every single person forced to live here is fallen? No way. Too hard to measure faith based on a national level. Nations rise and fall and at the end of the day amount to nothing more than lines on the map. Besides, the Holy See aside, try and find one country in this world who operates according to some sense of morality. Almost all of western civilization is run by secularization. It’s quite common to find governments stepping in and supporting gay marriages and what not. And abortion is as much a problem in other parts of the world as it is here.

If I had to weigh in I would say yes “america” is fallen. And good riddance too. Countries breed division. Nationalism is just a fancy word for pride, which is a cardinal sin. The more rapidly that countries begin to fall, the more desperate the people living under them will become. Desperation can breed a lot of evil, but it’s natural for humans when facing opposition to band together to overcome obstacles. So I say, bring it on 😉
 
SaintPatrick333 said:
If I had to weigh in I would say yes “america” is fallen. And good riddance too. Countries breed division. Nationalism is just a fancy word for pride, which is a cardinal sin. The more rapidly that countries begin to fall, the more desperate the people living under them will become. Desperation can breed a lot of evil, but it’s natural for humans when facing opposition to band together to overcome obstacles. So I say, bring it on 😉
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And what do you propose instead of “prideful” countries? A New World Order governed by…the wealthiest…the strongest…the smartest…the oldest…the Bilderbergs…the Church…a lottery…the United Nations (which is more corrupt than any one nation on the planet)…what is your solution to this woeful nationalism?
 
Ancient1 said:
And what do you propose instead of “prideful” countries? A New World Order governed by…the wealthiest…the strongest…the smartest…the oldest…the Bilderbergs…the Church…a lottery…the United Nations (which is more corrupt than any one nation on the planet)…what is your solution to this woeful nationalism?
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lol don’t give me that new world order garbage. Conspiracy theories abound. Were they behind 9/11? Did aliens build the great pyramids? Is the world gonna end this december?

You had the correct answer in your myriad response. The Church. The entire world governed under the municipality of the Holy Magisterium. That is the answer (I never claimed it was a logical or even remotely probably answer). But defending an evil system like america is counter productive in building a strong faith based community. Let america perish with secularism. The faithful will ride out the storm and come out stronger on the other end of things. We have Christ’s promise. America doesn’t. America will fall and be forgotten. The Church will prevail and reign supreme. 👍
 
I give up this “culture war”. I’m not caring what the world or especially the Muslims do. I’m caring about my family and friends… That’s all.
 
So said Pope Leo the XIII, who received a vision of the 20th century that history has proved terrifyingly true. He saw Satan, at the beginning of time, allowed one century in which to do his worst work, and he chose the 20th. This pope with the name and heart of a lion was so overcome by the terror of this vision that he fell into a trance. When he awoke, he composed a prayer for the whole Church to use to get it through the 20th century.
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Just out of curiosity, does anyone know the name of the prayer that Pope Leo XIII composed? Is it the prayer to St. Michael?

I’d like to be able to say it on my own.
 
RastaPasta said:
Just out of curiosity, does anyone know the name of the prayer that Pope Leo XIII composed?

I’d like to be able to say it on my own.
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Saint Michael, the Archangel,
Be our protection
against the wickedness and snares of the devil.
May God rebuke him, we humbly pray,
and do thou O prince of the heavenly host
cast into hell all the evil spirits who prowl about the world
seeking the ruin of souls. Amen

My pastor has begun the practice of adding this prayer at the end of every Mass, as Pope Leo had originally instructed. This tells me that my pastor is very concerned about the state of affairs in our country. Diabolic.
 
While"the Enemy is certainly behind much of the madness in the West, I find the authors rather abrupt dismissal of other cultural villains rather telling. What is necessary is an uncompromising renewal of the faith where moral judgments are made and held to. The article conveys the very weakness that the Enemy counts on.

A call for more Saints is always a worthy thing as is the call to holiness, but unless you call out and ultimately destroy those generals and soldiers in the Enemy’s army, you are unlikely to prevail. Hitler’s juggernaut of war was not deterred by good intentions alone, nor were the British at the founding of this country. The Old Testament is indeed a testament to the fact that good must often take up force of arms to save the innocent. It is not surprising that so many today don’t want to dwell on the wars and violence of the Old Testament, and it is no surprise that goodness is sadly impotent these days.

The truth must permeate everywhere and with real truth will come real strength.
 
SaintPatrick333 said:
lol don’t give me that new world order garbage. Conspiracy theories abound. Were they behind 9/11? Did aliens build the great pyramids? Is the world gonna end this december?

You had the correct answer in your myriad response. The Church. The entire world governed under the municipality of the Holy Magisterium. That is the answer (I never claimed it was a logical or even remotely probably answer). But defending an evil system like america is counter productive in building a strong faith based community. Let america perish with secularism. The faithful will ride out the storm and come out stronger on the other end of things. We have Christ’s promise. America doesn’t. America will fall and be forgotten. The Church will prevail and reign supreme. 👍
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I disagree that America is an evil system. America is a place, first of all, comprised of people created by god, governed by laws -not dictators.

show me a place or time where such a large number of souls lived more Moral lives without the fear of physical harm or death penalties.

if man cannot be trusted to live morally upright without fear of death, then what right would man have to assume friendship with god, since all his actions were puppetiered by a third party and not by his own true will…?

in other words, America represents mankind unfiltered… Some more good, some more bad… Some catholic, some not -Just like everywhere else…
 
I think people would be surprised at how much god actually loves America. Aside from abortion, I .think America hosts a fairly decent environment to build a relationship with god… Assuming you know how to say no to the devil -that’s why we go to church.
 
It was an interesting article. He gets it right that the enemy is Satan and sin. When we see error in Protestants, Muslims, Atheists, OURSELVES, etc, we need to seek conversion not destruction.

His comment that Protestants will fight with us (Catholics) is one I can agree with conditionally, although certainly not absolutely. Some Protestants (like some Catholics) will continue to reject the truth and work for the enemy. God doesn’t stop loving them and neither should we, but that doesn’t me we don’t need to oppose them when they are wrong, or that we should be afraid of speaking the full truth- which includes: God wants everyone to be Catholic.

There are fundamental flaws with Protestantism, a rejection of public revelation, both in Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture to start. This has consequences as can be seen by the widespread acceptance of divorce and contraception and sodomy.

Yes, Protestants will fight with us, if we and they both embrace the True Faith.

The spiritual war is a total war. It plays out in the world aka “the culture war”, but the primary battle field is the interior one. As important as voting or marching or blogging or bible study groups are, they are all for naught without prayer. The rosary. The Mass. Penance. Adoration of Our Lord in the Blessed Sacrament. These are our weapons.

As far as the direction this country is headed…

I think we face a situation in many ways similar to the French Revolution. I think American Catholics who have long rejected a call to white martyrdom wil soon be given the opportunity for the red variety. A great many people in our society, including very sadly many Catholics, see no relevance between God and their daily lives. If God exists he isn’t very important. Hell certainly doesn’t exist. Heaven may or may not, but if it does, pretty much anyone but Hitler goes there. That is how people think.

We view vices as virtues and virtues as vices. Uprightness is uptightness. Morality is bigotry. Sodomy and murder, two mortal sins which cry to heaven for vengeance, are declared to be basic human rights by our civil authorities. Fornication is the norm. Oh and those commandments up at the top of the list? Stuff like going to Mass on Sundays and not taking the Lord’s name in vain? Who are you kidding? We’ve certainly got bigger problems to worry about.

Wrong.

The United States has never been a Catholic country. It started off as a Protestant one, heavily influence by the naturalistic philosophy of Freemasonry. Over the past century it has become a pagan country.

May Our Lady of Guadalupe, Empress of the Americas, pray for us and protect us.
 
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