Is being anti homosexual anti christian?

[estesbob]

Let’s be careful folks. Love with truth and truth with love is the only method that works. Calling people disordered is wrong completely.

Sorry-I edited my post to remove that implication. i was talking about the “act” .

 

[feetxxxl]

My witness is that I don’t mind hanging out at all with the homosexually attracted but will continue to relate the truth that medically it is still an unsafe practice and I want to see them live full and productive lives. How’s that?

have you discussed this topic with the homosexuals you hang out with. that would be a witness.

 

[goofyjim]

have you discussed this topic with the homosexuals you hang out with. that would be a witness.

I try all the time. They refuse to listen and figure they can’t live w/o sex.

 

[Malcolm_McLean]

Let’s be careful folks. Love with truth and truth with love is the only method that works. Calling people disordered is wrong completely.

A colleague at work, in his late fifties, has swelling round his ankles and is short of breath. Do you say

“You look just fine Bob, fancy a game of squash?”
or
“I’ve had a bit of medical training, and I think you’d better see a real doctor right now.”.

Why is it any different if the disorder is a mental one?

 

[goofyjim]

A colleague at work, in his late fifties, has swelling round his ankles and is short of breath. Do you say

“You look just fine Bob, fancy a game of squash?”
or
“I’ve had a bit of medical training, and I think you’d better see a real doctor right now.”.

Why is it any different if the disorder is a mental one?

One can experience homosexual attraction without having other issues. Why do you deny this? There are probably an overwhelming majority who go through life just never telling anyone. They don’t require therapy for anything. They just live single lives.

 

[feetxxxl]

I try all the time. They refuse to listen and figure they can’t live w/o sex.

if you are saying they agree with you, then those you hang out with are involved in destructive behavior…that is your witness.

 

[goofyjim]

if you are saying they agree with you, then those you hang out with are involved in destructive behavior…that is your witness.

There is this foolish notion that we cannot go through life w/o sex. I even had a spiritual director tell me that one time. I was shocked. While we may always face temptation, some stronger than others, none need to be given into. And especially temptation towards a behavior that is medically unhealthy. I find that one an easy one to avoid.

 

[feetxxxl]

There is this foolish notion that we cannot go through life w/o sex. I even had a spiritual director tell me that one time. I was shocked. While we may always face temptation, some stronger than others, none need to be given into. And especially temptation towards a behavior that is medically unhealthy. I find that one an easy one to avoid.

sex livinig without sex can be thru a state of grace or choice…but it has nothing to do with orientation. whatever practice you find among homosexuals you can find with heterosexuals and vice versa.

 

[gardenswithkids]

My witness to homosexuals is the same as my witness to heterosexuals:

Children are blessings. Our reproductive organs cooperate with God in the creation of children. Sexual activity should be reserved for husband and wife who will lovingly accept the children that result from the expression of their two-become-one union. Marriage should reflect the relationship between Christ and the Church. Christ, (the Bridegroom), lovingly enters His bride, (the Church) and brings forth new life. In marriage, the pysical expression of love sometimes literally creates the new life of a child.

Sex is great–far hreater than many imagine. Through sex, God creates humans in His image and likeness.

 

[gardenswithkids]

…whatever practice you find among homosexuals you can find with heterosexuals and vice versa.

Not true. While many heterosexual misuse sex, and commit grave sexual sin, there is still one huge difference: reproduction of children when functioning male reproductive parts combine with functioning female reproductive parts.

The Catholic Church teachings takes serious issue with both heterosexuals and homosexuals who attempt to separate the reproduction of children from sex and/or sex from the reproduction of children. Such misuse of sexuality is not in keeping with the dignity of the human person.

 

[feetxxxl]

My witness to homosexuals is the same as my witness to heterosexuals:

Children are blessings. Our reproductive organs cooperate with God in the creation of children. Sexual activity should be reserved for husband and wife who will lovingly accept the children that result from the expression of their two-become-one union. Marriage should reflect the relationship between Christ and the Church. Christ, (the Bridegroom), lovingly enters His bride, (the Church) and brings forth new life. In marriage, the pysical expression of love sometimes literally creates the new life of a child.

Sex is great–far hreater than many imagine. Through sex, God creates humans in His image and likeness.

then what is to be said for all the gay couples who have willing adopted unwanted children from heterosexual unions. it is your opinion their childhood is cursed. or that god thru his spirit has given same sex couples the same grace to provide loving secure environment as heterosexual couples.

in this day and age having children is not a primary importance in this over crowded planet where eventually water will be as valuable as oil.

is it your opinion that it is the fruit of the spirit that provides nurturing homes or some biological factor.

remember any dog can procreate…what is important is who will raise the offspring.

from the numbers of unwanted children in this country and the 30 million orphans in africa contributed by aids among heterosexuals i would think that raising not procreation is the primary concern

 

[feetxxxl]

already answered.

 

[melensdad]

how can homosexuality be a sin when the essence of that orientation can embrace the fruit of the spirit …love, joy, peace,goodness,kindness, self-control,patience,gentleness,and faithfulness. homosexuals have not been found lacking in any sector of society compared to heterosexuals including the military or the institution of marriage.

how can same sex attraction being equal in spirit to that heterosexual attraction be deemed a sin?

Going back to the original post there are actually several issues intermixed, much of what is mentioned intermixes laws with church teachings.

Homosexuals are welcome into the church. However, just as with heterosexuals, they are expected to remain celibate if they are not married. As the point of sexual union within the concept of Catholic thought is to create life, and as homosexuals cannot mate with their partners for the purpose of creating life, they must remain celibate in order to be in a state of grace. The point of marriage follows much the same theory as sexual union, as it justifies and sanctifies the union and, therefore leads to the creation of life.

Consequently we are left with a situation where homosexuals are welcome into the church. They cannot be married in a same sex union. They must remain chaste.

The real sin, to homosexuality, then occurs when/if they have sexual partners, etc.

 

[feetxxxl]

i know what catholic thought is about homosexuals. is that the basis of your faith. the catholic church tells you something and you accept it as truth unchallenged and make it your own. if you are then you are the first catholic i have ever met that does that.

lets face it,there always political ramifications to anything the catholic church choses to stand on, so they can avoid the diviision that is now happening with the episcopal church.

reversing roles… if you didnt believe your orientation was a sin would be able to feel comfortable in a church who didnt support your beliefs so that you could make it your home.

treating homosexuals different form heterosexuals invites persecution. dont take my word for it… check out supreme rulings.

you need to wake up and smell the roses …sex outside of marriage is no longer a sin.(out of necessity and because scripture never declared it a sin)… … only the spirit by which it happens.

im sure you are aware of the survey among recently married christians couples that found 95% had sex before marriage

so marriage and sex issue is moot.

 

[PauloFreire2]

Homosexuals should be considered brothers and sisters in Christ. They can’t help their sexual orientation. It’s part of their nature, for which they’re not responsible.

 

[estesbob]

Homosexuals should be considered brothers and sisters in Christ. They can’t help their sexual orientation. It’s part of their nature, for which they’re not responsible.

But like everyone else they are responsible for their behavior.

 

[feetxxxl]

im not looking for sympathy…im saying that homosexuals should be deemed equals with heterosexuals and treated accordingly unless there is valid evidence that says otherwise. the massachusetts supreme court couldn’t find it. im saying that in addition to psychological, and social evidence there no spiritual evidence.

 

[Cari]

I think this post is in response to mine, so I’ll address it:

the problem with your approach is it insures that the historical persecution of homosexuals will continue. saying we are all sinners, doesn’t deal with bias ,mindset and cultural conditioning that fosters that persecution. one says “i believe” and believes that is the end of it …not acknowledging that “i believe” has to do with i ,me, and mine…is about embracing of the concept of i.

what is the connection to one’s concept of “i” and the thing that brings oneness… our shared relationship with christ…thru which the spirit gives grace.

First of all, I have to be honest and tell you that your exuberant (mis)use of elilipsis in your writing makes gleaning meaning very, very difficult. From what I am able to piece together, you are stating that one who condems homosexual acts is fostering persecution of homosexuals. I suppose that depends on what your defenition of “persecution” is. My four year old claims that I’m “persecuting” her when I tell her that something she’s doing is wrong. Lots of people claim “persecution” or “harrassment” when told that something they’re doing is wrong.

the point being how can anything that in fosters one scintella of persecution be in any way of christ? and that is not even acknowledging the emotional and psychological pain it induces.

So sin is to be accepted? Forget the whole “take up your cross and follow me” bit? Yes, there is emotional and psychological pain involved with those who struggle to remain faithful to the Church’s teachings. Go ask someone like St. Gianna Molla if there was emotional pain in adhearing to Church teachings. Ask someone like St. Maximillian Kolbe if he suffered psychologial duress. Sin exists. We are called to fight against it.

Perhaps the problem lies in a defintion of “persecution”. You seem to be of the opinion (and forgive me if I’m misreading this) that if one is unwilling to embrace homosexual acts, one is engaging in persecution, or as dictionary.com defines it:
*1. to pursue with harassing or oppressive treatment, esp. because of religion, race, or beliefs; harass persistently.
2. to annoy or trouble persistently. *

To engage in this behavior is anti-christian. However, refusal to condone homosexual acts does not equal persecution.

everybody is aware that seperate but equal does not exist.

This needs to be explained. What “seperate but equal” does condemning sin foster?

saying “we’re all sinners” fosters inequality.

No, it doesn’t. Saying “we’re all sinners, but your sins are worse than my sins and as such I’m going to make sure you don’t have access to the same basics to life I do”. does.

in your acknowledgement that you believe homosexuality is a sin demands that you responsibly acknowledge the persecution that statement will foster.

Explain to me, please, how I am fostering persecution of homosexuals? I seem to have missed your examples.

how can you believe that something that as intimate as sexual identity is soothed by saying we are all sinners.

Because I am a Christian. I understand that human sexuality is a gift given to us by God, to be used in accordance with His laws and guidelines. Homosexual acts are a misuse of this gift.
Any use of human sexuality outside of the marital embrace, open to life, is a misuse of this gift. I suppose then, according to your way of seeing it, I’m equally willing to “persecute” heterosexual folks, too.

and we are saying it to our brothers in christ who we share the same inheritance. how is this an act of fellowship?

To encourage them to continue in sin is a better act of fellowship?

that brings up my question. apart from mindset, cultural conditioning, and bias (possible homophia…etc) what is it that convinces you that homosexuality is a sin? what is your witness?

And there it is- my favorite word slung about in these discussions- HOMOPHOBIA. I am not afraid of homosexuals. I am not afraid of homosexual acts. I am, however, aware that it is a sin. My witness is the Word of God, the natural law.

 

[goofyjim]

I do not feel persecuted in any way, unless someone tells me that being open and honest about my homosexual orientation makes me a potential pedophile, or that I only support the gay agenda since I can’t keep it to myself, or that I need therapy for “other issues”. All this is crazy.

 

[Dale_M]

the catholic church tells you something and you accept it as truth unchallenged and make it your own. if you are then you are the first catholic i have ever met that does that.

I know you are new here, but if you spend much time you will “meet” lots and lots of people who accept the Church’s teachings without question. Its actually a laudable thing to do.

lets face it,there always political ramifications to anything the catholic church choses to stand on, so they can avoid the diviision that is now happening with the episcopal church.

Well, there are political ramifications to teachings which regard human interaction. I don’t think you mean the Immaculate Conception of Mary (or similar teaching) is political.

reversing roles… if you didnt believe your orientation was a sin would be able to feel comfortable in a church who didnt support your beliefs so that you could make it your home.

No, probably not. This is why outreach and ministry to persons with Same Sex Attraction (SSA) needs to be done gently, with compassion and tact.

treating homosexuals different form heterosexuals invites persecution. dont take my word for it… check out supreme rulings.

If you are saying that persons with SSA are suffering persecution which was caused by the Church’s teaching then I would ask for your evidence. The claim is rather strong.

you need to wake up and smell the roses …sex outside of marriage is no longer a sin.

No, it is still a sin. It simply is ignored. A similar analogy might be made to cheating on your taxes or smoking marijuana. Just because “everyone does it” doesn’t make it right.

im sure you are aware of the survey among recently married christians couples that found 95% had sex before marriage

so marriage and sex issue is moot.

No, not moot at all. What the poll data shows is the real need to evangelize this post-Christian culture we live in.