Is Hell Crowded or Empty?

[John_of_Woking]

jampacked. Absolutely loads of poor wretches in torment. The onus is on us to pray and fast to to prevent us and our friends following them

 

[John_of_Woking]

DaveFilmer’s answer is completely and satisfyingly correct: we are Catholics, ultimately, because we love Jesus Christ and the living God, not because we are self-motivated by a desire to save ourselves from Hell (although that can be a useful tool for some in some cases).

However, if it helps, I have always understood the choirs of Heaven to be hierarchical, with the greatest saints attaining the greatest perfection and glory in Heaven, and those of us who barely snuck in the back door from Purgratory finding ourselves perfected and forever happy, but incapable of sharing completely in the degree of joy experienced by the greatest saints. Therefore, it is to our advantage to remain faithfully Catholic, even if nobody ends up in Hell. I’m not certain whether there is doctrinal basis for my opinion.

In any event, the fear of Purgatory – which comes complete with all the pains of Hell! – should be quite enough to motivate anyone to pursue the shortest possible course to Heaven.

The biggest pains in hell is the loss of the hope of seeing God. Purgatory is most definitely not complete with all the pains of Hell

 

[ThePuppyTurtle]

So then, why be Catholic? If everyone goes to Heaven…what’s the incentive for being Catholic, and how does it make sense given the Gospel passage the first responder provided…?

Does if you believe in gravity effect your salvation? No? Then why believe in gravity?

Simple, It is true, we should believe what is true.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

Scripture says differently, from Matthew chapter 7, in Christ’s own words::

13“Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. 14“For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.

It’s possible that Jesus’s words here are meant as a warning; most people will enter through the wide gate to destruction, and few will enter through the narrow road to life, but that doesn’t mean we can’t turn around before we reach the end of the road

I’m not saying this is what Jesus means. All I’m saying is that the answer to the question “Is Hell full or empty?” is that there is no answer; we don’t know. Jesus told us what to do, and if we trust in Him then we know we’ll make it to Heaven. Let’s all focus on that instead of musing on how many people are burning in eternal fire.

This article by Cardinal Dulles is excellent: payingattentiontothesky.com/tag/jesus-and-hell/

 

[Ridgerunner]

The biggest pains in hell is the loss of the hope of seeing God. Purgatory is most definitely not complete with all the pains of Hell

I’m not sure that’s the greatest pain. I was fascinated by what Ste Therese of Lisieux said about all of that. She said that at some point at or around our death, we see every sin we ever committed in its unvarnished hideousness. It’s a vision we can barely stand at all. We are then offered forgiveness, but we have to admit the awfulness of what we did and be willing to accept forgiveness that was not at all earned.

Some become angered at the affront to their vanity, and choose to spend eternity cocooned in their own self-worship, willing it fully, but knowing, however, that it’s all a vain show. Thus, everybody in hell is a volunteer. We hate God with everthing in us for showing us the truth. She said we do that with absolute, total clarity; a clarity we never have during this life.

Hard to think anybody would choose hell in that event, but it’s kind of, sort of, imaginable. After all, Satan did it, in full knowledge of the consequences, and he was an intelligence so vast that we can’t even imagine it.

She also said everyone in purgatory is a volunteer, but that we’re glad to go. We’re glad to go because we believe (rightly) that we’re not sufficiently cleansed of our self-absorption to be in the direct presence of God. We spend our time in purgatory purging ourselves of it in the full light of truth. A hard business, she said, and painful. But we’re glad to do it, and that’s why we volunteer.

But as to numbers, I don’t recall that she ever opined.

 

[Porknpie]

It’s possible that Jesus’s words here are meant as a warning; most people will enter through the wide gate to destruction, and few will enter through the narrow road to life, but that doesn’t mean we can’t turn around before we reach the end of the road

I’m not saying this is what Jesus means. All I’m saying is that the answer to the question “Is Hell full or empty?” is that there is no answer; we don’t know. Jesus told us what to do, and if we trust in Him then we know we’ll make it to Heaven. Let’s all focus on that instead of musing on how many people are burning in eternal fire.

This article by Cardinal Dulles is excellent: payingattentiontothesky.com/tag/jesus-and-hell/

I hold all is possible with an loving God. But also read Isaiah 66:15-16:

For behold, the Lord will come in fire
And His chariots like the whirlwind,
To render His anger with fury,
And His rebuke with flames of fire.
16*For the Lord will execute judgment by fire
And by His sword on all flesh,
And those slain by the Lord will be many.

I’m not sure what full means but scripture says that many (not empty) will be there…although we hope not. Paul says to persevere to the end, in hope and that is why I try to do.

 

[R_C]

It’s possible that Jesus’s words here are meant as a warning; most people will enter through the wide gate to destruction, and few will enter through the narrow road to life, but that doesn’t mean we can’t turn around before we reach the end of the road

I’m not saying this is what Jesus means. All I’m saying is that the answer to the question “Is Hell full or empty?” is that there is no answer; we don’t know. Jesus told us what to do, and if we trust in Him then we know we’ll make it to Heaven. Let’s all focus on that instead of musing on how many people are burning in eternal fire.

This article by Cardinal Dulles is excellent: payingattentiontothesky.com/tag/jesus-and-hell/

Thank you. However, if we were to believe that there are more souls being separated from God (the state of hell) than being admitted to His divine presence (heaven), I am afraid that it is like saying that there’s something in God’s divine providence that is not going the right way…it may be that we are so utterly stubborn and rebellious, but I think God knows us better than any other creature.

I think it’s a little bit like receiving our beloved in Communion: we know we are not worthy to be united with Him, and we know that nothing we ever do will make us worthy of the Blessed Sacrament…yet there we are, through His love and mercy…and don’t we say that Holy Mass is a taste of heaven on earth?

 

[BobCatholic]

The CCC suggests that there are individuals who are in Hell:

I didn’t say nobody is in hell.

I just said that one individual in hell is too crowded. I was using hyperbole to make a point.

Remember, the person in hell is surrounded by “me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me me…”

That sounds very crowded, IMHO.

 

[Contarini]

It’s possible that Jesus’s words here are meant as a warning; most people will enter through the wide gate to destruction, and few will enter through the narrow road to life, but that doesn’t mean we can’t turn around before we reach the end of the road

I’m not saying this is what Jesus means. All I’m saying is that the answer to the question “Is Hell full or empty?” is that there is no answer; we don’t know. Jesus told us what to do, and if we trust in Him then we know we’ll make it to Heaven. Let’s all focus on that instead of musing on how many people are burning in eternal fire.

This article by Cardinal Dulles is excellent: payingattentiontothesky.com/tag/jesus-and-hell/

Indeed. One can always count on Dulles to lay an issue out clearly and fairly.

He’s not the most exciting Catholic theologian of the 20th century, but he’s perhaps the most solid and judicious (well, thinking of post-Vatican-II theologians mostly!).

Edwin