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Tocra
Guest
Words of a worker of truth. Well said.
- Status
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KathleenGee
Guest
Thank you!
There are Muslims indoctrinated, there are Muslims who are well educated, but do not wish to see the wrongs of their beliefs.
I believe that universally we are all the same human beings before God; He plays no favorites.
We will be judged not only by how we loved God but also how we loved our neighbor.
So you have to say the truth but respectfully. It is hard because Muslims do not understand true Christianity and always quote Scripture wrong, and is not what we believe. Or they do the same to the Church and Christianity in general.
‘Theology of the Body’, Pope John Paul II brings new dimensions of mutual self giving between the husband and wife.
There are Muslims indoctrinated, there are Muslims who are well educated, but do not wish to see the wrongs of their beliefs.
I believe that universally we are all the same human beings before God; He plays no favorites.
We will be judged not only by how we loved God but also how we loved our neighbor.
So you have to say the truth but respectfully. It is hard because Muslims do not understand true Christianity and always quote Scripture wrong, and is not what we believe. Or they do the same to the Church and Christianity in general.
‘Theology of the Body’, Pope John Paul II brings new dimensions of mutual self giving between the husband and wife.
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SnakeMauler
Guest
You know, the amount of killings that have taken place by Muslim’s in recent years amount to far more than the Inquisition.
www.thereligionofpeace.com
-Snakemauler
www.thereligionofpeace.com
-Snakemauler
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seraphime2008
Guest
Funny.huh…I don’t claim that there are no conversion in Indonesia from Islam to Chrsitian or vice versa. As far as I personally know, there are people who convert to Christianity from Islam in Indonesia (my sister in law, my college friends, my parishioners etc) as well as there are also conversion from Chrisitianity to Islam. I never regarded this as a point to see that there must be truth in islam and earn the pride to boast around…
But interestingly, the forced conversion in Indonesia from any other religion to Islam cannot be seen as barely as some systematic method. It’s just a situational force that makes many people especially Chinese who are pretty much regarded as the “non-native” Indonesian , to think it’s saver for them to be Islam, since they will be accepted and mingle easier with the local native. Why? If they’re non-Muslim, they will still be regarded as “the other non Indonesian” who happen to rob the wealth of Indonesia, while if they become Muslims, they suddenly become brother and sister of the native majority of Muslims and there’s no more envy towards their wealth.
I remember it as clearly as the bright day, that when there’ was big riot involving the effort to topple down Suharto the 2nd president of Indonesia in 1997, so big the riots that many Chinese have to fly away from Indonesia, they left their shops and they didn’t forget to put all the bold letter announcement in front of their shops: BELONG TO MUSLIM, this was to ensure all the muslims to skip burning down the shops that belong to the brother and sister of the Muslims!!
How is it not forced conversion in a sociological realm?
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KathleenGee
Guest
I read an article on Indonesia in the New Yorker awhile back…A Chinese man said you can loan to a Christian or a Jew and he will repay you, but a Muslim won’t. I think envy is one of the deepest emotions I have seen in Moslems…
I live within a mile of a new Muslim community put in by our state. I have been leery…had some incidents…the other day I stopped so this Muslim woman could get across the street as it was rainy…an arterial to the highway…she gave me a smile I could die for…and then looked at me 3 times in appreciation…very happy…now it has given me some courage to visit these people…but I wonder what her husband would say…
I live within a mile of a new Muslim community put in by our state. I have been leery…had some incidents…the other day I stopped so this Muslim woman could get across the street as it was rainy…an arterial to the highway…she gave me a smile I could die for…and then looked at me 3 times in appreciation…very happy…now it has given me some courage to visit these people…but I wonder what her husband would say…
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MelanieAnne
Guest
Here’s my take on the situation ~
I would never want to be a Muslim woman. That’s just my opinion.
In Christianity, everyone is equal. The Man is not superior. The Man in a marital situation does not have the right to beat his Wife. Beating someone, for whatever reason, is abhorrent.
In my opinion, all violence is evil. The one possible exception is in the case of “just war”, something that is not a part of a situation where a Muslim man is beating his wife. To me, that is just WRONG, no matter what the alleged justification.
I cannot believe that God would approve of any man beating his wife. This is not the only reason why I would reject Islam as totally FALSE but it is among the many reasons that I would do so.
Any faith that would sanction violence against persons cannot be of God.
I would never want to be a Muslim woman. That’s just my opinion.
In Christianity, everyone is equal. The Man is not superior. The Man in a marital situation does not have the right to beat his Wife. Beating someone, for whatever reason, is abhorrent.
In my opinion, all violence is evil. The one possible exception is in the case of “just war”, something that is not a part of a situation where a Muslim man is beating his wife. To me, that is just WRONG, no matter what the alleged justification.
I cannot believe that God would approve of any man beating his wife. This is not the only reason why I would reject Islam as totally FALSE but it is among the many reasons that I would do so.
Any faith that would sanction violence against persons cannot be of God.
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SnakeMauler
Guest
’
I mean… admittingly… there are a lot of crazy violence and wierd laws in the Old Testament… but we’re not subject to them because Jesus “fufilled the Mosaic” law so technically Christians can easily worm their way out of any of the whole “Well, there was violence in the Old Testament” thingies. Islam on the other hand…
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Tocra
Guest
Snakemauler, everything is EQUAL. By that I mean, if you hit, you get hit back. Action = Reaction.
For every evil performed, there must be an equal compensation for it. That’s why Jesus had to DIE…and not just talk. Because sin = death.
That’s why there’s a heaven & a hell.
The Old Testament shows clearly this ‘EQUITY’. The person who sins reap the fruits of sin. The violence in the OT Bible that you mention is an indication of this equity. Why were those people killed? Because they sinned, and sin’s reward is death.
But since Jesus Christ came to be that sacrifice for death, there is now no more need for muscling around to make things ‘equitable’. Because, the outcome for sin or rather the keys to the gates of heaven now lies in the hands of God and God no longer needs to set things ‘right’ (eg. using the law) because they’re already put right.
In the past, you need to build people up using physical means to follow the law. Now, the spirit builds up.
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FlyCatcher
Guest
I’d suggest the only reason Christianity is still around today is because the vast majority of Christians were not given a choice at birth on whether they wish to embrace Christianity. In fact, I’d say that is true of any religion.
You are telling us a lot about Islam. What countries are you referencing?
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FlyCatcher
Guest
"Wives, be in subjection unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife, and Christ also is the head of the church, being himself the saviour of the body. But as the church is subject to Christ, so let the wives also be to their husbands in everything. "
Ephesians 5:22-24
Ephesians 5:22-24
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Sam_777
Guest
Some Islamic clerics use (Quran 33:33) to indicate to the Muslim woman that she should stay in her home:
“*And stay in your houses and do not display your finery like the displaying of the ignorance of yore; and keep up prayer, and pay the poor-rate, and obey Allah and His Messenger. Allah only desires to keep away the uncleanness from you, O people of the House! and to purify you a (thorough) purifying.”
*
وقرن في بيوتكن ولا تبرجن تبرج الجاهلية الأولي
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InSearchofGrace
Guest
Islam is anti-woman. In fact, the prefix “anti” may be attached to a list of nouns to describe Islam.
Whenever I think or feel that life is bad or unfair, I try to keep in mind it could have been worse for me as a woman, who is blessed to be born into a Catholic family and living in a secular Western country. I could have been born to Muslim parents, living in an Islamic country, or into a Christian minority in a Muslim dominated nation.
I cannot imagine the horror of life as
• an 18-year old Copt in Egypt abducted by Muslim men for forcible marriage and conversion to Islam, or
• as a pretty Pakistani young woman whose face is disfigured by an acid attack by a rejected Muslim suitor, so no man would ever want her for a wife
• as a Yemeni girl forced to undergo FMG by her own parents so she never experiences the joy of womanly fulfillment in love and sexual union with a husband of her choice, then traded to an older man as a child bride in exchange for cattle, or
• as one of the many Afghan women beaten by the religious police for their burqas not covering their bodies enough, for being considered too seductive for men, among other sharia violations.
As for Muslim women who are able to leave with their families to live in Western countries, they are not luckier in these situations:
• Father and brothers do not feel hindered from “honor killing” a daughter/sister who gets acculturated, e.g., going out with a Christian boyfriend or marrying one.
• If a wife would dare want out of a marriage with her Muslim husband, she risks having her head cut off, even if she is no longer in an Islamic country.
Fadime Sahindal in Sweden and Assiya Hassan in Buffalo, New York, are examples of these tragic Muslim women. The list is long, those who have been murdered for violations of namus by their Muslim husbands or families in Western countries.
Secularism and freedom in the West brought about pluralism and equality across religious, racial and gender lines. Along with the fruits, however, rose a more open lifestyle and sinful behavior in the West which Muslims find immoral or repugnant, e.g., sex outside marriage, pornography, homosexuality, immodesty, abuse of the body with alcohol or drugs, etc.
Muslims should note that many in the Jewish, Catholic and Christian faiths in the West likewise find such actions sinful or repugnant, but would tend to take peaceful and legal means to demonstrate their objection, WITHOUT resorting to violence and killing.
It can be said that misogyny and/or sexism, in varying degrees, exist(ed) in many cultures around the world and religions, including Judaism and Christianity, as those disaffected would point out. Be that as it may, Judeo-Christian cultures proved open to departure from and corrections to unjust treatment of women in past centuries.
But it is hard to identify in this age a system or religion that comes close to Islam as a promoter of misogyny, violence against and oppression of women in its worst forms.
[cont.]
Whenever I think or feel that life is bad or unfair, I try to keep in mind it could have been worse for me as a woman, who is blessed to be born into a Catholic family and living in a secular Western country. I could have been born to Muslim parents, living in an Islamic country, or into a Christian minority in a Muslim dominated nation.
I cannot imagine the horror of life as
• an 18-year old Copt in Egypt abducted by Muslim men for forcible marriage and conversion to Islam, or
• as a pretty Pakistani young woman whose face is disfigured by an acid attack by a rejected Muslim suitor, so no man would ever want her for a wife
• as a Yemeni girl forced to undergo FMG by her own parents so she never experiences the joy of womanly fulfillment in love and sexual union with a husband of her choice, then traded to an older man as a child bride in exchange for cattle, or
• as one of the many Afghan women beaten by the religious police for their burqas not covering their bodies enough, for being considered too seductive for men, among other sharia violations.
As for Muslim women who are able to leave with their families to live in Western countries, they are not luckier in these situations:
• Father and brothers do not feel hindered from “honor killing” a daughter/sister who gets acculturated, e.g., going out with a Christian boyfriend or marrying one.
• If a wife would dare want out of a marriage with her Muslim husband, she risks having her head cut off, even if she is no longer in an Islamic country.
Fadime Sahindal in Sweden and Assiya Hassan in Buffalo, New York, are examples of these tragic Muslim women. The list is long, those who have been murdered for violations of namus by their Muslim husbands or families in Western countries.
Secularism and freedom in the West brought about pluralism and equality across religious, racial and gender lines. Along with the fruits, however, rose a more open lifestyle and sinful behavior in the West which Muslims find immoral or repugnant, e.g., sex outside marriage, pornography, homosexuality, immodesty, abuse of the body with alcohol or drugs, etc.
Muslims should note that many in the Jewish, Catholic and Christian faiths in the West likewise find such actions sinful or repugnant, but would tend to take peaceful and legal means to demonstrate their objection, WITHOUT resorting to violence and killing.
It can be said that misogyny and/or sexism, in varying degrees, exist(ed) in many cultures around the world and religions, including Judaism and Christianity, as those disaffected would point out. Be that as it may, Judeo-Christian cultures proved open to departure from and corrections to unjust treatment of women in past centuries.
But it is hard to identify in this age a system or religion that comes close to Islam as a promoter of misogyny, violence against and oppression of women in its worst forms.
[cont.]
I
InSearchofGrace
Guest
[cont.]
How can we as Christians help the women of Islam?
We need to pray for the plight of Muslim women in the world, although there are Christians who are able to do much more than prayer. Greg Mortensen (American, born in Tanzania) builds schools for little girls in Pakistan and Afghanistan. Mavis Leno (Californian) is active in projects to fight gender apartheid.
And then there are educated and enlightened Muslims who truly help the oppressed sisters in their faith, like Homa Arjomand in Ontario, Canada and Mahnaz Afkhami in Bethesda, MD. These people are heroes!
Hope springs eternal with prayer, education of and dissemination of information to women of Islam.
Peace to all.
How can we as Christians help the women of Islam?
We need to pray for the plight of Muslim women in the world, although there are Christians who are able to do much more than prayer. Greg Mortensen (American, born in Tanzania) builds schools for little girls in Pakistan and Afghanistan. Mavis Leno (Californian) is active in projects to fight gender apartheid.
And then there are educated and enlightened Muslims who truly help the oppressed sisters in their faith, like Homa Arjomand in Ontario, Canada and Mahnaz Afkhami in Bethesda, MD. These people are heroes!
Hope springs eternal with prayer, education of and dissemination of information to women of Islam.
Peace to all.
W
wwolverine
Guest
Thanks a lot bosnian muslim for recognizing Mother Mary in the picture above. . As you may know that she was the mother or Jesus, and was born a Jew. The dress she is shown with was the dress Jewish woman wore. Also you may be also knowing of Her Piety. That She was offered to God by her mother St. Anna and St Joaquim her father who were already very old, at the time of her birth.
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wwolverine
Guest
We know they tend to dress like Muslim women, or vice versa
- The Muslim dress code for women DOES resemble the dress code for nuns very much. Saying that’s not true is like saying Coke tastes VERY different from Pepsi.
- It’s not just the nuns, Muslim women compare themselves to. It’s also the women of ancient Judaism, as well as the Virgin Mary (who is almost always depicted as having her head covered with a veil).
- The reason we have to ‘compare’ in the first place is because a large part of the condemnation of Muslim dress for women as ‘barbaric’ is coming from Catholics, who already have a tradition of nuns going way back. It’s a way of pointing out that you guys ALSO have the same dress code for one of your female institutions, so calling it backward and barbaric is pointless.
Well that means you dont know anything about the Nuns, and yet you compare them to the so called muslim woman just because of dress. I am yet to see a Nun using face covering or mask to hide herself. Well I dont think there is any problem with muslims wearing hijab, that head covering, but problem arises when they cover their face, which means she is trying to concel something, No wonder in certain countries, they are recognized by the bags and shoes they wear, if not anyone can take anyone’s wifes.
its a shame that the comparison ends there, as Nuns devote their lives to God, doing social service for mankind. They run schools, work in hospitals, and are found in the most remote places working as they know service is the closest thing that can make them feel closer to God.
They also dont get married,
They are differrent congragations of Nuns, who dress differently, but when it comes to muslim woman, there are those who cover everything even their eyes, others leave their eyes open, than there are others who only cover their heads, and than there are others who done even wear the hijab. eg queen of jordan, She is a muslim.
I dont think the world has any problem with a muslim woman who wears a Hijab, as that will make them the Catholic nun as you say, but wearing the face mask, is what has created problems in the world, where even man has worn that dress and created devastations, not only in the non muslim world, but also in the muslim world, eg pakistan.
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Sam_777
Guest
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aicirt
Guest
worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshhe6ano8LRerp5nEK2
Above is a video of a young teenage girl receiving 36 lashes from a man because she dared to run away from her husband having been forced into the marriage. Believe this is in Afganistan.
Yes, there has been brutality towards Christian women by Christian men. Our Bible was used against women in many instances. In the Middle Ages, there was a law that a man could only beat his wife with a stick no larger than the diameter of his thumb. Hence, the saying “Rule of thumb.”
There was a case again in the Middle Ages where two girls about 11 years of age were locked in a tower and starved to death. They had been raped by a man. However, he testified that is was they who lured him and he could not resist them. Women and/or girls have no rights when men aren’t made to take responsibility for their actions, where the laws are made by men, and where females are seen as second class citizens.
The differnce is women have rights. Our hope is Muslim women like these girls in the video will be able to be free and be safe.
You have no right ever to raise your hand against your wife, girlfriend, child or an animal.
If you wouldn’t want it done to you, don’t do it to them.
Above is a video of a young teenage girl receiving 36 lashes from a man because she dared to run away from her husband having been forced into the marriage. Believe this is in Afganistan.
Yes, there has been brutality towards Christian women by Christian men. Our Bible was used against women in many instances. In the Middle Ages, there was a law that a man could only beat his wife with a stick no larger than the diameter of his thumb. Hence, the saying “Rule of thumb.”
There was a case again in the Middle Ages where two girls about 11 years of age were locked in a tower and starved to death. They had been raped by a man. However, he testified that is was they who lured him and he could not resist them. Women and/or girls have no rights when men aren’t made to take responsibility for their actions, where the laws are made by men, and where females are seen as second class citizens.
The differnce is women have rights. Our hope is Muslim women like these girls in the video will be able to be free and be safe.
You have no right ever to raise your hand against your wife, girlfriend, child or an animal.
If you wouldn’t want it done to you, don’t do it to them.
A
aicirt
Guest
crombouke.blogspot.com/2010/01/beslan-child-rape-torture-enforced.html
Remember the Muslim raid on the school in Russia? Above describes what the kids went through. If they can do this, what do the do at home?
Remember the Muslim raid on the school in Russia? Above describes what the kids went through. If they can do this, what do the do at home?
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seraphime2008
Guest
How’s God ever to be believed of have sending an eternal instruction for woman to wear veil ? Can’t God foresee that beyond the age 600 of the bedouin Arab, there will be so many expression of talents that can be pursuit like in sports, entertainment, art and so forth that will not be compatible with the life style of wearing veil…?
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aicirt
Guest
Yes, the report is awful. Not all Germans were Nazis but those that were did much damage and the others had little choice but to join them, maybe not in the Nazi party, but in the war. Same with Muslims.
If women don’t have rights within the Muslim society and are not seen as equals but inferior to men, it makes it easier to engage in rape etc.
Right now we have a case in the US where a teenage girl ran away from her family for fear she’ll be killed having converted to Christianity. The idea of killing your kid because she changed her religion is totally alien to our way of thinking. And with 100 estimated radical cells in the US, many wonder who we’ve been letting in to our country.
If women don’t have rights within the Muslim society and are not seen as equals but inferior to men, it makes it easier to engage in rape etc.
Right now we have a case in the US where a teenage girl ran away from her family for fear she’ll be killed having converted to Christianity. The idea of killing your kid because she changed her religion is totally alien to our way of thinking. And with 100 estimated radical cells in the US, many wonder who we’ve been letting in to our country.
- Status