Is it acceptable to be a provider husband?

[pensmama87]

See my previous post.

I’m not talking about SAHMs, but about staying at home as a newlywed wife for no particular reason (no kids, no disability, no unemployment, no pregnancy, no frequent relocations). In that situation, the household basics can be taken care of (even to the highest standards) in a few hours, leaving a huge empty day to deal with with nobody at home.

But what of non-basics?

What of hobbies? Volunteer work?

 

[tweedlealice]

Curious!
I just never thought about this as a tenet of our faith.
I was a nurse. I worked most of the time out of the 50 yrs of our marriage. We’re both retired now with health problems. “DAILY TAKE UP YOUR CROSS AND FOLLOW ME.”
Scipture says when you marry,“YOU LEAVE YOUR PARENTS AND BECOME ONE FLESH.” So, you will take care of yourself and make sure your spouse is cared for. Also, it goes the other way, as one flesh, she has to make sure your cared for. Which means:Whatever is needed for the ONE FLESH to be cared for, is done. God gives us flexibility. Most important you should both be Christians. It does make it easier if you are both Catholic. Then, as you are dating, you discuss dreams and how your finances can help you achieve your dreams. Discuss how many children you want and HOW YOU WISH TO RAISE YOUR CHILDREN. If you can, have them in parochial schools. What will you do with older parents. Scripture says you take care of them, even if they are addled minded. Start out with 10% tithing in your budget before chaos comes your way. Do you both want to be involved in your church? RCIA is a nice function to be involved in as a couple. I guess that 's all folks!
in Christ’s love
Tweedlealice
May God give you wisdom as you start your life with Jesus. “SEEK YE FIRST THE KINGDOM OF GOD AND EVERYTHING ELSE WILL BE ADDED UNTO YOU.” REMEMBER a chemical attraction can be lust and not love. "I HAVE A PLAN FOR YOU. IT IS A PLAN FOR GOOD AND NOT EVIL. IT HAS A FUTURE AND A PURPOSE. "JEREMIAH 29 / 11.

 

[Xantippe]

It is not only acceptable, but admirable, to plan to be a provider husband. That is just what my husband did.

We married in college, but post-college, he was the provider from the start. I was at times, a stay-at-home wife, before we began our family. When I did work, I was very selective. I wasn’t going to have a career, and I needed to always be ready and flexible so whatever needs my husband had in his career or lifestyle, I was prepared to help and wouldn’t hinder his mobility. . I was looking for employment that would improve myself, develop my skills, and allow me to give to my community, since I did not need a living wage.

So I worked as a teacher in a private school, for a pittance of a salary. Seriously, very little money. One year, as a full time teacher, I was paid only $10K. The school could only afford to hire married women such as myself who had husbands to support them.

Because my husband had someone else to manage the household and he was free to go wherever the best work was, he was able to develop his skills and increase his earning potential very rapidly. He became a very good provider early on in our marriage. So much so that I was able to quit work and stay home before we had our first child.

We are a couple with simple tastes however. We do not lead a luxurious lifestyle and we have had to be very self-sufficient. Many people would probably say that our lives are boring since we have always enjoyed our evenings at home, date nights playing board games, quiet walks or going to the park with the children. No flashy cars or expensive vacations. Not even pay TV. Just living our daily lives together, and being thankful for the simple meals and plain clothes and clean and safe housing.

So as long as the simple life is to your taste, and you find a bride who is similarly content, then being a provider husband with a stay-at-home wife (or who works or volunteers for her betterment or for thre benefit of the community) is a very good plan.

Most young couples won’t be in that position. If our OP is a doctor (or similar) then that might be an option, but I’m assuming he makes a lot less than that.

When my husband and I got married years ago, we both made around $12k each as graduate students. When I was unemployed after grad school, it was URGENT that I get a job. After my husband finished his doctorate, he was on a good career track, but one with a very gentle upward earning slope. When we had our first baby we were living in the DC metro area, I was at home and (as I recall) for a year we had $800 left subtracting our rent from my husband’s take home income–that $800 needed to cover our groceries, transportation, clothes, utilities, medical copays, baby stuff, etc. I did not realize it at the time, but that was financially a disaster waiting to happen–but at the time, I didn’t understand why we never seemed to be able to stick to the $800 budget. (Our rent was $1560 a month.)

We were able by some miracle to find a free housing situation on campus (glory be!) and squeaked through another four years in the DC metro area on a moderate income, but it’s only now that I realize how close to disaster we came. We just didn’t have enough money to be living where we were living as a single-income family of three and then four.

We moved to TX and were on much more solid financial ground and I started doing the Dave Ramsey program. Over the course of the next six years, we paid off our debt, saved an emergency fund, started saving for a house downpayment, had a third child, and finally bought a house. It took 15 years of marriage, three kids, and some grandma and grandpa help before we were able to buy our first house. Once you have kids, even if you have a good income (which we do now), it’s hard to make progress, because the family financial pie is cut up into so many narrow slices and there are so many different important priorities.

So I would caution the OP that unless he has a solidly upper middle class income and lives in a moderate-cost area, he’s going to find himself substantially poorer when he has a family to support.

Heres my old favorite, The Practical Conservative’s Guide to the Care and Feeding of the SAHM.

thepracticalconservative.wordpress.com/the-practical-conservative-guide-to-proper-care-and-feeding-of-a-sahm/

 

[Xantippe]

But what of non-basics?

What of hobbies? Volunteer work?

I’m afraid that a lot of those things would tend to be a drain on the household income (even volunteering).

 

[Irishmom2]

I’m afraid that a lot of those things would tend to be a drain on the household income (even volunteering).

Not necessarily. Not all hobbies cost money. Playing an instrument, working out, drawing, etc cost little to nothing. Volunteering can cost nothing except the gas to drive there.

 

[pensmama87]

I’m afraid that a lot of those things would tend to be a drain on the household income (even volunteering).

OK, but you’re talking about two different issues and conflating them. I don’t deny that loneliness is a serious occupational hazard of staying at home, or that financial security isn’t important, but neither situation is inevitable.

As I recall Charlotte Collins managed quite well. Though she was also willing to be married to her husband, so perhaps a very particular kind of temperament is required.

 

[jmjZelie]

One good thing about having a stay-at-home wife is that she is able to spend time studying her vocation and mastering the basics of household management while the couple is waiting to start their families. A second good thing is that if the couple is already accustomed to the living off the husband’s income, that they will not be shocked at the big change in lifestyle when baby comes, because they are already not relying upon her income. Especially if they practice a good savings plan, and keep their expenses as low as possible when it is just the two of them, then they will have savings to help with the expenses of a new baby.

A lot of hobbies are free or very cheap. My favorite hobbies are going for walks or reading my bible or a good book. Those are free. I also enjoy sewing, but that can still be done cheaply using coupons and sales.

Loneliness happens no matter what one’s vocation happens to be. Single or married, childless or parents, loneliness is a fact of life for a lot of people.

Couples do not need to be sure of an upper middle class income before they can plan for a stay-at-home wife. Couples with working class incomes can manage to make it work, even while raising children. The biggest thing is to make expectations of lifestyle match one’s budget. The more content one is with less, the better able one will be to afford the necessities, because what is deemed necessary is less.

Also, married couples need to be ready to welcome children when they get married, because even if they plan to wait to start their family, sometimes the babies start coming earlier than planned. So planning to rely upon one income, and being prepared for the wife to become pregnant, even if NFP is used to delay pregnancy, because it doesn’t always work, is a wise idea.

 

[Xantippe]

OK, but you’re talking about two different issues and conflating them. I don’t deny that loneliness is a serious occupational hazard of staying at home, or that financial security isn’t important, but neither situation is inevitable.

As I recall Charlotte Collins managed quite well. Though she was also willing to be married to her husband, so perhaps a very particular kind of temperament is required.

Yeah, there are a number of reasons not to stop working immediately upon getting married:

1. One probably can’t afford it. There might be debt to pay off or an emergency fund or house downpayment to save for.
2. It might be prudent to save up for housecleaning help for once there is a baby at home.
3. If one is doing work that helps people, it is a good thing to keep doing that.
4. Having an income allows one to give to charity.
5. It’s easier to join SAHM club and make mommy friends with a baby in arms.
6. Basic no-kid homemaking doesn’t require one to be home all day.

As to Charlotte, she was looking at a future of being a pitiful dependent childless spinster. Marrying Mr. Collins (while coming with obvious drawbacks in the form of Mr. Collins and Lady Catherine) meant a pleasant home of her own, a good income, a baby, servants of her own, and being a very important person in her new village.

 

[pensmama87]

Not necessarily. Not all hobbies cost money. Playing an instrument, working out, drawing, etc cost little to nothing. Volunteering can cost nothing except the gas to drive there.

Right. Actually, having a spouse available for things around the house could actually save a great deal of money, if they have handy hobbies.

I do think it would take certain personality traits to make it a healthy, happy arrangement. The SAHW would need to be a self-starter andbe able to manage large amounts of free time.

The more I think about it the more I think I could be suited to it. I am good with time management. I don’t mind being alone for long periods of time. When I do want to do something I can make it happen. At present I don’t plan on going back to work. I have taken up babysitting to pay off our debt, but once that’s done I’m done unless I have to work. I can keep myself plenty occupied.

 

[bitterhope]

For my entire marriage I have worked only when necessary, and only for as long as necessary. I was never a lonely housewife even before babies came along. I’ve been married since soon after my 18th birthday. We had no money to speak of. My husband went to basic training and then moved us to a different state. No family, no friends, tons of adventures both together and on my own. There are so many things that a wife can do for her husband in those early days before kids. I took care of the bills and errands, shopping, housework, and in my very little spare time I found my way around a new area, met new people, and simply learned how to be married. We got to know each other before our babies started coming and we were able to work out a life that worked well for us as a family. By taking care of most things at home, it allowed my husband to focus on his job. There was no worries about job security even when he left the Army for a few years because he could go to work each day without worrying about how things were at home. We certainly have never had much income but we have always been happy together. It doesn’t take near the amount of money you will hear many people (including on here) say it does to make a good life.

Before we married I worked full time. I started working when I was 14 (officially) and actually met my husband at work. We both worked on the same farm. I lived my job and before we got married I had planned to stick with it until I graduated from college. When my husband told me he was going into the Army I knew the only other option was staying home after we married and take classes part time. Having kids sooner than I expected changed things again–school had to go. The only regret I have now is not giving up school sooner. Home would have been a much calmer and more peaceful place without the constant struggles with trying to juggle classes and babies. For me, this is my vocation. For others like my mom, they found working to be their calling. Mom worked full time well into her 60’s. She was a great mom as well as accomplished in her profession. It worked for her. It never would for me. There isn’t just one way to live a married life or one way to parent. Find what works in your family and go with it

 

[Kelfa28]

An newly wed wife who stays at home and has no kids?

I think that is weird and kind of ridiculous. I would be bored out of my mind and really sad.

But that is me.

If I was dating a man who suggested this…I would run for the hills. I’d have a very difficult time distinguishing his intentions and would just assume he wants me under his thumb for the duration of the marriage.

Is it wrong? No, I suppose it’s not. But it really, truly depends on the woman you intend on marrying.

If she wants to do it…more power to her. If not…don’t force the issue and move on.

I was a SAHM, I’ve worked and I’m finishing school.

I’m extremely self sufficient and self reliant…and I’m incredibly independent.

I’m certainly not going to be a SAHM forever. Personally, I can’t stand doing it.

For me…staying at home permanently is totally degrading and depressing. I’d never sign onto something like that.
It’s just not work. I can only clean the counter tops and do laundry so many times a day.

 

[pensmama87]

Yeah, there are a number of reasons not to stop working immediately upon getting married:

1. One probably can’t afford it. There might be debt to pay off or an emergency fund or house downpayment to save for.
2. It might be prudent to save up for housecleaning help for once there is a baby at home.
3. If one is doing work that helps people, it is a good thing to keep doing that.
4. Having an income allows one to give to charity.
5. It’s easier to join SAHM club and make mommy friends with a baby in arms.
6. Basic no-kid homemaking doesn’t require one to be home all day.

As to Charlotte, she was looking at a future of being a pitiful dependent childless spinster. Marrying Mr. Collins (while coming with obvious drawbacks in the form of Mr. Collins and Lady Catherine) meant a pleasant home of her own, a good income, a baby, servants of her own, and being a very important person in her new village.

It was a joke.

All I’m saying is that it’s not inevitable that an arrangement like the OP described is a bad one and might have merits that would be otherwise overlooked.

You don’t seem to be in your normal good spirits. I know you have mentioned wanting to return to work and not feeling great yourself lately. :hug1: I wonder if that’s coloring your opinion here.

 

[pensmama87]

An newly wed wife who stays at home and has no kids?

I think that is weird and kind of ridiculous. I would be bored out of my mind and really sad.

But that is me.

If I was dating a man who suggested this…I would run for the hills. I’d have a very difficult time distinguishing his intentions and would just assume he wants me under his thumb for the duration of the marriage.

Is it wrong? No, I suppose it’s not. But it really, truly depends on the woman you intend on marrying.

If she wants to do it…more power to her. If not…don’t force the issue and move on.

I was a SAHM, I’ve worked and I’m finishing school.

I’m extremely self sufficient and self reliant…and I’m incredibly independent.

I’m certainly not going to be a SAHM forever. Personally, I can’t stand doing it.

For me…staying at home permanently is totally degrading and depressing. I’d never sign onto something like that.
It’s just not work. I can only clean the counter tops and do laundry so many times a day.

Ooooooh, I got a list a mile long and it goes wayyyy beyond countertops and laundry.

 

[Kelfa28]

Ooooooh, I got a list a mile long and it goes wayyyy beyond countertops and laundry.

So do I…but there is a massive difference between having things to do when you have kids and when you don’t.

Less laundry, less dishes, less things that get spilled/dropped/colored on/thrown/stuck, less groceries to buy, much less cleaning, less chaos in general and way more time to do it all.

Maybe it’s my military background…but I’m a seriously efficient cleaner and it doesn’t take much time for me to do a decent job at cleaning the house…maybe a few hours.

Plus, I used to work 24 hour shifts when I was single and I only did that twice a week. That meant I had 5 days off.
Yeah I slept at least one of those days…but I was just bored when I was at home without kids.
I had nothing to do and would just pick up overtime shifts to make some extra money.

Another thing I thought of…who would you be friends with? You aren’t a mom…unless you make quick work of that…and you don’t work. Who are you going to hang out with, retirees?

 

[bitterhope]

So do I…but there is a massive difference between having things to do when you have kids and when you don’t.

Less laundry, less dishes, less things that get spilled/dropped/colored on/thrown/stuck, less groceries to buy, much less cleaning, less chaos in general and way more time to do it all.

Maybe it’s my military background…but I’m a seriously efficient cleaner and it doesn’t take much time for me to do a decent job at cleaning the house…maybe a few hours.

Plus, I used to work 24 hour shifts when I was single and I only did that twice a week. That meant I had 5 days off.
Yeah I slept at least one of those days…but I was just bored when I was at home without kids.
I had nothing to do and would just pick up overtime shifts to make some extra money.

Another thing I thought of…who would you be friends with? You aren’t a mom…unless you make quick work of that…and you don’t work. Who are you going to hang out with, retirees?

I can honestly say it’s surprising that someone would think you can’t make/have friends if you don’t work. Some of my friends were moms already, some worked, some were looking for work, some were happy at home, some were older or retirees–just like when I had a job. I never found it boring. I had plenty to keep me busy and I could easily find things to do or something that needed to be done. On the rare occasion I actually had everything at home done and all the errands run, I would meet up with friends or volunteer or sit down and write, draw, crochet or sew. It would have been awesome to make that happen more often but I was busy! I know it’s not for everyone. Just like working and school aren’t for everyone. It surprises me though that anyone would assume it’s difficult to have friends just because a person stays at home.

 

[Xantippe]

One good thing about having a stay-at-home wife is that she is able to spend time studying her vocation and mastering the basics of household management while the couple is waiting to start their families. **A second good thing is that if the couple is already accustomed to the living off the husband’s income, that they will not be shocked at the big change in lifestyle when baby comes, because they are already not relying upon her income. Especially if they practice a good savings plan, and keep their expenses as low as possible when it is just the two of them, then they will have savings to help with the expenses of a new baby. **

A lot of hobbies are free or very cheap. My favorite hobbies are going for walks or reading my bible or a good book. Those are free. I also enjoy sewing, but that can still be done cheaply using coupons and sales.

Loneliness happens no matter what one’s vocation happens to be. Single or married, childless or parents, loneliness is a fact of life for a lot of people.

Couples do not need to be sure of an upper middle class income before they can plan for a stay-at-home wife. Couples with working class incomes can manage to make it work, even while raising children. The biggest thing is to make expectations of lifestyle match one’s budget. The more content one is with less, the better able one will be to afford the necessities, because what is deemed necessary is less.

**Also, married couples need to be ready to welcome children when they get married, **because even if they plan to wait to start their family, sometimes the babies start coming earlier than planned. So planning to rely upon one income, and being prepared for the wife to become pregnant, even if NFP is used to delay pregnancy, because it doesn’t always work, is a wise idea.

1. I agree that it is good to get up to speed on SAHM-style homemaking before becoming an SAHM.
2. Financially speaking, it’s even better to keep her job and start living off his income now and saving hers.
3. Many young couples won’t be able to have a “savings plan,” especially on one income. They’ll be very lucky just to have a debt repayment plan. The average college graduate with student loans has $35k in student loans now. If two of those averaged indebted graduates get married, that’s $70k in debt, to say nothing of car loans, credit cards, etc. That couple would be very ill-advised to have the wife quit her job immediately after getting married.
4. Nowadays, there aren’t a lot of young married working class couples. Young working class couples today tend to have babies out of wedlock. Married childbearing is very much a middle class/upper middle class thing in today’s US.
5. The median house in the US costs roughly $190k. A 10% downpayment on a house like that would be $19k. A 20% downpayment would be $38k. It takes very nearly an upper middle class income to be able to comfortably afford the mortgage on a $190k house. Median US household income is $52k. As you can imagine, it’s rather an ordeal saving even $19k on a $52k income–that’s over four months of pre-tax income. OK, maybe they don’t need a 10% downpayment–but a small downpayment is just pushing trouble down the road–the lower the downpayment, the higher the mortgage payment. And conversely, the higher the downpayment, the more manageable the monthly mortgage payment (all being equal).
6. Again, I think you are overestimating the financial robustness of today’s 20-something Americans. They do very well to keep mom home with the baby after the baby is born, let alone before the baby is conceived.

 

[Xantippe]

An newly wed wife who stays at home and has no kids?

I think that is weird and kind of ridiculous. I would be bored out of my mind and really sad.

And especially if relocated into a new area, which often happens to newlyweds.

 

[Kelfa28]

1. I agree that it is good to get up to speed on SAHM-style homemaking before becoming an SAHM.
2. Financially speaking, it’s even better to keep her job and start living off his income now and saving hers.
3. Many young couples won’t be able to have a “savings plan,” especially on one income. They’ll be very lucky just to have a debt repayment plan. The average college graduate with student loans has $35k in student loans now. If two of those averaged indebted graduates get married, that’s $70k in debt, to say nothing of car loans, credit cards, etc. That couple would be very ill-advised to have the wife quit her job immediately after getting married.
4. Nowadays, there aren’t a lot of young married working class couples. Young working class couples today tend to have babies out of wedlock. Married childbearing is very much a middle class/upper middle class thing in today’s US.
5. The median house in the US costs roughly $190k. A 10% downpayment on a house like that would be $19k. A 20% downpayment would be $38k. It takes very nearly an upper middle class income to be able to comfortably afford the mortgage on a $190k house. Median US household income is $52k. As you can imagine, it’s rather an ordeal saving even $19k on a $52k income–that’s over four months of pre-tax income. OK, maybe they don’t need a 10% downpayment–but a small downpayment is just pushing trouble down the road–the lower the downpayment, the higher the mortgage payment. And conversely, the higher the downpayment, the more manageable the monthly mortgage payment (all being equal).
6. Again, I think you are overestimating the financial robustness of today’s 20-something Americans. They do very well to keep mom home with the baby after the baby is born, let alone before the baby is conceived.

I’m with you on this one.

Speaking from experience. I happen to have a husband who is outstanding with finances.

He was able to buy a house on his own without my financial help…but we had circumstances that aided us big time that not everyone has or will ever have access to.

We still struggled big time…especially since my husband lost his job more then once.

I just don’t think it is wise, financially, for a couple to have a wife stay home for the complete duration of the marriage.

She could help get a savings cushion going before they have kids. She could have a resume to fall back on if someone needs to go out and start job hunting again. Instead of just one person job hunting there could be two people and that would cut the time without work down…maybe even in half.

You need to be realistic and take into account things like job loss.

 

[Xantippe]

It was a joke.

All I’m saying is that it’s not inevitable that an arrangement like the OP described is a bad one and might have merits that would be otherwise overlooked.

You don’t seem to be in your normal good spirits. I know you have mentioned wanting to return to work and not feeling great yourself lately. :hug1: I wonder if that’s coloring your opinion here.

Sorry!

I did give a list reasons for being a SAHW (disability, illness, hard pregnancy, unemployment, frequent relocations, etc.). And there are other good reasons, I’m sure–ailing family members, writing the great American novel, etc. But just for no particular reason? Just so the husband can be the “provider”? I don’t see the point and I’m pretty sure that it would be financially a disaster for 80% of families. It’s one thing for the wife to stay home because she feels like she has a particular mission or because she can’t work, but it’s quite another if it’s so her husband can feel like he’s a “provider.”

I had a couple different spells of unemployment before we had kids, and it wasn’t my favorite thing. The first one was right after I finished my MA. I did do some domestic stuff (I baked bread like a boss) but eventually it was a little sad. I was so much happier when work materialized. Then I got laid off while pregnant after 9/11. The first little bit was great (a relief from trying not to throw up at work), but once I hit my second trimester and was feeling physically strong and energetic, it was a big bummer not to have more to do. Aside from my husband (who was working long hours and had a big commute), the only people I got to talk to in person my second trimester were the people at my OB/GYN’s office once a month. (We were new to the area and the only people I’d known were my coworkers at the job I got laid off from.) Things were better once it was third trimester and there was more to do (more frequent appointments, childbirth classes, some baby shopping), but it would have been better if I could have worked through my second trimester–it was pretty sad and boring at home by myself all day in a new area. (We didn’t have a car and I didn’t drive at the time, which was the icing on the cake–if I was going to go anywhere, I’d need to walk 15 minutes to the metro station first, ride the metro, then walk another 10-20 minutes to my destination and then repeat the whole thing backward to get home. Oh, and the DC area commuters pretty much never give up seats to pregnant ladies, so I’d often get to stand the whole way on the metro.)

 

[St_Francis]

ETA: Wroting as a woman, wife, and mother,no longer in jer 20s…

Each family’s situation is different, and each person is different. I think if a husband has sufficient income, a SAH wife is a fabulous idea, for one thing, she won’t be taking a job another person might really need.

In the olden days when the ideal was for wives to not have jobs, non-employed wives provided a lot of volunteer labor which helped a lot of people and got a lot done in the community.

And I would certainly recommend this whenever possible so that the wife could learn the many things she will need or want to know once she had children: food management (not just using coupons but preserving); gardening, sewing, knitting, crocheting, household repairs.

And I think that if this is a possibility, which so often it isn’t, then it is a wonderful thing to do, and lovely that the OP would like to aim for when he is planning his life. I’m sure that there are enough women out there who would like this type of family; after all,he only needs one