Is it possible to be a good Catholic and be pro choice?

  • Thread starter Thread starter RRusso1982
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
RRusso1982 said:
People are making like I am a monster for feeling the way I do. I think there is a big difference in being pro abortion and encouraging, paying for, or performing abortions and feeling the way I do, that abortion is a terrible thing, and I would try to discourage someone from haveing one any day of the week but believe that if abortions were outlawed, they would happen anyway, only in back alleys, so it is a bad idea to outlaw them.
Click to expand...
You keep bringing this up again and again and people keep addressing it again and again. First of all, this is propaganda, if you look at the statistics you will find that anti-abortion laws do in fact deter abortions and there are less abortions in countries that have these laws than in countries that don’t. Secondly, again we reiterate that the purpose of the state is to protect its citizens including those who cannot protect themselves. To say “Let’s not outlaw abortion because women will have abortions anyways” is like saying “Let’s not outlaw terrorism because people will be terrorists anyway.” The law is supposed to be a standard… if the state allows something extremely unethical by law that infringes upon a particular person (i.e. an unborn child) then the state is not doing its job. This is a very bad thing.

You keep saying “abortion is a very bad thing but…” I think you are having a hard time understanding just how bad abortion really is. That is probably the root of your problem. It’s the brutal and violent murder of innocent, defenseless children. This is not negotiable under any circumstances.
 
RRusso1982 said:
So you honestly say that a person who goes to mass, is active in his parish, volunteers a lot, and who personally thinks abortion is a terrible thing and would always try to talk someone out of having an abortion but in his heart believes that as a practical matter, it is not a good idea to outlaw abortions cannot be a good Catholic under any circumstances?
Click to expand...
Let me rephrase it for you: Yes, I honestly say that a person who goes to mass, is active in his parish, volunteers a lot, and who personally thinks slaughtering innocent, defenseless children is a terrible thing and would always try to talk someone out of slaughtering innocent, defenseless children but in his heart believes that as a practical matter, it is not a good idea to outlaw slaughtering innocent, defenseless children cannot be a good Catholic under any circumstances.
 
RRusso1982 said:
So you honestly say that a person who goes to mass, is active in his parish, volunteers a lot, and who personally thinks abortion is a terrible thing and would always try to talk someone out of having an abortion but in his heart believes that as a practical matter, it is not a good idea to outlaw abortions cannot be a good Catholic under any circumstances?
Click to expand...
Question for you - Please answer - Would you honestly say that a person who goes to mass, is active in his parish, volunteers a lot, and who personally thinks raping a woman is a terrible thing and would always try to talk someone out of raping a woman but in his heart believes that as a practical matter, it is not a good idea to outlaw rape would be a good Catholic? Yes or No?
 
RRusso1982 said:
CompSciGuy, you are an *******.
Click to expand...
Really - is that the defense of your position you have to offer us - 🤷…well then it appears that you have - in reality - answered your OP question in a very apparent “Negative” as far as being a good Catholic …
 
RRusso1982 said:
So you honestly say that a person who goes to mass, is active in his parish, volunteers a lot, and who personally thinks abortion is a terrible thing and would always try to talk someone out of having an abortion but in his heart believes that as a practical matter, it is not a good idea to outlaw abortions cannot be a good Catholic under any circumstances?
Click to expand...
Such a person is kidding himself.

If abortion is the murder of children, why are you in favor of it being legal?

If a person is “pro choice in the first trimester” you are in favor of legal murder of children, then you really don’t believe it is *wrong *to murder babies.

If you don’t believe it is wrong to murder babies, you have a malformed conscience.

You have not defined what a “good Catholic” is. I believe Christ said it though:

*Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

and

whatever you do unto the least of these, you do unto me*
 
YADA said:
Question for you - Please answer - Would you honestly say that a person who goes to mass, is active in his parish, volunteers a lot, and who personally thinks raping a woman is a terrible thing and would always try to talk someone out of raping a woman but in his heart believes that as a practical matter, it is not a good idea to outlaw rape would be a good Catholic? Yes or No?
Click to expand...
That is a ridiculous question. This is the last time I will ever ask a question on this site. People make like I am a bad person because of my personal opinion. I would never advocate abortion for anyone. I only believe it isn’t a good idea to make abortion illegal.
 
RRusso1982 said:
\I only believe it isn’t a good idea to make abortion illegal.
Click to expand...
You said you were “pro choice in the first trimester”. Those are your words. What does that mean if not that you believe it is OK to kill babies? If you mean something else, by all means please tell us.
 
Rrusso, I have talked with a lot of people and I realize that not everyone hold up their own beliefs to reason and scrutiny, it’s really a matter of personality type, and some people judge by feeling… I have a sense that you are one of the latter people. But this is not a healthy way of making moral judgments. Think about what is at stake. I know it is easy to take the route of employing euphemisms and blowing up at people who use your own logic against you but seriously, we are in such a dire situation culturally, you cannot afford as a Catholic to just go with “gut feelings” and personal interpretations. You have to let go of your pride and really ask yourself the questions we have been asking you. I am sorry if I come across as blunt but that’s the only way I can communicate to you logically the insanity of what you are proposing.
 
RRusso1982 said:
That is a ridiculous question. This is the last time I will ever ask a question on this site. People make like I am a bad person because of my personal opinion. I would never advocate abortion for anyone. I only believe it isn’t a good idea to make abortion illegal.
Click to expand...
And so many people have answered this objection, and you have not addressed any of our answers! You have this idea that “I have my opinion and my opinion is sacred and how dare anyone challenge my opinion!” You have to lose this. Part of being a Catholic is recognizing that you are not God and that you are capable of error. The almighty opinion does not stand in the face of truth. Please read through these responses seriously and get rid of your pride.
 
I am personally opposed to abortion. As I said, if I were a member of Congress or a Senator, I would have about an 80% pro life voting record. I am against late term abortion, for parental notification laws, against taxpayer funding of abortions, and in favor of conscience laws, which protects doctors or nurses who are morally opposed to abortions from having to perform them. I also support a 24 hour waiting period. I think abortions should be kept legal during the first trimester. I think that is far better than Nancy Pelosi.
 
I am entitled to my personal opinion. You are entitled to yours.
 
RRusso1982 said:
I am personally opposed to abortion. As I said, if I were a member of Congress or a Senator, I would have about an 80% pro life voting record. I am against late term abortion, for parental notification laws, against taxpayer funding of abortions, and in favor of conscience laws, which protects doctors or nurses who are morally opposed to abortions from having to perform them. I also support a 24 hour waiting period. I think abortions should be kept legal during the first trimester. I think that is far better than Nancy Pelosi.
Click to expand...
You are not addressing anything we have said! All you are doing is reiterating what you said in your first post! That is not a proper way to argue. The point of arguing is arriving at a better understanding, it is not merely to throw your opinions at everyone!
 
My gut instinct is that if abortions are outlawed, they will happen anyway, only in back alleyways. That is my opinion now. I could change my mind is someone can prove to me otherwise.
 
RRusso1982 said:
That is a ridiculous question. This is the last time I will ever ask a question on this site. People make like I am a bad person because of my personal opinion. I would never advocate abortion for anyone. I only believe it isn’t a good idea to make abortion illegal.
Click to expand...
You have never answered the question … you say its ridiculous - but why is it ridiculous? …what makes abortion different then murder or rape or theft … What is the difference between them? Can you explain it?

Does abortion end the life of a child or not? Yes or No? its not a difficult question

If abortion ends the life of a child - then how can you justify your position or a a society that makes that “Choice” Legal?.. Moral? … Ethical?

How do you as a 'good Catholic" balance your position that killing a child in the womb should be legal [allowed - even if not promoted] with Christ’s admonition that** “whatever you do [and I would add allow to be done*] to the least of my brethren you do unto me?” …

Are not the unborn the least of our brethren?

They have no voice except for you and me … and yet you say … they are not important enough to take a moral stand for … you would allow our society to say the unborn have no rights, no value, no legal standing - no right to life and the pursuit of happiness …all in the name of being a good Catholic 🤷 and somehow - those of us who challenge you are the bad guys :confused:.
 
RRusso1982 said:
My gut instinct is that if abortions are outlawed, they will happen anyway, only in back alleyways. That is my opinion now. I could change my mind is someone can prove to me otherwise.
Click to expand...
H E L L O ??? Have you been reading our posts?
Your gut instinct goes against statistics and also your position is philosophically unsound.
 
RRusso1982 said:
I am entitled to my personal opinion. You are entitled to yours.
Click to expand...
Of course you are. But that wasn’t the question posed in your OP. The question is whether having a pro-choice “personal opinion” is consistent with living as a faithful Catholic.

No, it isn’t. It is a BIG inconsistency. Being pro-choice is not a Catholic position. So how do you deal with that inconsistency? You can** either** use your free will to try to form your conscience in a manner consistent with Church teaching OR you can continue to live in a manner that is inconsistent with Church teaching.

Choosing to try to force a pro-choice opinion into a Catholic framework won’t work. Square peg, round hole problem.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top