Is it possible to become filthy rich without losing your soul?

[stinkcat_14]

Now the more relevant question is, can one become filthy rich while remaining in the state of grace? If it is possible, the next question is: is it probable? It could be that these entrepreneurs are so focused on getting wealthy that they ignore what is really important in life. It is certainly a hypothesis that one can find some evidence in support of.

Yes, I said the above quote. But, did I compare the relative likelihood of someone pursuing wealth sinning to anyone else?

No.

However, I think some legitamite questions can be raised, such as:

1. Can you make $100 million without making money your god?

1. Can you earn $100 million without losing the humility that Christians should have?

Once again, these are potential dangers, but I did not say that a successful businessperson is more likely to sin.

And who are more likely to cheat on the income taxes, and who causes more damage to the economy when they do?

This is the closest you have to being right. However, you raised the claim that the poor are more likely to commit crimes. I raised the issue of cheating on income taxes. I provided the evidence that $350 billion in lost revenue comes from cheating. This cannot even be mostly from the poor.

But there could be a correlation between the pursuit of wealth, especially extreme levels of wealth and immorality.

I raised the issue as a hypothesis, I did claim definitively that it is true. I provided weak evidence for this hypothesis when I cited the relationship between income and church attendance. Not strong enough to prove the hypothesis, but of course we cannot reject it either. There are of course other things correlated with immorality, such as getting a Ph.d. Ph.d’s are less likely to believe in God than the rest of the population. Now if one goes down the road to extreme education, there are potential dangers along the way. And I don’t consider someone biggot if he or she points out the potential dangers.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Did a rich person ask you to point out the dangers? Are there even any people in your “filthy rich” category participating in this forum?

When people sit around and point out the “potential dangers” to a specific class, that’s bigotry.

Now give it a rest. You’ve already got one thread closed down with this nonsense. Try some thing different – like a little Christian charity to others who aren’t here, and don’t know they’re being talked about.

 

[stinkcat_14]

Did a rich person ask you to point out the dangers? Are there even any people in your “filthy rich” category participating in this forum?

When you criticize the behavior of poor people, did they ask you to criticize them? Certainly, some poor people engage in behaviors that are not good and it is not unreasonable to point them out, if done with charity.

Similarly, the pursuit of wealth has dangers with it as well. Why do you want to presume that there are no dangers and they are not worth pointing out?

When people sit around and point out the “potential dangers” to a specific class, that’s bigotry.

I didn’t point out the potential dangers to a potential class. I raised the question of whether the pursuit of extreme wealth, has potential moral dangers.

The scripture I quoted pointed out something similar:

Those who want to be rich are falling into temptation and into a trap and into many foolish and harmful desires, which plunge them into ruin and destruction.

Is Paul bigoted as well? Why doesn’t this scripture apply today. How are the people who are seeking wealth today different than in biblical times?

 

[vern_humphrey]

When you criticize the behavior of poor people, did they ask you to criticize them?

I didn’t criticize the behavior of poor people – I pointed out the verifiable fact that crime is concentrated among the lower socio-economic levels.

Or to put it another way, I didn’t start a thread entitled, “Is it possible to be filthy poor without losing your soul?”

Now give it a rest. If you want to debate, start a thread with some Christian charity, one where people can discuss an issue not tainted by the underlying assumption of the original post.

 

[para8888]

Felix Dennis is wrong. The root of all evil is poverty. Just go check out the poorest neighborhoods in any large city, that’s where you’ll find the most murders, thefts, rapes, etc…

 

[LCMS_No_More]

Felix Dennis is wrong. The root of all evil is poverty. Just go check out the poorest neighborhoods in any large city, that’s where you’ll find the most murders, thefts, rapes, etc…

Um…sorry, you’re wrong…and contradicting scripture.

“The love of money is the root of all evil.” St. Paul in his first letter to St. Timothy, chapter 6, verse 10.

 

[para8888]

Um…sorry, you’re wrong…and contradicting scripture.

“The love of money is the root of all evil.” St. Paul in his first letter to St. Timothy, chapter 6, verse 10.

St. Paul was wrong…and by the way you’re contradicting real world crime statistics…but I guess reality is not high on your priorities

 

[vern_humphrey]

St. Paul was wrong…and by the way you’re contradicting real world crime statistics…but I guess reality is not high on your priorities

Paul was right – it is love of money that generates crimes like drug sales, prostitution, muggings, the numbers racket and so on.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

Paul was right – it is love of money that generates crimes like drug sales, prostitution, muggings, the numbers racket and so on.

Okay, the planet just stopped rotating on its axis and revolving around our primary.

vern and I agree on something.

 

[para8888]

Paul was right – it is love of money that generates crimes like drug sales, prostitution, muggings, the numbers racket and so on.

Paul was wrong…It’s poverty that gives rise to feelings of hopelessness and desperation and more dysfunctional families. Go ask any police officer where the most murders and rapes occur and they’ll point to the poorest neighborhoods.

Paul can write as many letters to Tim as he wants. It doesn’t change the facts or the crime statistics

 

[mapleoak]

This is the closest you have to being right. However, you raised the claim that the poor are more likely to commit crimes. I raised the issue of cheating on income taxes. I provided the evidence that $350 billion in lost revenue comes from cheating. This cannot even be mostly from the poor.

You haven’t shown how $350 billion in lost revenue means more rich people are cheating on their taxes. A handful of rich people cheating can add up to lots of money. A lot of poor people can cheat and the dollar value in lost revenue to government may not amount to much. It is still cheating none the less and still wrong.

 

[mapleoak]

Felix Dennis is wrong. The root of all evil is poverty. Just go check out the poorest neighborhoods in any large city, that’s where you’ll find the most murders, thefts, rapes, etc…

What do you think is the motive behind these crimes?

 

[mapleoak]

St. Paul was wrong…

Oh! I see.

 

[mapleoak]

It’s poverty that gives rise to feelings of hopelessness and desperation and more dysfunctional families. Go ask any police officer where the most murders and rapes occur and they’ll point to the poorest neighborhoods.

Again, what do you believe to be the motive in most of these crimes?
Further, you are quite incorrect in saying that poverty is the cause of these crimes.

Paul can write as many letters to Tim as he wants. It doesn’t change the facts or the crime statistics

Saint Paul wrote all that he is going to write. No it doesn’t change the facts or the crime statistics. His writings would have had to be at odds with them. I would suggest reading and studying Saint Paul and see how his writings perfectly apply in today’s situations.

 

[para8888]

What do you think is the motive behind these crimes?

You’ll have to ask the people that commit them…won’t you.

If you’re looking for an easy to digest answer. Good luck. The world is far more complicated than that.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Paul was wrong…It’s poverty that gives rise to feelings of hopelessness and desperation and more dysfunctional families. Go ask any police officer where the most murders and rapes occur and they’ll point to the poorest neighborhoods.

Paul can write as many letters to Tim as he wants. It doesn’t change the facts or the crime statistics

I think most criminologists would agree, the cause of crime is greed, not need. When you go into those crime-ridden neighborhoods, you will see gold chains, expensive sneakers, and other marks of ill-gotten gains. If you check marketing statistics, you see that merchants expect to deal with people who have about three times the income the official figure for that neighborhood.

Now, there is a correlation between crime and poverty – but correlation is not causation. Poor neighborhoods have poor schools, and many people turn to crime – from petty to serious – because they have no other avenue to prosperity. Police efforts in these communities are sporadic and ineffective. The general philosophy is, “They can do what they want down there, as long as they don’t come up here to do it.”

 

[para8888]

I think most criminologists would agree, the cause of crime is greed, not need. When you go into those crime-ridden neighborhoods, you will see gold chains, expensive sneakers, and other marks of ill-gotten gains. If you check marketing statistics, you see that merchants expect to deal with people who have about three times the income the official figure for that neighborhood.

Now, there is a correlation between crime and poverty – but correlation is not causation. Poor neighborhoods have poor schools, and many people turn to crime – from petty to serious – because they have no other avenue to prosperity. Police efforts in these communities are sporadic and ineffective. The general philosophy is, “They can do what they want down there, as long as they don’t come up here to do it.”

Really, have you talked to most criminoligists?..

When you go into those poor neighborhoods you’ll also see people working at minimum wage, the schools won’t be as good, there will be poorer social influences, more dysfunctional families, more addiction and more of a feeling of hopelessness. All the kind of influences that funnel kids into a cycle instead of out of it.

 

[para8888]

Oh! I see.

Yeah, I hope you do see. Isn’t it interesting that once you put a “Saint” title in front of someone’s name they can do no wrong.

Paul must be right since he’s a “Saint”

 

[rlg94086]

Really, have you talked to most criminoligists?..

When you go into those poor neighborhoods you’ll also see people working at minimum wage, the schools won’t be as good, there will be poorer social influences, more dysfunctional families, more addiction and more of a feeling of hopelessness. All the kind of influences that funnel kids into a cycle instead of out of it.

Again, correlation - not causation.

People in poverty can live very humble, honest, hard-working lives and not resort to crime. However, the “love of money” does lead many to choose the life of a drug dealer, because they have a flashy car, clothing, etc. It is the desire for those things, not the needs for everyday living, that brings the increase in crime.

 

[mapleoak]

You’ll have to ask the people that commit them…won’t you.

Have you asked them?