Is it wrong for a Catholic woman to work and have a family?

[Lochias]

That couldn’t be further from what at least I am getting at.

Good to know. The undercurrent of that sentiment from some posters has been fairly obvious, though.

If you have anxiety issues, but look forward to the love and comfort of home, you might be well suited for a SAHD, or at least part time SAHD.

I would rather extend myself beyond the limits of my comfort zone and take up my cross. For the woman I love, I would rejoice in it, even during times of distress.

I consider my husband to be very hard-working, loving, and reliable as well and appreciate greatly all the work he does in our home taking care of our children.

Sounds wonderful. I’m glad ya’ll found each other.

 

[Bookcat]

Ok seriously. Yes a wife can work outside the home. But should not be compelled to.

A good reading from Bl. Pope John Paul II’s APOSTOLIC EXHORTATION
FAMILIARIS CONSORTIO:

"23. Without intending to deal with all the various aspects of the vast and complex theme of the relationships between women and society, and limiting these remarks to a few essential points, one cannot but observe that in the specific area of family life a widespread social and cultural tradition has considered women’s role to be exclusively that of wife and mother, without adequate access to public functions which have generally been reserved for men.

There is no doubt that the equal dignity and responsibility of men and women fully justifies women’s access to public functions. On the other hand the true advancement of women requires that clear recognition be given to the value of their maternal and family role, by comparison with all other public roles and all other professions. Furthermore, these roles and professions should be harmoniously combined, if we wish the evolution of society and culture to be truly and fully human.

This will come about more easily if, in accordance with the wishes expressed by the Synod, a renewed “theology of work” can shed light upon and study in depth the meaning of work in the Christian life and determine the fundamental bond between work and the family, and therefore the original and irreplaceable meaning of work in the home and in rearing children.(66) Therefore the Church can and should help modern society by tirelessly insisting that the work of women in the home be recognized and respected by all in its irreplaceable value. This is of particular importance in education: for possible discrimination between the different types of work and professions is eliminated at its very root once it is clear that all people, in every area, are working with equal rights and equal responsibilities. The image of God in man and in woman will thus be seen with added luster.

While it must be recognized that women have the same right as men to perform various public functions, society must be structured in such a way that wives and mothers are not in practice compelled to work outside the home, and that their families can live and prosper in a dignified way even when they themselves devote their full time to their own family.

Furthermore, the mentality which honors women more for their work outside the home than for their work within the family must be overcome. This requires that men should truly esteem and love women with total respect for their personal dignity, and that society should create and develop conditions favoring work in the home.

With due respect to the different vocations of men and women, the Church must in her own life promote as far as possible their equality of rights and dignity: and this for the good of all, the family, the Church and society.

But clearly all of this does not mean for women a renunciation of their femininity or an imitation of the male role, but the fullness of true feminine humanity which should be expressed in their activity, whether in the family or outside of it, without disregarding the differences of customs and cultures in this sphere."

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_exhortations/documents/hf_jp-ii_exh_19811122_familiaris-consortio_en.html .

 

[Litcrit]

If they never try, how do they know what all will work and what won’t?

We were forced, by circumstances, to have me as a SAHM and my husband as a WOHD for several months. We survived, but neither of us would ever want to go back to that.

Can you, for the opposite? There are studies out there that speak to both sides; none of them seem very neutral. I speak from personal experience and from the experiences of those around me who have talked about such things, as well as observation.

I’m sure we can both provide anecdotes for each side of the debate; the tie-breaker, for me, are the examples that our Church history, teachings and Traditions have given.

I never claimed anyone’s brains were wired in a specific way, based on their sex alone, that would make obvious the exact and precise way in which they will work for their families.

How many families in the history of the Universal Church have lived in WOHD/SAHM families? A tiny percentage, as this arrangement has only existed for a fraction of the world’s history and only in some privileged cultures.

If I try to remember any saints from my part of the world, they were raised in families that farmed and both their parents worked around the house and were close to the children at all times. Incidentally, my husband and I are actually able to spend most of our time at home together with our children-

 

[Em_in_FL]

Can I just say… you know, as a full-time working mom of 4 children who adores my faith and submits to my husband in love … that I find much of this thread to be absolutely absurd.
(not all… but the trite banter really annoys me)

Seriously… how many of you are actually working mothers?.. to have all these OPINIONS to voice?

Clearly, we all know that the church doesn’t say anything for or against how wives/mothers are “supposed” to spend their time… if it did, this discussion wouldn’t be happening.
So, the only thing we have to conclude is that the answers for each unique family will VARY according to individual circumstances.
Every (holy) family will have monumental struggles in this world… if they don’t, I’m going to question their holiness. So this entire notion of having an “ideal” family life just isn’t going to happen - seriously!
Your family will struggle, in one way or another, in order to gain holiness while living in this world. Some may struggle financially. Others may struggle with time management. Some families are separated due to work circumstances. There is no “right” or “wrong” way to suffer.

If we submit to selfishness, we fail. We all have different ways of being selfish, though.
Some women ENJOY working. If those particular women are working for *selfish *reasons and sacrificing family life, then they fail.
Some women ENJOY being home. If those particular women are submitting to *laziness *and sacrifice their family life, then they fail.
Some women work AS A SACRIFICE for their family. I couldn’t imagine that being a bad thing.
Some women stay home AS A SACRIFICE for their family. Clearly, this is a beautiful gift as well!!!

Are you suffering for the sake of others? If so, good work.

 

[Lochias]

Can I just say… you know, as a full-time working mom of 4 children who adores my faith and submits to my husband in love … that I find much of this thread to be absolutely absurd.
(not all… but the trite banter really annoys me)

Seriously… how many of you are actually working mothers?.. to have all these OPINIONS to voice?

Do other peoples’ opinions have that much power over you?

 

[Em_in_FL]

Do other peoples’ opinions have that much power over you?

Your sarcasm would make more sense if I actually mentioned being effected by them.

 

[Litcrit]

So this entire notion of having an “ideal” family life just isn’t going to happen - seriously!

The only “ideal” life we could have would be if we lived in Eden. No sweaty toiling, no painful labor.

 

[Lochias]

Your sarcasm would make more sense if I actually mentioned being effected by them.

You were affected enough to call them “absurd” (linking them to “trite banter”). Simply dismissing all the opinions you don’t like is no way to debate.

 

[Lochias]

The only “ideal” life we could have would be if we lived in Eden. No sweaty toiling, no painful labor.

We can still strive for ideals, I think.

 

[Em_in_FL]

You were affected enough to call them “absurd” (linking them to “trite banter”). Simply dismissing all the opinions you don’t like is no way to debate.

There is no debate… since the church has no opinion on these matters.

 

[Lochias]

There is no debate… since the church has no opinion on these matters.

That is being deliberately obtuse. The Church has had opinions on the matter for years, but not doctrine or dogma.

I wouldn’t be willing to dismiss the Church’s opinion right out of hand, though.

 

[Em_in_FL]

That is being deliberately obtuse. The Church has had opinions on the matter for years, but not doctrine or dogma.

I wouldn’t be willing to dismiss the Church’s opinion right out of hand, though.

Can you please share this information?

 

[Bookcat]

Can you please share this information?

Yes a wife can work outside the home. But should not be compelled to.

A good reading from Bl. Pope John Paul II’s APOSTOLIC EXHORTATION
FAMILIARIS CONSORTIO:

"23. Without intending to deal with all the various aspects of the vast and complex theme of the relationships between women and society, and limiting these remarks to a few essential points, one cannot but observe that in the specific area of family life a widespread social and cultural tradition has considered women’s role to be exclusively that of wife and mother, without adequate access to public functions which have generally been reserved for men.

There is no doubt that the equal dignity and responsibility of men and women fully justifies women’s access to public functions. On the other hand the true advancement of women requires that clear recognition be given to the value of their maternal and family role, by comparison with all other public roles and all other professions.Furthermore, these roles and professions should be harmoniously combined, if we wish the evolution of society and culture to be truly and fully human.

This will come about more easily if, in accordance with the wishes expressed by the Synod, a renewed “theology of work” can shed light upon and study in depth the meaning of work in the Christian life and determine the fundamental bond between work and the family, and therefore the original and irreplaceable meaning of work in the home and in rearing children.(66) Therefore the Church can and should help modern society by tirelessly insisting that the work of women in the home be recognized and respected by all in its irreplaceable value. This is of particular importance in education: for possible discrimination between the different types of work and professions is eliminated at its very root once it is clear that all people, in every area, are working with equal rights and equal responsibilities. The image of God in man and in woman will thus be seen with added luster.

While it must be recognized that women have the same right as men to perform various public functions, society must be structured in such a way that wives and mothers are not in practice compelled to work outside the home, and that their families can live and prosper in a dignified way even when they themselves devote their full time to their own family.

Furthermore, the mentality which honors women more for their work outside the home than for their work within the family must be overcome.This requires that men should truly esteem and love women with total respect for their personal dignity, and that society should create and develop conditions favoring work in the home.

With due respect to the different vocations of men and women, the Church must in her own life promote as far as possible their equality of rights and dignity: and this for the good of all, the family, the Church and society.

But clearly all of this does not mean for women a renunciation of their femininity or an imitation of the male role, but the fullness of true feminine humanity which should be expressed in their activity, whether in the family or outside of it, without disregarding the differences of customs and cultures in this sphere."

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_exhortations/documents/hf_jp-ii_exh_19811122_familiaris-consortio_en.html

 

[Debora123]

This might be an oversimplification, don’t you think? I think some people are called to work, and some aren’t. The Church exists to teach us how to live morally and to give us the tools we need to do that, not pay for our expenses.

While I don’t think every mom is able to be a SAHM, I think many people lack the faith and trust in God to take a chance and see how it goes. It’s obvious that Dad working to earn the bread and Mom working to upkeep the home and kids is the ideal situation; that’s how our brains are wired.

You seem to be awfully militant in terms of being against this ideal.

I think she just doesn’t like the fact that some people make it seem like it’s selfish/sinful/against Church teaching for the mom to work. I feel the same way.

 

[Em_in_FL]

Oh goodness… that’s not what I was arguing against in the least (I hope you saw my full post above!!!)…

I’m responding to the question of whether it’s “wrong”. (it’s not… there’s nothing the church TEACHES about it being wrong)
I’m also responding to the women who seem to be saying that it’s “right” to work out of the home. (it’s not… again, no TEACHING about it - sorry, I think I used the word “opinion” incorrectly there)
(^that’s the “trite banter” I was referring to, those back-and-forths before in the thread)…

Agreed entirely with the beautiful quote above from Bookcat…

 

[Debora123]

Can I just say… you know, as a full-time working mom of 4 children who adores my faith and submits to my husband in love … that I find much of this thread to be absolutely absurd.
(not all… but the trite banter really annoys me)

Seriously… how many of you are actually working mothers?.. to have all these OPINIONS to voice?

Clearly, we all know that the church doesn’t say anything for or against how wives/mothers are “supposed” to spend their time… if it did, this discussion wouldn’t be happening.
So, the only thing we have to conclude is that the answers for each unique family will VARY according to individual circumstances.
Every (holy) family will have monumental struggles in this world… if they don’t, I’m going to question their holiness. So this entire notion of having an “ideal” family life just isn’t going to happen - seriously!
Your family will struggle, in one way or another, in order to gain holiness while living in this world. Some may struggle financially. Others may struggle with time management. Some families are separated due to work circumstances. There is no “right” or “wrong” way to suffer.

If we submit to selfishness, we fail. We all have different ways of being selfish, though.
Some women ENJOY working. If those particular women are working for *selfish *reasons and sacrificing family life, then they fail.
Some women ENJOY being home. If those particular women are submitting to *laziness *and sacrifice their family life, then they fail.
Some women work AS A SACRIFICE for their family. I couldn’t imagine that being a bad thing.
Some women stay home AS A SACRIFICE for their family. Clearly, this is a beautiful gift as well!!!

Are you suffering for the sake of others? If so, good work.

 

[Serap]

Your sarcasm would make more sense if I actually mentioned being effected by them.

what’s this thread about anyway???

 

[Bookcat]

Bl. Pope John Paul II’s APOSTOLIC EXHORTATION
FAMILIARIS CONSORTIO:

"23. Without intending to deal with all the various aspects of the vast and complex theme of the relationships between women and society, and limiting these remarks to a few essential points, one cannot but observe that in the specific area of family life a widespread social and cultural tradition has considered women’s role to be exclusively that of wife and mother, without adequate access to public functions which have generally been reserved for men.

There is no doubt that the equal dignity and responsibility of men and women fully justifies women’s access to public functions. On the other hand the true advancement of women requires that clear recognition be given to the value of their maternal and family role, by comparison with all other public roles and all other professions. Furthermore, these roles and professions should be harmoniously combined, if we wish the evolution of society and culture to be truly and fully human.

This will come about more easily if, in accordance with the wishes expressed by the Synod, a renewed “theology of work” can shed light upon and study in depth the meaning of work in the Christian life and determine the fundamental bond between work and the family, and therefore the original and irreplaceable meaning of work in the home and in rearing children.(66) Therefore the Church can and should help modern society by tirelessly insisting that the work of women in the home be recognized and respected by all in its irreplaceable value. This is of particular importance in education: for possible discrimination between the different types of work and professions is eliminated at its very root once it is clear that all people, in every area, are working with equal rights and equal responsibilities. The image of God in man and in woman will thus be seen with added luster.

While it must be recognized that women have the same right as men to perform various public functions, society must be structured in such a way that wives and mothers are not in practice compelled to work outside the home, and that their families can live and prosper in a dignified way even when they themselves devote their full time to their own family.

Furthermore, the mentality which honors women more for their work outside the home than for their work within the family must be overcome. This requires that men should truly esteem and love women with total respect for their personal dignity, and that society should create and develop conditions favoring work in the home.

With due respect to the different vocations of men and women, the Church must in her own life promote as far as possible their equality of rights and dignity: and this for the good of all, the family, the Church and society.

But clearly all of this does not mean for women a renunciation of their femininity or an imitation of the male role, but the fullness of true feminine humanity which should be expressed in their activity, whether in the family or outside of it, without disregarding the differences of customs and cultures in this sphere."

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_exhortations/documents/hf_jp-ii_exh_19811122_familiaris-consortio_en.html

 

[Julianna]

This might be an oversimplification, don’t you think? I think some people are called to work, and some aren’t. The Church exists to teach us how to live morally and to give us the tools we need to do that, not pay for our expenses.

While I don’t think every mom is able to be a SAHM, I think many people lack the faith and trust in God to take a chance and see how it goes. It’s obvious that Dad working to earn the bread and Mom working to upkeep the home and kids is the ideal situation; that’s how our brains are wired.

You seem to be awfully militant in terms of being against this ideal.

The ideal is fine if your husband has the job to support it. (or the wife, either one). Not militant, a realist. A man working at Lowe’s, Jiffy Lube, or anything in the service area is not going to be able to support a family, wife is going to have to get out there help, as in help-mate. My husband is retired, and love, love, love having him at home and me at work. Had I had the brains to finish college, he would have been the choice to stay home with kids. Mama always told my sister and I, “Learn how to do something, I don’t care if it’s tasting pies in a pie factory or sweeping leaves under a hall tree, LEARN a skill, go to school. She who waits for her knight, will clean up after his horse.”

 

[Julianna]

I think she just doesn’t like the fact that some people make it seem like it’s selfish/sinful/against Church teaching for the mom to work. I feel the same way.

exactly