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WannabeSaint
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Is homosexual activity a sin simply because two people of the same sex can’t conceive a child? Or is there more to it?
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Is lack of the ability to procreate the sole reason homosexual activity is a sin?
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1ke
Guest
All disordered sex acts are a sin against the sixth commandment.Is homosexual activity a sin simply because two people of the same sex can’t conceive a child? Or is there more to it?
Each act must be a completed act of sexual intercourse that is per se ordered to both unity and procreation.
Acts that are not per se ordered to both unity and procreation are disordered. This includes same sex sex acts or opposite sex acts that are similar in nature.
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EOvsRC1054
Guest
There’s a lot of different arguments on the reason why homosexuality is a sin. Procreation was designed by God for the creation of a child as well as the physical intimacy between partners. So, that could be one reason. There are the other reasons brought up such as the misuse of male sperm which is used to glorify God through the conception of a child, not to be wasted.
The act of homosexuality is contrary to the design of God’s plan for man and woman to be together.
A lot of homosexuality found in the Bible was mainly the abuse of young boys by old men, a common thing found in old Roman or Greek culture. But, that does not subtract from the fact that God designed man and woman to be together.
However, a homosexual person can live their life in the church, but by Canon Law are called to chastity and self mastery.
[2357] Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.
The act of homosexuality is contrary to the design of God’s plan for man and woman to be together.
A lot of homosexuality found in the Bible was mainly the abuse of young boys by old men, a common thing found in old Roman or Greek culture. But, that does not subtract from the fact that God designed man and woman to be together.
However, a homosexual person can live their life in the church, but by Canon Law are called to chastity and self mastery.
[2357] Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.
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Jackj
Guest
Saint Paul describes the process of deception
26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.
New International Version (NIV)
Romans 1:25-27 New International Version (NIV)
25 They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.
New International Version (NIV)
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1Lord1Faith
Guest
“other reasons brought up” by whom? Or are you just referring to yourself?There are the other reasons brought up such as the misuse of male sperm which is used to glorify God through the conception of a child, not to be wasted.
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EOvsRC1054
Guest
Brought up by the Episcopal Archbishop Gene Robinson. He is notably pro-gay, but he was touching on the two sides of the topic.
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JMMJ
Guest
Honestly, most people are too happy to call it a sin because they think it is “icky”. Whether or not they understand the reason the Church says it is sinful, is questionable at best. You can tell this by listening to the way they discuss it.
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Thorolfr
Guest
Citing Romans is not very useful in the context of today. Many gay men have never had sex with a woman, so it can’t be said that they “exchanged” or “abandoned” heterosexual relations for homosexual ones. And in verses 28-30 it says:Saint Paul describes the process of deception
Romans 1:25-27 New International Version (NIV)
25 They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.
26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.
New International Version (NIV)
It’s obviously not true that most gay people now are “filled with every kind of wickedness…envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice.”Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done. 29 They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents.
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KD8TZC
Guest
Sex outside of marriage is a sin. Homosexual people can’t marry because marriage is procreative and unitive. A homosexual marriage can be neither.
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Neithan
Guest
I would recommend Theology of the Body.
It is a sin because it “misses the mark” of human sexuality, which is to express the purpose of the body by uniting the sexes in loving lifelong relationships and to continue the species. Two people of the same sex can not further either of these ends. This is very obviously disordered; it’s fascinating how we’ve completely lost clarity about this. That only makes sense if we internalize some sort of gnosticism where we are essentially our minds with bodily instruments, but even that is self-contradictory because attraction to the body as an essential part of the whole person is involved.
It is a sin because it “misses the mark” of human sexuality, which is to express the purpose of the body by uniting the sexes in loving lifelong relationships and to continue the species. Two people of the same sex can not further either of these ends. This is very obviously disordered; it’s fascinating how we’ve completely lost clarity about this. That only makes sense if we internalize some sort of gnosticism where we are essentially our minds with bodily instruments, but even that is self-contradictory because attraction to the body as an essential part of the whole person is involved.
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Kindnessmatters
Guest
It’s not specifically homosexuality but rather sex outside of the unitive and procreative purposes of sex within the bounds of marriage. Marriage is only recognized between one man and one woman and even then additional requirements, such as being free to marry, apply. All of us who are not in marriage are called to perfect sexual continence (no sex with other people, no masturbation, no porn, no lust) and all within marriage are called to limit sexual activities to only relations with their spouse.
Sex is for the unitive purposes of a married couple and also for procreation. Of course some heterosexual couples are beyond their reproductive years or infertile, but as long as they do not actively block pregnancy from resulting from sex with birth control, they are considered nevertheless open to procreation should it occur.
Sex is for the unitive purposes of a married couple and also for procreation. Of course some heterosexual couples are beyond their reproductive years or infertile, but as long as they do not actively block pregnancy from resulting from sex with birth control, they are considered nevertheless open to procreation should it occur.
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PennyinCanada
Guest
Many people say that of scripture, that ‘it doesn’t apply today’. They are wrong. That will be the measure by which we will be measured.Citing Romans is not very useful in the context of today. Many gay men have never had sex with a woman, so it can’t be said that they “exchanged” or “abandoned” heterosexual relations for homosexual ones.
It is correct to say they have exchanged or abandoned by making the choice not to get married to a woman, or, to not remain chaste as every single man is called to do.
Any person, without the help of God and the sacraments He gave us to overcome our sinfulness, can at any time be filled with wickedness. The reason that the sacrament of Reconciliation exists is to help us overcome all those things that we struggle with in life because we have to live with each other. No one is immune.It’s obviously not true that most gay people now are “filled with every kind of wickedness…envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice.”
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gama232
Guest
“icky” is not an argument for anything. I’m sure my parents had sex but they never talked about it. However, LGBT people seem to think others must know about what they do in private.
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Thorolfr
Guest
I don’t know many gay people who talk specifically about what they do in private. Just indicating that they’re involved with someone of the same sex is no different than what most straight people do since they don’t usually attempt to conceal the sex of the person they’re involved with either.“icky” is not an argument for anything. I’m sure my parents had sex but they never talked about it. However, LGBT people seem to think others must know about what they do in private.
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gama232
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I read LGBT publications, including The Advocate. After the call to support our “transgender brothers and sisters,” an article appeared about what it’s like for a gay man to have sex with a transgender woman.
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Thorolfr
Guest
You said “LGBT people seem to think…” as if that’s what all LGBT people think. And an article in the Advocate doesn’t represent what all LGBT think or talk about any more than an article in Hustler magazine represents what all straight people think and talk about.I read LGBT publications, including The Advocate. After the call to support our “transgender brothers and sisters,” an article appeared about what it’s like for a gay man to have sex with a transgender woman.
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gama232
Guest
So why Gay Pride parades? I know the entire gay population does not participate. And why The Advocate? Long before the article I mentioned, it was a key source of news for gay people along with a few other publications. And The Advocate is heavily involved in politics as well.
And why did the mainstream media heavily promote a male celebrity who was modified to look like a woman? One gay talk show host even called him ‘she.’
And why did the mainstream media heavily promote a male celebrity who was modified to look like a woman? One gay talk show host even called him ‘she.’
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Paul_Edwards
Guest
I suppose that’s the main reason, the lack of ability to create (which implies Gods plan).
One of the things that’s always anoid me is when some people will on the one hand condemn homosexuality and then on the other hand will say that it’s ok for a man and a woman to use an artificial device. There is not much difference. Both acts are unnatural.
As Catholics it’s easy to understood why homosexual acts are wrong because of our stance on contraception. It’s logical. But it’s annoying when somebody who doesn’t share that logic decides to condemn this act, this means they are only condemning and accepting what suits them and their lifestyle and it’s a slap in the face to others.
One of the things that’s always anoid me is when some people will on the one hand condemn homosexuality and then on the other hand will say that it’s ok for a man and a woman to use an artificial device. There is not much difference. Both acts are unnatural.
As Catholics it’s easy to understood why homosexual acts are wrong because of our stance on contraception. It’s logical. But it’s annoying when somebody who doesn’t share that logic decides to condemn this act, this means they are only condemning and accepting what suits them and their lifestyle and it’s a slap in the face to others.
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gama232
Guest
Adding “slap in the face” does not add useful information to an argument. And how did artificial contraception become OK for some people, including Catholics? In 1967, during the Sexual Revolution, Pope Paul VI had to issue an encyclical in response to challenges against priestly celibacy. He upheld it. In 1968, he has to issue another encyclical because he has to deal with the issue of artificial birth control. His advisors recommended loosening the Catholic Church’s stance against artificial birth control. He disagreed. He upheld the Church’s teaching against ABC. Within 24 hours, in an event unprecedented in the history of the Church, Catholic theologians, going far beyond their authority, took out a full page ad in the New York Times to ‘correct’ the Pope. They said that ABC is OK in some cases for married couples. That was not true. In seminaries in the 1970s, prospective priests were taught Humani Generis but they were also told a lie. That the Church would change her teaching about ABC. So when they became priests and confused parishioners asked, they said it was a personal conscience matter. Wrong answer.
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Dan123
Guest
After millennia of being forced to hide who they are perhaps they’re glad that they can openly talk about their lives, their unique experiences and cultural contributions without as much fear of being ostracized?So why Gay Pride parades?
If Catholics were driven underground for centuries and then finally gained acceptance would you not want to do the same?
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