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childofmary1143
Guest
Too much of anything can be bad and to suggest that a Homily or Sermon be said in Latin is ridiculous. For a Priest to preach in a language that HE KNOWS nobody understands is wrong.
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AJV
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BobP123
Guest
So you’d prefer to hear one in Italian or French if you were in those countries?
I really think it’s sad that in this day and age people still frown on having to learn a new language or two.
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childofmary1143
Guest
No I prefer not to hear it in Italian or French as I don’t speak or understand that language. But since I don’t live in Italy or France I don’t need to. I live in an English speaking country and to understand the sermon it would have to be in a language that I know.
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Abira
Guest
I doubt you’d get any Catholic converts - how can a stranger hear any kind of message of the sermon is in latin? They can’t be persuaded or taught anything.
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mtr01
Guest
Well, to get back on track, IMO Latin is superior to the vernacular for two reasons. First, the universal aspect that a previous poster mentioned. The idea that Mass is being celebrated in the same language throughout the world better reflects the universality of the Church, at least to me. Second, I like the idea of a language that has been “set aside” for the purpose of worship. I’m sure none of us go around speaking Latin to each other on a regular basis, so to reserve it for the Holy Mass makes it more “special”, at least to me.
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BobP123
Guest
I agree. Most people stay away from anything they don’t understand, including the weather report.
unless they have an interpreter of course.
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JKirkLVNV
Guest
In addressing these two arguments, I would not discount them. For me, however, it’s a balance scale. While there may be good things about having Latin in our worship (primarily the advantage in large international Masses), I think that in the balance the vernacular has benefits that weigh equally on the scale. I doubt most people, at Mass, are thinking about what’s going on in Spain or Germany, even though they know that Mass is offered in Spain and Germany. I think they’re concentrating on the Mass that’s being celebrated before them and I think that if it is in the vernacular, it sinks into their understanding and reasoning. At least it has into mine. As for a sacral language, I quite see the point, but we can brush up our vernacular for worship, “thees” and “thy” and “thine” and so forth.
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LilyM
Guest
I can walk down the street here on any Sunday and hear Masses in Portuguese, Spanish and Chinese. I’ve been abroad and heard Masses in German and Croatian.
Guess what, I’ve heard all these Masses and understood 'em all much better than I EVER would Latin!
It’s not that it’s a foreign language per se that’s the problem, but it’s notoriously not that easy a language for native English speakers to pick up.
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Abira
Guest
wouldn’t a compromise be to have the english/vernacular translation next to the latin?
or would both sides of the argument still be unhappy with that?
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BobP123
Guest
That’s because you felt you didn’t have to and/or you haven’t been exposed too heavily in it. Not surprising since Latin was virtually nonexistent for some twenty years or so.
But, hey, if you’re that stubborn about it, you don’t need to learn Latin or go to a Latin Mass.
May I ask, though, why you post here at all? I know if there were a topic on saying Mass in, say, Korean, I just wouldn’t participate. Some things simply aren’t worth getting upset about.
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LilyM
Guest
Excuse me, both parents doctors trained in Latin, went to Catholic school, sang all the hymns and different parts of the Mass in Latin - don’t tell me what I have and haven’t been exposed to.
Your point about ‘a topic on saying Mass in Korean’ is interesting. There isn’t any such thread, never has been.
Why? Because it’s only the Latinists who would DARE to hint even that their pet language is superior to another. You’re more prideful and stubborn about the issue than I would ever wish to be about either Latin or the vernacular, I can tell you.
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Brendan
Guest
See, that’s just the opposite for me. I used to travel for business a lot and have attended Masses in Korea, Japan, Amsterdam, France Italy and Germany.
In each case, I sought out the Latin Mass ( N.O.) and yes, they all had them.
So by me learning the Mass in one other language (Latin), I was able to follow and respond at Masses in all those countries.
This is precisely why +Benedict called for Masses with large international attendance to be said in Latin.
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Brendan
Guest
Actually, there was. I participated in it, describing my experiences at Mass in the Cathedral in Seoul. It was quite a while back though.
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LilyM
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I defer to your superior knowledge (about the Korean Mass thread at least - I’m sure that would’ve been interesting)
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flyersfan1088
Guest
Along a slightly different vein, while serving as sponsor in the RCIA program I can tell you that most of the converts I’ve dealt with have told me they would never have considered the Catholic Church if mass was still in latin. This is an often forgotten aspect by the people who are rabidly anti-vernacular.
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JKirkLVNV
Guest
We may never say that the Mass ought ONLY be in the vernacular (there’s an anathema attached to that!), but you bring up question that I’ve often wondered: what non-essentials would a self-identifying “traditionalist” be willing to give up for the evangelization of souls? Could Latin go?
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Rabbititus
Guest
It’s often been my impression that most middle-of-the-road traditionalists don’t have a problem with vernacular masses - the problem is that almost all masses are vernacular and Latin is non-existant in most parishes. Priests aren’t taught how to celebrate mass in Latin, and the laity isn’t given any sort of instruction on how to remember basic prayers or responses in the language - so it’s little wonder that most people prefer vernacular masses. Latin has become something a Catholic has to find out about all by himself, teach to himself without any support, and then travel out of his way to experience.
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Brendan
Guest
That pretty much sums it up.
The Mass in the vernacular has it’s place, but Vatican II did instruct that the faithful should be able to say or sing their parts of the Mass in Latin.
We should respect that and make an effort to learn how to respond at the Mass in Latin.
In addition, +Benedict has recently instructed (in Sacramentum Charitas) that seminarians learn sufficent Latin to say the Mass and to ongoingly maintain those skills.
Since the priests have to practice Latin, and we need to know Latin responses, how can anyone object if a parish has multiple Sunday Masses, having one of those be in Latin?
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