Is the accumulation of wealth a sin?

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bbobrzynski said:
Is the accumulation of wealth, i.e. buying things you realy dont need, a sin?
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You’re asking two different questions, first, whether it is a sin to accumulate wealth, second whether it is a sin to buy things you don’t need.

As for the first, I’d it depends on how you accumulate your wealth. If you’re in business do you treat employees and customers fairly? If you’re a professional do you act ethically?

For the second I’d ask how attached you are to your possessions? How much would it hurt you to give up your stereo system, your BMW, your house?
Everyone is concentrating on the young man who went away sad but Jesus didn’t condemn wealth per se. He had at least one rich friend who he didn’t ask to give up his wealth.
Ananias and his wife were struck dead not for failing to give all they had but for lying about it (Acts 5:1-10). Peter makes it clear they could have kept their property with no problem.
 
Check out today’s gospel reading, Luke 12:13-21, the parable of the rich fool.
Here also an excerpt from the Navarre Bible commentary on the reading:
  1. This man’s stupidity consisted in making material possession his
    only aim in life and his only insurance policy. It is lawful for a person
    to want to own what he needs for living, but if possession of material
    resources becomes an absolute, it spells the ultimate destruction of
    the individual and of society. “Increased possession is not the ulti-
    mate goal of nations nor of individuals. All growth is ambivalent. It is
    essential if man is to develop as a man, but in a way it imprisons man
    if he considers it the supreme good, and it restricts his vision. Then
    we see hearts harden and minds close, and men no longer gather to-
    gether in friendship but out of self-interest, which soon leads to strife
    and disunity. The exclusive pursuit of possessions thus becomes an
    obstacle to individual fulfillment and to man’s true greatness. Both for
    nations and for individual, avarice is the most evident form of underde-
    velopment” ([Pope] Paul VI, “Populorum Progressio”, 19)
 
thechrismyster said:
Frank Sinatra had more cash than all of us combined… it was also a little secret at the time that little things… like if a local Catholic grade school was having money problems suddenly someone in a suit would anonymously drop a check for 25,000 in the collection, or when a school in hoboken was having transportation issues, quietly and suddenly 3 or 4 brand new school buses would just appear in their school parking lot overnight…
things like this were being done by him constantly.

getting can be easy… giving can be hard.
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I always did like Frank, and he’s not a bad singer either.

Attachment to wealth is a sin. Jesus tells us where our treasures lie so also do our hearts lie. Are we attached to our wealth or do we use it for the greater good ?

We are required to give to the Chruch and poor according to our means. To those who have much, much is expected. Studies often show that as a percentage of income, the poor give much more than the wealthy.

A wealthy person may give a 100 bucks or even 1000 but the poor person who only gives a dollar may be making much more of a sacrifice. When we give of our surplus it doesn’t mean much. IF we have to sacrifice a little it means a whole lot more.
 
Paul:

Part of the question always is - Are we sharing these things? In your case, have you found a way to share the stereo system so others can have the pleasure of listening to it? Do you offer those in you parish rides to and from Mass in your BMW so that the riches are"rebestowed" on the less fortunate, if only during the few minutes they are riding in the car on the way to and from Mass?..
Paul_Folbrecht said:
Ok, so far one person has told me that my stereo is too expensive. 🙂

I forgot to mention one thing - I didn’t pay $15K - I buy everything used and scrounge for deals.

As for being attached - I can honestly say I’m not. I’m all about God… I go to daily Mass a lot. Whenever I can. Much spiritual reading, and daily rosary.

One factor is that I’m still single. When I have kids, I’ll have much less free time, I’m sure. Less time to listen.

So - I could give it up. In fact, sometimes, I feel I’d be even happier if I did. So why don’t I? I don’t know.

As for this particular monetary value, though - these things are, well, relative. To many, many people in the world, spending $1000 on a stereo would be seen as an unimaginable luxury, and that is very basic. (And as for the BMW - it is very, very safe to drive and I plan to drive it into the ground before I get another car - and I doubt I’ll ever have enough BMW.)

But enough about me and my personal situation. Some very good posts in this thread. Very good reading.
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… I think that’s probably t least as important as the amount of money these things cost.

I will agree that BMW’s are very safe - several models have done quite well on the various NIHTSA tests, and I’ve seen people walk away from accidents they’ve had in BMW’s where they would have been killed or seriously injured in most other cars.

On top of that, BMW is among the short list of companies that did business with the State of Israel during the 1950 and 60’s when most other companies were complying with the Arab demands not to sell or buy to/from Israel.

That probably doesn’t mean much to most Cathoics, but it means something to me as it tells me the Board of Directors of the Corporation were willing to sacrifice profits (from the sales to the Arabs and their allies) to do what they believed to be right.

Most Companies function AMORALLY, so I treasure any occasion in which a company functions morally in spite of a decided cost.

For this and other reasons, I’ve driven nothing but BMW’s and VW’s (except when renting something) for the last 13 years.

Otherwise, this discussion always comes down to my favorite hobby horse, the tithe, which is one of the most powerful and unused Sacramentals available to the Church.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael
 
thechrismyster said:
Christian stewardship would oblige you not to throw away what you’ve been given by God.
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Chrismyster:

If you’ll study the life of St. Francis of Assisi, you’ll see that he did just that, but that he threw the possessions to the poor, and then at his outraged father.

Since St. Francis was called by our Lord to found an Order, cause someone else to found another Order and to “Rebuild my Church”, I’d hardly want to be the one to call what he did a sinful act.

If you read what our Lord told the young man who rusted in his wealth to do, and at how rich people gave their money to the Early Church in the Book of Acts, you’ll see that giving the accumulated wealth was considered a way of purifying one’s soul and of demonstraiting one’s reliance on God.

What do you think would happen if the rich people in our Church made a conscious effort to support the poor, not by making nonbelievers pay taxes they may not necessarily be able to afford into a system run by other nonbelievers, but by giving the money into a Catholic charity that would enable the Catholic Church to emulate the Early Church’s “From each acccording to his abilities, to each accordng to his needs” as is stated in the Book of the Acts of the Apostles?

Good Stewardship is remembering whose money it really is and then acting accordingly.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael
 
It’s easier to be detatched from money when you don’t have any.😃

I have a hard time understanding people spending a large amounts of money on luxery items when there are so many out there in need. A group from my former parish when on a mission trip to Haiti to help build an orphanage. They literally came home with just the clothes on their back. They saw people in such need they couldn’t justify taking anything back with them.

Ofcourse I sit here in my double wide mobile home that cost less than many peoples cars it’s very hard to phathom spending anywhere near $15,000 on a stereo.

If I was wealthy would I feel differently, chances are pretty good that I might. I think living simply has really been a blessing to us. If we suddenly came into a large amount of money would change my tune? I really hope not. I hope I would be generous with those less fortunate. I think if one can afford a $15000 stereo one should seriously consider spending some time visiting a poverty stricken country to see if he or she is coveting their goods or not.

Just my opinion.🙂
 
It all relative, I live in a fairly expensive neighborhood, we have ridiculous expenses for tuition, housing and everything else. I don’t drive expensive cars (a couple of Toyotas), but any car compared to someone in the 3rd world is expensive, any home compared to the homeless is expensive.

Sometimes, I feel very guilty that we live a fairly easy life sytle. I work for a living, and we’ve saved for retirement etc. We’re not rich but compared to many or most folks in the world we probably can be considered very well off. I’m close to retirement, so we’ve got some funds saved off, but we still live pay check to pay check for the most part.

Of course, we’re very thankful for what we’ve been blessed with, I know full well everything comes from the Lord and it could very easily be taken away. Being well aware that Jesus says, "it is harder for a rich man to get to Heaven …, " I really have no desire to be weathly. My wife however would like nothing better than to live in a big mansion, with butlers and maids.

I always tell folks I’m working on my second million, I’ve already given up on the first million long ago.
 
wealth is out there for everyone, so why not take it (of course in legal and moral way)? just don’t replace God with money.
 
According to yesterday (Monday) homily, my priest said “rich is good, but greed is not.”
I believe there must be rich people in this world.
Can you imagine if everyone starts to follow St.Francis?
The economy will stop.
When you buy something, indirectly you help someone somewhere.
 
vince2paul said:
According to yesterday (Monday) homily, my priest said “rich is good, but greed is not.”
I believe there must be rich people in this world.
Can you imagine if everyone starts to follow St.Francis?
The economy will stop.
When you buy something, indirectly you help someone somewhere.
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I wouldn’t mind following St. Francis. Hang the enconomy!!
 
There is nothing wrong with accumulating personal wealth, unless of course it is at the expense of others.

In the case of global poverty the developed world consciously chooses to withhold much needed resources (personal wealth) in favour of granting people in poverty their God given right to an acceptable quality of life.
 
levi86 said:
There is nothing wrong with accumulating personal wealth, unless of course it is at the expense of others.

In the case of global poverty the developed world consciously chooses to withhold much needed resources (personal wealth) in favour of granting people in poverty their God given right to an acceptable quality of life.
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Maybe you never read the tale of the rich man and the beggar.
 
Neo_Canaan said:
Maybe you never read the tale of the rich man and the beggar.
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The point of the parable was that the rich man did not share his wealth, the sin in not in being wealthy, because the beggar in the story, Lazarus was in fact a very weathy man. Lazurus however was a very generous man while the rich man in the parable ignored the poor until it was too late.

The sin is not in becoming wealthy but in hoarding and not sharing that wealth. When we place our wealth above the welfare of others, we fail in our responsibility to help the poor and less fortunate.

Sometimes, God is generous and blesses some folks with talent and ability or some are just born into wealth. When folks use this for the benefit of others, there is no problem with that. When we use it for our own self gratification and forget about the poor then we are in big trouble. Wealth and power CAN be a huge corrupting influence, but it does not have to be so.

It is all too easy to believe that we are entitled to our wealth and so can use it solely for our own self gratification. When we recognize everything comes from God, we can use the blessings of God to help serve his people. The big problem is that it is much easier to believe the former.

How often do you encounter a saintly rich man (someone who has great wealth but is not self indulgent) ? I don’t know of many. Warren Buffet is about as close as they come.
 
wcknight said:
The point of the parable was that the rich man did not share his wealth, the sin in not in being wealthy, because the beggar in the story, Lazarus was in fact a very weathy man. Lazurus however was a very generous man while the rich man in the parable ignored the poor until it was too late.

The sin is not in becoming wealthy but in hoarding and not sharing that wealth. When we place our wealth above the welfare of others, we fail in our responsibility to help the poor and less fortunate.

Sometimes, God is generous and blesses some folks with talent and ability or some are just born into wealth. When folks use this for the benefit of others, there is no problem with that. When we use it for our own self gratification and forget about the poor then we are in big trouble. Wealth and power CAN be a huge corrupting influence, but it does not have to be so.

It is all too easy to believe that we are entitled to our wealth and so can use it solely for our own self gratification. When we recognize everything comes from God, we can use the blessings of God to help serve his people. The big problem is that it is much easier to believe the former.

How often do you encounter a saintly rich man (someone who has great wealth but is not self indulgent) ? I don’t know of many.
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Unfortunately, all celebs, porn stars and politicians, they’re just like the rich man.
 
Magicsilence said:
…Accumulating wealth has no purpose. Storing up for a pension? Trust in God. Need to buy a new car? Trust in God. Mortgage payments due? Trust in God.

At least, thats pretty much what the disciples preached.
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So becoming a burden on society presents no moral dilema for you? Trusting in God often means being smart enough to employ common sense and the talents He gave you to meet your current needs, as well as those that might arise as you age and decline in health, strength or competence.
 
Island_Oak said:
So becoming a burden on society presents no moral dilema for you? Trusting in God often means being smart enough to employ common sense and the talents He gave you to meet your current needs, as well as those that might arise as you age and decline in health, strength or competence.
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You can believe what you want.

You can view having a nice car as necessary, as using your talent for God. But unless that car is doing 10000 miles a year back and forth from the local homeless shelter, then where is the justification?

What you are preaching is not the gospel, it is life with Christ at the side.
“Sure, we’re Catholic, but we still save for pensions. We still have private health insurance. We still have 3 cars. We still spend $200 a week on food. We still send the kids to private schools.”
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Sound familiar? Where is the dependence on God? What did the disciples take with them?

Or was ‘that then, and this is now’ ? Huh?
“I would donate to charity, but instead I’ll save the money incase I need it when Im older”
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Great, I’m sure the Church would have gotten off to an awesome start if the disciples had started saving up for their retirement instead of spending the money on the needy.

Christ COMMANDED us to be perfect.

He told the rich man that to be perfect he should sell all he had and give it to the poor.

That is a direct COMMAND. That is why the saints lived in utter poverty. That is why they gave their meagre supply of food to those who had not eaten.

They didn’t think about tomorrow, or 5 years from now.

They thanked God for the day he had given them. They gave to to others what they needed, and they detached themselves from the things of this world.

But heck, we live in modern society, all those things don’t count anymore, right ? :rolleyes:

Peace and God Bless.

p.s I never realised you were a mom to 3! I’d always thought you were a single man! Don’t know why 🙂
 
Magicsilence said:
You can believe what you want.

You can view having a nice car as necessary, as using your talent for God. But unless that car is doing 10000 miles a year back and forth from the local homeless shelter, then where is the justification?

What you are preaching is not the gospel, it is life with Christ at the side…
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How does this jibberish answer my original question? I’m never said anything about cars…and whether they are a necessity or not depends a lot on where you reside.

I would like to know how are YOU being responsible by having no resources saved when you fall ill? Who is going to pay for YOUR food, meds, health care, etc. when YOU are too aged or sick to earn an income and have saved nothing? I’ll tell you who…it will be those of us who have been responsible enough to save and prepare that will be expected to provide for you. Frankly, I have no problem sharing any excess I may have with children, the ill or incompetent who have no ability or capacity to care for themselves. But a competent adult who choses to deliberately bury his head in the sand and refuses to plan and prepare for the future is not being moral and ‘trusting in God.’ He is robbing resources from the truly needy and demonstrating some combination of stubborness, sloth or moral indifference/relativism.
 
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