Is the devil's number 666 or 616?

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Seraphim73 said:
I will say honestly I don’t know why anyone would be too worried about this question.
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It seems like an abstract and irrelevant question, doesn’t it?

The Book of Revelation is one of my specialty subjects, so I’ve spent a little bit of energy on the question. I have read scholars and others who imagine that 616 as a reference to Nero “proves” that the Apocalypse is really just the ramblings of an apocalyptic literalist who imagined that Nero was the great nemesis of the church and was clearly wrong. Nero-based readings of Revelation have influenced the way the church has interpreted Revelation for centuries–there are ancient interpretations, for example, that imagine that Nero will be ‘resurrected’ to war against the church, in contrast to “Elijah” as the forerunner of Christ.

Identifying the ‘real’ number as 616 better permits hostile readers to dismiss the last book of the Bible altogether as filled with incorrect prophecy or prediction. That’s why it is important to maintain the correct number (666) to prevent bad readings of the book which make John’s visions theologically and eschatologically irrelevant. Some people go crazy with apocalyptic numerology–that’s one reason it’s important to get the number “right.” 666 is an abstract Old Testament symbol for money, not a gematria-based reference to Nero, which means the statement John is making with the Mark of the Beast is identical to what Christ asserted: “You cannot serve both God and Money.”
 
juliamajor said:
666 Biblical Number of the Beast
660 Approximate Number of the Beast
DCLXVI Roman Numeral of the Beast
665 Number of the Beast’s Older Brother
667 Number of the Beast’s Younger Sister
664 or 668 Number of the Beast’s Next-Door Neighbors
999 Number of the Australian Beast
333 Number of the Semi-Beast (also “Halfway to Hell”)
66 Number of the Downsized Beast
6, uh…, I forget Number of the Blond Beast
666.0000 Number of the High Precision Beast
665.9997856 Number of the Beast on a Pentium
0.666 Number of the Millibeast
X / 666 Beast Common Denominator
0.00150150… Reciprocal of the Beast
-666 Opposite of the Beast
666i Imaginary Number of the Beast
6.66 x 102 Scientific Notation of the Beast
25.8069758… Square Root of the Beast
443556 Square of the Beast
1010011010 Binary Number of the Beast
1232 Octal of the Beast
29A Hexidecimal of the Beast
2.8235 Log of the Beast
6.5913 Ln of the Beast
1.738 x 10289 Anti-Log of the Beast
00666 Zip Code of the Beast
666@hell.org E-mail Address of the Beast
www.666.com Website of the Beast
1-666-666-6666 Phone & FAX Number of the Beast
1-866-666-6666 Toll Free Number of the Beast
(which could also be written 18-666-666-666!)
1-900-666-6666 Live Beasts, available now! One-on-one pacts!
Only $6.66 per minute! (Must be over 6+6+6 years old!)
666-66-6666 Social Security Number of the Beast
Form 10666 Special IRS Tax Forms for the Beast
66.6% Tax Rate of the Beast
6.66% 6-Year CD Interest Rate at First Beast Bank of Hell
($666 minimum deposit, $666 early withdrawal fee)
$666/hr Billing Rate of the Beast’s Lawyer
$665.95 Retail Price of the Beast
$710.36 Price of the Beast plus 6.66% Sales Tax
$769.95 Price of the Beast with accessories and replacement soul
$656.66 Wal-Mart Price of the Beast (next week $646.66!)
$55.50 Monthly Payments for Beast, in 12 easy installments
Phillips 666 Gasoline Used by the Beast (regular $6.66/gal)
Route 666 Highway of the Beast (where he gets his kicks!)
666 mph Speed Limit on the Beast’s Highway
6-6-6 Fertilizer of the Beast
666 lb cap Weight Limit of the Beast
666 Minutes Weekly News Show about the Beast (airs daily from
Midnight to 11:06 a.m., on Cable Channel 666, of course)
666o F Oven Temperature for Cooking “Roast Beast”
666k Retirement Plan of the Beast
666 mg Recommended Minimum Daily Requirement of Beast
Lotus 6-6-6 Spreadsheet of the Beast
Word 6.66 Word Processor of the Beast
Windows 666 Bill Gates’ Personal Beast Operating System
#666666 Font Color of the Beast (the gray in this table, no kidding!)
i66686 CPU of the Beast
666-I BMW of the Beast
IAM 666 License Plate Number of the Beast
Formula 666 All Purpose Cleaner of the Beast
WD-666 Spray Lubricant of the Beast
DSM-666 (rev) Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of the Beast
66.6 MHz FM Radio Station of the Beast
666 KHz AM Radio Station of the Beast
66 for 6 A Beastly Score for an Innings (in cricket)
6 for 66 Bowling Figures of the Beast
6/6/6 Birthday of the Beast (but in which century?)
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Ok I laughed way too hard at that.
 
Hi mikekle,

I took a Bible study class at one time where we did discuss this, and yes, you are correct in your thinking.

It has been thought that the Book of Revelations is symbolic, and that it was written for its time, and one of the theories is that the occurrences in it had already happened.
 
theoda said:
I heard somewhere that they misinterpreted the devil’s number and it is actually 616. It sounds like some Protestants are saying it, but I’m not really sure and I don’t know anything about the subject.

Which number is it?
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666 is the number of the beast of Revelation 13: 10-18.

A beast in prophecy is a nation, therefore, every nation have a beast as their ensign.
The number of any beast/nation is the number of people that govern the nation/beast. Therefore, 666 is the number of people that govern the nation of the beast of Revelation 13: 10-18. The question is which nation rightly depicts the symbol of Revelation 13? Once the nation is identified then you can count the number of people that governs it. All of the power of the number is given to the head of state. When the head of state speaks the nation/beast has spoken.
 
Everything about the Book of Revelation, including the number of the beast, falls into place when we understand why God inspired John to write it.

The Book of Revelation was written to seven Churches in Asia Minor which were struggling with the problem of Emperor worship. Emperor worship was the main problem in the Book of Revelation. That is historical fact. We cannot ignore historical fact, nor can we understand the Book of Revelation in ignorance of this face.

Those who did not participate in emperor worship were barred from commerce, shunned from society, arrested and sometimes put to death.

And to the angel of the church in Per’gamum write: `The words of him who has the sharp two-edged sword. I know where you dwell, where Satan’s throne is; you hold fast my name and you did not deny my faith even in the days of An’tipas my witness, my faithful one, who was killed among you, where Satan dwells." (Revelation 2:12-13)

Antipas (in the passage above) had been appointed Bishop of Pergamum and was martyred by burning on the altar in one of the temples to the Emperor Trajan.

http://holylandarchive.com/photos_src/TWNAPG12_400.jpg
Ruins of the Temple of the Emperor Trajan in the Ancient City of Pergamum

Revelation was written as a message of hope to Christians in an age of Emperor worship and great persecution, that those who persevere to the end will be greatly blessed and rewarded with entry into heaven.

Only when we accept these historical facts can we begin to understand what it means to us and our salvation.

-Tim-
 
Hi TimothyH,

I really appreciate the points you have raised and they are good ones. However, the question is about the number of the devil; in reference to Revelation 13: 18. The questioner wants to know about the number 666 or 616.

I have never heard of the number 616. Therefore, I am attempting to answer the question on the number 666. In Revelation 13:11- 18 John said he saw a beast coming out of the earth. The beast had two horns and it spake like a dragon. He said the beast cause all to receive a mark and anyone who refused the mark they will not buy from or sell to them. The Beast also had a number and the number is 666.

To understand the prophecy we must understand the symbols John used in the prophecy. All the symbols are defined elsewhere in scripture.

The definition of the symbols
Beast = Nation
Earth = A sparsely populated place as (water = lots of people)
Horn = Political power
Speak = the Laws of the nation
Cause = The enforcement arm of the Laws
Number = The number of people that governs the nation
Number of a man = All of the power of the number is vested in the head of state.

Now go ahead and read the text with the understanding of the symbols.
Which nation on earth has all of these characteristics as described in the symbols of the prophecy?
 
616 is only a scribal error. The manuscript evidence totally weighs against any validity of it.
 
Edcel said:
Hi TimothyH,

I really appreciate the points you have raised and they are good ones. However, the question is about the number of the devil; in reference to Revelation 13: 18. The questioner wants to know about the number 666 or 616.

I have never heard of the number 616. Therefore, I am attempting to answer the question on the number 666. In Revelation 13:11- 18 John said he saw a beast coming out of the earth. The beast had two horns and it spake like a dragon. He said the beast cause all to receive a mark and anyone who refused the mark they will not buy from or sell to them. The Beast also had a number and the number is 666.

To understand the prophecy we must understand the symbols John used in the prophecy. All the symbols are defined elsewhere in scripture.

The definition of the symbols
Beast = Nation
Earth = A sparsely populated place as (water = lots of people)
Horn = Political power
Speak = the Laws of the nation
Cause = The enforcement arm of the Laws
Number = The number of people that governs the nation
Number of a man = All of the power of the number is vested in the head of state.

Now go ahead and read the text with the understanding of the symbols.
Which nation on earth has all of these characteristics as described in the symbols of the prophecy?
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Yes, the question is about the number of the devil so lets stick to that.

666 (or 616) is not the number of the devil. The devil is a dragon and there is no number associated with the dragon.

666 (or 616) is the number of the beast. There are actually two beasts. 666 is the number of the second beast. It is not the number of the dragon or satan or the devil -
There is no number of the devil and so the question in the original post doesn’t make sense.

The answer to the question in the OP is “The devil doesn’t have a number in the Bible” and the thread can now be closed.

-Tim-
 
oldgraymare2 said:
Hi mikekle,

I took a Bible study class at one time where we did discuss this, and yes, you are correct in your thinking.

It has been thought that the Book of Revelations is symbolic, and that it was written for its time, and one of the theories is that the occurrences in it had already happened.
Click to expand...
This is what I was taught also – which would come as a great surprise to the legion of fundamentalists and evangelical radio preachers who have made a cottage industry of finding 666/the “mark of the beast” in everything from UPC bar codes to the Trinity symbol on some Bible covers to various made-up papal titles to a Postal Service logo to various combinations of numbers which, if twisted pretzel-like, can be made to come out “666.”
 
Tarpeian_Rock said:
This is what I was taught also – which would come as a great surprise to the legion of fundamentalists and evangelical radio preachers who have made a cottage industry of finding 666/the “mark of the beast” in everything from UPC bar codes to the Trinity symbol on some Bible covers to various made-up papal titles to a Postal Service logo to various combinations of numbers which, if twisted pretzel-like, can be made to come out “666.”
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Let’s be fair. Catholicism has its own share of fundamentalists who see 666 in every election result and backward song lyric.

-Tim-
 
mikekle said:
Well, if Nero was indeed the beast, what time period are we currently living in then? Has everything in revelations basically already happened?
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Hi Mikekle
You are correct in that the book of Revelation is symbolic. However, Revelation 13 is unfolding right now. It is for our time, it encompasses the United States and the European nations as players in the symbolic Prophecy. The enemy of our souls does not want us to understand it, therefore, he supply as many confusions as possible to keep the reality of the matter myopic that he may cause as much damage to the human race leading us to destruction. Destruction because we do not understand what God is saying and we adheres to the many interpretations of man generally lead by Satan. This prophecy of Revelation 13 is for our time and is playing out before our eyes yet we cannot see it
 
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