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C
Cathoholic
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Hap. You asked/stated . . .
There is ONE Priest (in the fullest sense), Jesus Christ.
That’s WHY the “he” that is the priest has an “unchangeable” priesthood.
***That being said . . . . ***
That being said, we have a SHARE in this ONE Priesthood of Jesus.
Baptized believers have a share in that we are among the “common priesthood of all believers” (as CCC 1268 discusses).
Ordained ministerial Priests or “presbyters” have a deeper share of Christ’s one Priesthood.
And “overseers” or “Episcopoi” or “Bishops” have an even greater share in this ONE Priesthood of Christ.
All the verses you showed merely pointed out the EXISTENCE of a priesthood.
Because Jesus set it up that way that’s why. Jesus wants us to function IN Him.
What do Priests DO (generically speaking)?
They offer sacrifice to God.
In Catholicism we offer sacrifice to God, in differing capacities to be sure, but we are called to exercise this Priestly ministry (in the sense we are called by God).
If this doesn’t help, Hap, I’d be happy to go into this deeper.
God bless.
Cathoholic
ROMANS 12:1, 4-5 1 I appeal to you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. . . . 4 For as in one body we have many members, and all the members do not have the same function, 5 so we, though many, are one body in Christ, and individually members one of another.
There is a sense that the whole premise of this argument is flawed and leads you (or someone else) to a wrong conclusion.
There is ONE Priest (in the fullest sense), Jesus Christ.
That’s WHY the “he” that is the priest has an “unchangeable” priesthood.
***That being said . . . . ***
That being said, we have a SHARE in this ONE Priesthood of Jesus.
Baptized believers have a share in that we are among the “common priesthood of all believers” (as CCC 1268 discusses).
Ordained ministerial Priests or “presbyters” have a deeper share of Christ’s one Priesthood.
And “overseers” or “Episcopoi” or “Bishops” have an even greater share in this ONE Priesthood of Christ.
All the verses you showed merely pointed out the EXISTENCE of a priesthood.
WHY do you think a priesthood “of God and of Christ” is necessary?
Because Jesus set it up that way that’s why. Jesus wants us to function IN Him.
What do Priests DO (generically speaking)?
They offer sacrifice to God.
In Catholicism we offer sacrifice to God, in differing capacities to be sure, but we are called to exercise this Priestly ministry (in the sense we are called by God).
If this doesn’t help, Hap, I’d be happy to go into this deeper.
God bless.
Cathoholic
ROMANS 12:1, 4-5 1 I appeal to you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. . . . 4 For as in one body we have many members, and all the members do not have the same function, 5 so we, though many, are one body in Christ, and individually members one of another.
C
Cathoholic
Guest
PS
You are a priest forever on the order of Melchizedek, means Jesus’ Priesthood is NOT based upon mere flesh and blood lineage.
Jesus Priesthood is NOT PREDICATED UPON being of the Tribe that Aaron was from (as Jesus was NOT from the Tribe of Levi as Aaron was).
Melchizedek was not a Levite (as there was no Levi then).
We don’t even have a (Biblical) genealogy for Melchizedek.
(And Hebrews explains that was on purpose.)
Jesus is a Judaite (a Jew). Jesus is of the Tribe of Judah.
So when the Psalmist tells us about the Priesthood of the Messiah (and Hebrews echoes it), we know NOT to expect a mere Levitical Priesthood that was based upon a natural genealogy.
Jesus is a Priest forever NOT on the order of Levi (flesh and blood).
You do NOT need to be a “son of Aaron” concerning this Priesthood (kohen or cohen or plural; kohanim).
Jesus is a Priest forever on the order of Melchizedek (which negates mere flesh and blood genealogical relationships in the equation).
That’s almost certainly WHY they did not refer to priests as kohanim in the New Testament. (They were referred to as prebyters).
You are a priest forever on the order of Melchizedek, means Jesus’ Priesthood is NOT based upon mere flesh and blood lineage.
Jesus Priesthood is NOT PREDICATED UPON being of the Tribe that Aaron was from (as Jesus was NOT from the Tribe of Levi as Aaron was).
Melchizedek was not a Levite (as there was no Levi then).
We don’t even have a (Biblical) genealogy for Melchizedek.
(And Hebrews explains that was on purpose.)
Jesus is a Judaite (a Jew). Jesus is of the Tribe of Judah.
So when the Psalmist tells us about the Priesthood of the Messiah (and Hebrews echoes it), we know NOT to expect a mere Levitical Priesthood that was based upon a natural genealogy.
Jesus is a Priest forever NOT on the order of Levi (flesh and blood).
You do NOT need to be a “son of Aaron” concerning this Priesthood (kohen or cohen or plural; kohanim).
Jesus is a Priest forever on the order of Melchizedek (which negates mere flesh and blood genealogical relationships in the equation).
That’s almost certainly WHY they did not refer to priests as kohanim in the New Testament. (They were referred to as prebyters).
C
Cathoholic
Guest
Hap.
Here are some catechetical items to fill out what I said yesterday.
Christ’s priesthood does not “transfer” or “pass” to another person.
But the Catholic Church ALSO harmonizes the other verses (some of which you presented) about priest**S **(plural).
And the Catholic Church ALSO has the proper understanding of “participation” in that ONE Priestly ministry of Jesus.
Here are some catechetical items to fill out what I said yesterday.
You said:
This is exactly what the Catholic Church teaches.
Christ’s priesthood does not “transfer” or “pass” to another person.
But the Catholic Church ALSO harmonizes the other verses (some of which you presented) about priest**S **(plural).
And the Catholic Church ALSO has the proper understanding of “participation” in that ONE Priestly ministry of Jesus.
C
Cathoholic
Guest
These are priestly functions of the priesthood of all the faithful.
po18guy
Well-known member
Such arguments are often impossible to overcome, as those who attack Christ’s Church come from a life-long tradition which teaches that one’s personal opinion is:
- Extremely clear from the scriptures and,
- Therefore, is binding on all other believers.
P
PJM
Guest
REPLY
The Bible is a Catholic Book
My friend have you ever been exposed to the One Infallible Rule for right understanding of the Bible?
**Never Ever, can, may or DOES
One verse, passage or teaching have the power or authority to
Invalidate, make void or override another Verse, passage or teaching:
Were this even the slightest possibility; [it’s NOT!] it would render the entire Bible useless to teach or learn Christ Faith”**
2Peter 1: 19-21
And we have the more firm prophetical word: whereunto you do well to attend, as to a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts: Understanding this first, that no prophecy of scripture is made by private interpretation. For prophecy came not by the will of man at any time: but the holy men of God spoke, inspired by the Holy Ghost.
2nd. Peter 3: 14-18
“Therefore, beloved, since you wait for these, be zealous to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace. And count the forbearance of our Lord as salvation. So also our beloved brother Paul wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, speaking of this as he does in all his letters. **There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures. **You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, beware lest you be carried away with the error of lawless men and lose your own stability.
THEN NOTE the critically important singular tense words the HS guided Catholic Authors choose 2 Tim 3:16-17
Mt 10: 1-2 & 5 “And he called to him his twelve disciples and GAVE THEM authority over unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal every disease and every infirmity. The names of the twelve apostles are these: FIRST, SIMON who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; …. & [5] THESE TWELVE Jesus sent out, charging THEM…
Mt. 16: 18-19 “And I tell YOU, you are Peter, and on [YOU PETER] this rock I will build MY CHURCH [SINGULAR], and the powers of death shall not prevail against it. I will give YOU [ALL OF THEM IMPLED HERE] the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever YOU bind [MEANS TEACH] on earth shall be BOUND IN HEAVEN, and whatever YOU loose [MEANS VOID OR FROGIVE]on earth shall be LOOSED IN HEAVEN."
**Jn 17:17-20 **“[Father] Sanctify THEM in THE TRUTH [SINGULAR] thy word is truth. As THOU didst send ME into the world, so I HAVE SENT THEM into the world. And for THEIR SAKE I consecrate MYSELF, that THEY also may be consecrated IN [MY] TRUTH. "I do not pray for these only, but also for those who believe in me through their word”
**Mt 28: 19-20 **“[YOU] Go therefore and make disciples of ALL NATIONS, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them TO OBSERVE ALL that I have commanded [HERE ALSO MEANS TAUGHT] YOU; and lo, I am with YOU always, to the close of the age”
**EACH OF THESE IS A DIRECT, PRECISE AND EXCLUSIVE COMMANDED FROM GOD TO HIS APOSTLES & BY ABSOLUTE NECESSITY THEIR SUCCESSORS; **
see Mt 10: 5-6 compared to Mt 28:19-20
1St Cor 11: 23-29 “For I received FROM THE LORD what I also delivered to YOU that the Lord Jesus on the night when he was betrayed took bread, and when he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, "THIS IS MY BODY which is for you.** [YOU] DO THIS IN REMEMBRANCE OF ME.** In the same way also the cup, after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant IN MY BLOOD. [YOU] Do this,…
**Jn 20: 19-23 **“On the evening of that day, the first day of the week, the doors being shut where THE DECIPLES WERE, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among THEM and said to them, “Peace be with you.” When he had said this, he showed THEM his hands and his side. Jesus said TO THEM AGAIN, "Peace be WITH YOU. As the Father has SENT ME, even SO I SEND YOU
And when he had said this, he breathed ON THEM and said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit. If YOU FORGIVE THE SINS OF ANY, they are forgiven; if YOU RETAIN THE SINS OF ANY, they are retained.
It is indisputable that Christ Ordained and commanded the Catholic Priest hood, and that HE had a precise reason for doing so as demonstrated above. Further this ought not be a surprise as Jesus was just modeling & perfecting] what He had Ordained in the OT with the Priesthood of Aaron and his sons.
Lev.6:22 The priest from among Aaron’s sons, who is anointed to succeed him, shall offer it to the LORD …
GBY
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