Is the Restoration of the Permanent Diaconate "the biggest thing to hit the Church since Martin Luther?"

[Julia_Mae]

This is based on an incomplete or incorrect understanding of a deacon’s role in the Church.

What you see at Mass and around the parish is only a very small part of who they are and what they do.

-Tim-

No, it’s based on the fact that I DO know that Deacon’s have an active role outside of the Parish. Oh, and Scripture.

 

[triumphguy]

One thing I can say about the process today: I’ve had far more psych testing and investigation for the diaconate than I ever had in the 80’s when I went into religious life and the seminary.

 

[TimothyH]

One thing I can say about the process today: I’ve had far more psych testing and investigation for the diaconate than I ever had in the 80’s when I went into religious life and the seminary.

Did you have to go all the way through formation or did they cut you some slack because you were in seminary?

-Tim-

 

[Brendan]

No, it’s based on the fact that I DO know that Deacon’s have an active role outside of the Parish. Oh, and Scripture.

But if you think that women were ever ordained to the Diaconate, then you have an incomplete understanding of the role of Deacon and of Scripture.

 

[triumphguy]

Did you have to go all the way through formation or did they cut you some slack because you were in seminary?

-Tim-

I’m still waiting for the letter that says “Yes” (or “No”). While I would like to be cut some slack - I’ve got 4 years of theology and 2 of philosophy completed, and have already been instituted as lector and acolyte during that time, I’m 90% sure they will want to me to do the full formation because one of the goals is to build community among the noobies.

I’ve got some hope of getting in since it was the Chancellor who kept bugging me to apply and she is in charge of the progam.

The only doubt, and I brought this up, is that my wife and I are “open to life” and still of child bearing age (well she is). When I mentioned this I was told that was “beautiful.” I wasn’t given any hint about whether this would exclude me though.

 

[surritter]

I’ve got some hope of getting in since it was the Chancellor who kept bugging me to apply and she is in charge of the progam.

A woman is in charge of the diaconate formation program? While legal, I think that is strange.

 

[triumphguy]

Really?

She’s head of her religious order, chancellor of the diocese, and has a doctorate in theology.

She has some priests to assist her too.

The Bishop doesn’t think it’s strange.

 

[surritter]

Well, maybe strange wasn’t the best word. But you’d figure that a priest would be in charge of a diocesan office of priestly vocations, and a deacon would be in charge of the office for deacons.
At our local seminary, there used to be a sister that taught homiletics. Perfectly fine, but somewhat strange in that she was canonically incapable of ever giving a homily.
I’m not trying to derail the thread – I agree that it’s OK. I just wanted to make sure that I read “she” in your post.

 

[triumphguy]

Part of the problem is not enough priests to do any of a myriad things priests used to do.

Preach religion in high schools for example, or run the diocese, or do hospital ministry.

To get back on thread - I hope that in my diocese at least the Permanent Deacons are not just there to fill a hole, but so they can pursue the charitable aspects of their charism.

 

[Brendan]

Well, maybe strange wasn’t the best word. But you’d figure that a priest would be in charge of a diocesan office of priestly vocations, and a deacon would be in charge of the office for deacons…

That is what we have here in the Archdiocese of Detroit, a Deacon runs the Diaconal formation program.

I was in formation to the Diaconate for three years. I stepped back when child #5 and now child #6 came along. My wife needed me in the pews helping her than my bishop needed me.

 

[superamazingman]

Well, maybe strange wasn’t the best word. But you’d figure that a priest would be in charge of a diocesan office of priestly vocations, and a deacon would be in charge of the office for deacons.

Or even a priest. I don’t know, it’s just strikes me as weird too.

 

[TimothyH]

I’m still waiting for the letter that says “Yes” (or “No”). While I would like to be cut some slack - I’ve got 4 years of theology and 2 of philosophy completed, and have already been instituted as lector and acolyte during that time, I’m 90% sure they will want to me to do the full formation because one of the goals is to build community among the noobies.

I’ve got some hope of getting in since it was the Chancellor who kept bugging me to apply and she is in charge of the progam.

The only doubt, and I brought this up, is that my wife and I are “open to life” and still of child bearing age (well she is). When I mentioned this I was told that was “beautiful.” I wasn’t given any hint about whether this would exclude me though.

Oh, that’s right. I read read that you had recently applied and then asked if you skipped part of formation… duh.

If you read Bill Ditewig’s book, it seems as if the deacons in Europe are much younger even among married deacons. I wonder why this is so. I know one man here in Atlanta who was told that his children were too young and that he should wait.

-Tim-

 

[PacoG]

Last night, I was watching Fr. Connor on EWTN on his latest show “The Sacraments throughout the Ages.” He mentioned that in the apostolic era, there were five orders:

The Twelve Apostles–self explanatory.
The Itinerate Apostles–like Paul and his companion who traveled the world spreading the word.
The Bishops and Presbyterate–the proto-form of today’s Episcopate and Presbyterate.
The Diaconate–the proto-form of today’s Diaconate.
The Prophets–who celebrated the Mass.

Eventually, if I understood it correctly, with time, the orders consolidated into the Order of Bishops with the bishops delegating parts of their ministry to the Presbyterate and the Diaconate.

Now here is the question…(and I am ask this hypothetically)…if the priest shortage becomes more acute, what are the chances of seeing the “Order of Prophet” being revived? What are the chances that some deacons be given the faculties to say Mass and confect the Eucharist and (possibly) hear Confessions?

 

[triumphguy]

I think we’ve got to trust the Holy Spirit!

Where do vocations come from?

I think as many men are being called to the priesthood as before, it’s just that our schools and families do not trust the Holy Spirit like we used to, and divert the young man to other life choices.

I don;t honestly think we need to pray FOR vocations, I think we need to pray that we clear all the obstacles out of the way and let the Holy Spirit do his work.