Is the term cafeteria Catholic offensive?

[Augie1991]

I throw this term around a lot and was recently called out on it by somebody who found it offensive. I was kind of shocked, I’ve never really thought it was offensive, but I guess if you are talking to someone who is “cafeteria” it might be offensive. What’s everybody think, is this an offensive term??

As a result I’ve started watching what I say a bit more…

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Yes, the ones who pick and choose what they want to believe and follow, do not like the terminology. Many of them get quite insulted, and they might rail back at you, something along the lines of, “Well the Church is outdated anyway, and really, there’s nothing wrong with birth control!”

 

[EasterJoy]

“Cafeteria Catholic” is generally taken as offensive. Not as offensive as “dead beat dad” but probably as offensive as “fair weather friend”.

After all, it does not mean someone who necessarily picks and chooses from the unspeakable richness and diversity of Catholic devotional practice, for instance, but rather someone who inappropriately picks and chooses from non-negotiable Catholic moral doctrine.

 

[VonDerTann]

Personally, I think its VERY insulting, for several reasons:

1. First and foremost: It is a failing of charity. It is a form of name calling – period.

1. Second, there are some (misguided) folks who act as if it is OK to name call, because “they are right” and/or are “just telling the truth” However, for those misguided hypocrits, use of that phase is also insulting because it suggests that the person using it invariably sees themselves as superior to the persons the phrase is being directed to. Use of the phrase suggests that the speaker is vain, proud, and judgmental of others.
2. I think it’s insulting to use the phrase because – perhaps without knowing it – it reflects VERY poorly on the user. In short, it makes a fool of the person using the phrase. When you call someone a “cafeteria catholic,” what you really say is, “there is something about the value set of the people I call ‘cafeteria catholics’ which I disagree with, but I am not articulate enough or intelligent enough or patient enough to explain what that something is.” When someone calls ME a cafeteria catholic – and I’ve been called that, and worse - the speaker might as well wear a sign that says, “I am an idiot.”

 

[Nec5]

Many of them get quite insulted, and they might rail back at you, something along the lines of, “Well the Church is outdated anyway, and really, there’s nothing wrong with birth control!”

Great. Then go join some other church or none at all. These folks never make much sense to me.

Imagine if all of us became worshippers of Zeus and the Pantheon of Gods. When the head priest or oracle asks us about our faith, we all respond that we believe in Christ and not false gods but we are still members of the Zeus church. Doesn’t make much sense, does it?

Another example would be joining the chess club but demanding that all chess games follow the rules of checkers.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Great. Then go join some other church or none at all. These folks never make much sense to me.

Imagine if all of us became worshippers of Zeus and the Pantheon of Gods. When the head priest or oracle asks us about our faith, we all respond that we believe in Christ and not false gods but we are still members of the Zeus church. Doesn’t make much sense, does it?

Another example would be joining the chess club but demanding that all chess games follow the rules of checkers.

I am pretty sure I read a piece here on CAF, that spoke about people wanting to be Catholic, just to be in the “club.” To do all the things that Catholics do, because there is a feeling of being in the club, along with family members, friends, etc. but not because the person truly believes anything the faith really includes. I suppose there are “clubby” Protestants, maybe many of them, but they don’t stand out as much because there is more wiggle room in the denominations.

I’m sort of speculating, but also, perhaps many of them do still believe in the Real Presence and know that if they left, they would have to forego the Body of Christ and they can’t bear the idea.

 

[VonDerTann]

I’m sorry, NEC5, I respectfully disgree with your point – if I understand it correctly.

However, you highlight other reasons why it’s insulting to use the phrase.

“Cafeteria Catholic” means different things to different people, and using it willy-nilly - as some do - lumps all people into a category of people who will be held up for blame of others:

1. “Cafeteria Catholic” may mean a Catholic but pro-abortion guy who alsocheats on his wife…but it also may mean a chuchgoing, rosary-saying guy who genuinely thinks he should be able to use ABC within his marriage because he’s having trouble feeding his 6 kids. Point is, the phrase makes no distinction between the 2 people, when most folks would agree there is a serious distinction.
2. Moreover, your analogies are false. Wanting to call chess checkers is materially different than, for example, thinking that the Chuch’s stance on X is wrong, or needs further debate. If everyone who ever thinks that perhaps something the church says or does is wrong automatically makes them a “cafeteria catholic,” then should that term be applied to, say, one who outs a pedophile priest?

 

[KScoyote]

I throw this term around a lot and was recently called out on it by somebody who found it offensive. I was kind of shocked, I’ve never really thought it was offensive, but I guess if you are talking to someone who is “cafeteria” it might be offensive. What’s everybody think, is this an offensive term??

As a result I’ve started watching what I say a bit more…

Me thinks you answered your own question.

It is only offensive to those who do not want to come into line with the teachings of the Church.

I am only a catholic going on 4 years this Easter vigil and am amazed at some of the open rebelliousness I’ve seen by Catholics.

Christ was and still is very offensive to many people.

Read John 6:60 “This saying is hard; who can except it?” John 6:66 “As a result of this, many of his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him.”

It is still hard today to follow Christ. We tend to want things our way.

Armor up, Soldier on!

 

[VonDerTann]

KScoyote, I don’t think “Christ” is nearly as offensive as are “judgmental, name calling, holier than thou, needlessly-divisive, so-called Catholics who by being as they are call their faith into disrepute.”

 

[VonDerTann]

You can memorize the Catechism. You can know the feast day of every saint, and commit JPII’s works to memory…

…but if you don’t “love others,” such that you parade around happily calling others “cafeteria catholics,”…

…you’re one yourself.

We’re all of us “cafeteria catholics,” to some degree, aren’t we?

 

[EasterJoy]

I am pretty sure I read a piece here on CAF, that spoke about people wanting to be Catholic, just to be in the “club.” To do all the things that Catholics do, because there is a feeling of being in the club, along with family members, friends, etc. but not because the person truly believes anything the faith really includes. I suppose there are “clubby” Protestants, maybe many of them, but they don’t stand out as much because there is more wiggle room in the denominations.

I’m sort of speculating, but also, perhaps many of them do still believe in the Real Presence and know that if they left, they would have to forego the Body of Christ and they can’t bear the idea.

Are you telling me that you don’t know any Catholics who believe in the True Presence and don’t agree with the Church’s stance on birth control? Of course a person who is tempted to use birth control or even who does not believe the Sunday obligation is binding does not automatically reject the reality of the Sacraments.

To be a Catholic from birth and to have someone tell you that you’re not Catholic or that you shouldn’t be Catholic is not like being thrown out of a club. It is more like being disowned by your family.

And yes, many people who struggle with the prohibition against birth control believe in the True Presence. The two ideas don’t go together, but holding the two simultaneously does not feel as if it takes great mental gymnastics. It is more like having diabetes and believing that nutrition is important and exercise isn’t. You can be incorrect and you can be guilty of “cafeteria compliance” without losing your reasoning ability entirely. In fact, I would be willing to bet that everyone posting here has rationalized something in their own behavior at some point! It is human nature.

 

[svid2]

It’s sad that some people think they’re Catholic because they call themselves that.

But anyway. What do we call them? We’re not supposed to use the term ‘heretic’. Or ‘heterodox’. How do we describe Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi? I’m not interested in describing their private sins, just their public rejection of Church teachings.

 

[meltzerboy]

I throw this term around a lot and was recently called out on it by somebody who found it offensive. I was kind of shocked, I’ve never really thought it was offensive, but I guess if you are talking to someone who is “cafeteria” it might be offensive. What’s everybody think, is this an offensive term??

As a result I’ve started watching what I say a bit more…

I have a good friend who is Catholic and never even heard of the term “cafeteria Catholic” when I mentioned it. Maybe that’s because he’s a lapsed Catholic, who nonetheless is quite knowledgeable about Catholicism on an intellectual level.

Do I think the term is offensive? I suppose it is somewhat, but better than apostate or heretic, which is what some Orthodox Jews think of me.

 

[Richard320]

Probably. But it really only offends when it hits home.

Other religions have similar terms. “Jack-Mormon” is one I’ve heard a lot. And then there’s the generic “Backsliding Christian.”

I really don’t understand cafeterianism. It would be like self-identifying as a vegetarian but eating turkey on Thanksgiving.

 

[Allegra]

I think it’s one of those phrases thats only offensive if the charge is false. (Or the person thinks it is) I know several people who readily admit that they’re only Catholic at Christmas and they don’t believe in everything the Church teaches but they enjoy the Mass and the Sacraments and the like. These people would probably not be concerned with being called Cafeteria Catholic. They’re also known as non-practicing Catholic, Christmas Catholic, etc. It’s the people who want to believe that their point of view is completely endoresed by the Church that are going to take offense. I would recommend that these people not get too worked up. It’s much faster to type Cafeteria Catholic than Baptised-Catholics-Who-Don’t-Practice-The-Teachings-Of-The-Church. I don’t really see it the same as name-calling.

 

[saraih]

Yes, it is offensive to me. As is ‘true liberal’ when used snidely. Especially when it’s used politically - liberals who agree with the church’s goals yet disagree with conservatives as to how to get there are dismissed as not really Catholic.

No true Scotsman indeed. No ‘real’ Catholic would ever disagree with me! Ugh.

Especially when just war and capital punishment can supposedly be extremely broadly interpreted, it seems to me that the politically right can be just as cafeteria when they feel like it.

 

[mlund]

There’s no Charity in humouring people who endanger their mortal souls and lead others to scandal. There’s no right action in waiving away sin and heresy because someone is “catholic enough” or we want to be warmly received as “nice” and “agreeable.”

At the same time there’s seldom a call to rebuke someone publicly. Only when a public figure is put forward as an example of what Catholics are / should be are someone’s failures in embracing doctrine and dogma really the subject of public discussion.

Matthew 18:15-17 gives us a good general idea of what’s expected of us. Matthew chapter 10 also expresses that the Truth won’t be well-received, that people will more likely hate you for it that love you. Rather than worry about how people will react to what the Church teaches, we have to worry about walking a tightrope between our personal feelings and mannerisms hurting others and our own fear of giving offense making us eschew our obligation to the Word.

Especially when just war and capital punishment can supposedly be extremely broadly interpreted, it seems to me that the politically right can be just as cafeteria when they feel like it.

Terms like “supposedly” don’t help your point any. There are intrinsic evils and prudential judgments. Matters of prudential judgement never trump matters of intrinsic evil (abortion, gay-“marriage,” slavery, etc.). That’s part of the Church’s authoritative teaching on Faith and Morals.

• Marty Lund

 

[Sullymom13]

I agree with VonDerTann, we have all fallen short in our roles as followers of Christ, unless we learn to love our neighbors…Love, not criticize, not name call, not point out each others faults. I think once we starting taking cues from our saints and turning the microscope on our OWN shortcomings, names like “cafeteria Catholic” will seem like praise!
How can we ever expect to bring the Holy Church together if the “card holding” members have so little love for one another?

 

[TheRealJuliane]

It’s sad that some people think they’re Catholic because they call themselves that.

But anyway. What do we call them? We’re not supposed to use the term ‘heretic’. Or ‘heterodox’. How do we describe Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi? I’m not interested in describing their private sins, just their public rejection of Church teachings.

I think those two do qualify as heretics, but that sounds so … I don’t know … medieval.

 

[mlund]

I think those two do qualify as heretics, but that sounds so … I don’t know … medieval.

As public figures giving rise to public scandal they are subject to public scrutiny. Heresy is something for the Bishops to pronounce. I think we can just stick to pointing out that they are just laity who don’t obey the Church’s teachings. “Disobedient” and “scandalous” are fair descriptors of their public examples.

• Marty Lund