Is there a philosophical bases for finacial success?

[Linux]

Is there a philosophical bases for financial success?

Is it just luck, or is there a well defined philosophy that will make success more likely or inevitable?

What are the rules?

 

[Bonnie]

I don’t know if this comes under philosophy (my husband the philosopher will assure you that I know nothing of philosophy!), but hard work, single-mindedness, education (self or formal), a “feel” for the market or whatever the work is, being passionate about what you do. None of this is necessarily moral - or immoral, either - but, outside of random disasters, can lead one to financial success.

 

[wmw]

God allows that some would have more and others less. To the degree we freely build our economic system on luck then yes it is that much luck, but some is a choice of greed or the result of an imposition of power or a choice of who is given or works for a better education or is very inventive or is rewarded or not for their work.

The rules are to come about your earnings honestly and not just legally this includes your income not being at the expense of others. When you do obtain an honest, larger share you are obligated to help those with less that put forth an honest effort, but by misfortune have bad luck.

The origins of Thanksgiving is a reminder of this. When everyone held everything in common no one worked for the whole community and winters were often filled with starvation and death. When each was allotted land to work and keep the food of his own families growing. The harvest was bountiful and the few who’s crops failed from bad luck were supported by others who had more even between such alien neighbors as between the Pilgrims & Indians, but people were not obligated to feed or not feed well those who were able, but not willing to work.

It was so successful this practice of private ownership, equal opportunity, and helping your neighbors through hardships that it lasted at least until industrialization. Since then this is still often thought of as the “way it should be”, but the administration of this became more difficult as people have crowded into cities and are not as connected to a community and became more dependent on the job market.

There is no magic or clear steps to financial success, but hard work and smart education opens doors many others find locked tight.

 

[Warandpeace]

Are you talking about investing in the stock market or one’s profession?

 

[Linux]

Are you talking about investing in the stock market or one’s profession?

I’m just talking in general. Why do people become millionaires. Is it just arbitrary luck, or is there something about their behaviour and thought processes that helped them to actualised that potentiality?

 

[wcknight]

I think there are many ways to become successful financially. The easiest of course is to be born into a wealthy family to start.

The tougher and more common way is to work, save, invest, and live furgally. IF you have some rare talent or skill (such as pro sports or acting ability, or great artistic skills) this is also a easier path.

BUT if you are like most of us, you may have to work, save and invest wisely. The key for the everyday Joe, is to find what you are good at (and what will pay you a reasonable salary for your efforts). I assume you also want to be reasonably happy doing whatever job or vocation you choose,

For some, one may want to become a self employed business man, For others, they may want to work for someone else or their company. The first type may make it bigger, but it is far riskier, and success is not guaranteed (the latter is not guaranteed either BUT it is a more stable route to go -I’ve tried both several times and only succeeded with the later.

Whichever way you go, you must invest or save as if you are making much less than you actually are, The key to becoming wealthy is to maximize your income and minimize your expenses, and to start saving and investing as soon as you possibly can. When you are born is not too soon to start.

It’s not rocket science. Einstein calls it the ‘miracle of compounding interest’ When you invest over many years (as in 40 years or more), your money grows. In todays environment, save/invest in a Roth IRA. It is tax free for life ! Pay yourself FIRST, by socking away a fairly large percentage (at least 10% of your income) and don’t touch it for
30 or 40 years. Let the interest and dividends feed back into itself and you will reach your goal.

 

[wcknight]

There is some luck involved, one needs to avoid investments that are too risky, but pays fairly well. One needs to have decent health or at least decent health insurance. But for the most part it can be done by most folks with good discipline. Most folks can avoid unnecessary spending. They want a new car every few years. They want an oversized house, they want the latest computer, the larger screen TV, etc.

Shop for the best prices, wait until your car is on its last leg and its not economical to repair. Avoid exchanging homes too often, cut up the credit cards except the one or two that you pay off every month.

 

[Warandpeace]

Most of the world’s billionaires are financial investors, technology related, or started their own businesses.

 

[TheCuriousCat]

I’m just talking in general. Why do people become millionaires. Is it just arbitrary luck, or is there something about their behaviour and thought processes that helped them to actualised that potentiality?

If you look at the top 20% of the wealthiest people in the world, there is a definite pattern that emerges. It’s not universal, but there is one predictor of success that outweighs all the others: Have the right parents.

People with wealthy parents are, on average: healthier, have better diets, spend more time with their parents, live in better neighbourhoods, go to better schools, have higher education, are more socially connected, take part in more and better quality extracurricular activities, and have access to more equipment and resources to pursue their interests, and travel more. Their first jobs tend to be better paying; they are more likely to secure capital and investors; they have freedom to travel to better work opportunities, they are more likely to marry into wealthy families, get better financial advice when they are young, have better interview and work wardrobes, have better make-up and skin care products, and they have access to business networks that most other people don’t.

If they have socially challenging physical problems they are better able to get them addressed (laser eye surgery, orthodontics, dentures, hair replacement, and other corrective opportunities). They are more likely to get help for psychological or learning disabilities, they are more likely to receive treatment than jail time for drug problems, and they are less likely to be overweight.

Hard work is also very important, but a very hard working child from a poor upbringing is less likely to become wealthy than a slacker from wealthy parents.

Other than that, buy low and sell high.

 

[Beryllos]

You want philosophy? Start by defining financial success.

Who is more successful, the one with the most money, or the one who worries the least about money? Can someone of modest means who is at peace be a financial success?

How about not having to work? Living a life of luxury. Is that success?

How about working on what you want? Getting paid to do what you love?

Someone who devotes his life, all his time and energy, to money will likely become wealthy. Is that success? What if he realizes in his later years that it is all folly? Is it still a success?

Any other ideas?

 

[JimG]

I suppose the first philosophical principle for success is that it’s better to work than be a slacker.

Even if you should inherit a fortune, I don’t think one could be happy without work.

 

[Cartesian]

You want philosophy? Start by defining financial success.

Who is more successful, the one with the most money, or the one who worries the least about money? Can someone of modest means who is at peace be a financial success?

How about not having to work? Living a life of luxury. Is that success?

How about working on what you want? Getting paid to do what you love?

Someone who devotes his life, all his time and energy, to money will likely become wealthy. Is that success? What if he realizes in his later years that it is all folly? Is it still a success?

Any other ideas?

Food for thought. This will keep me thinking all day…

 

[polytropos]

I’m just talking in general. Why do people become millionaires. Is it just arbitrary luck, or is there something about their behaviour and thought processes that helped them to actualised that potentiality?

It seems that our capacity to make money is due to a number of factors, like native intellect, upbringing, education, social skills, etc.

But how to become a millionaire? To become a millionaire I think you would have to donate too little money.

 

[Linux]

You want philosophy? Start by defining financial success.

Who is more successful, the one with the most money, or the one who worries the least about money? Can someone of modest means who is at peace be a financial success?

How about not having to work? Living a life of luxury. Is that success?

How about working on what you want? Getting paid to do what you love?

Someone who devotes his life, all his time and energy, to money will likely become wealthy. Is that success? What if he realizes in his later years that it is all folly? Is it still a success?

Any other ideas?

There are different kinds of happiness. I am sure that some forms are more important than the other, but I am not really interested in debating that.

Of course I am talking about material happiness. But what does one mean by that?
Well its simple really. In a world where health, security, and life itself has a price tag, financial success is synonymous to financial freedom, which includes the best health and security. I would say that, within reason, anything over a million would allow anybody to have a sufficiently free life along with the kind of improvement of health and security that the lower classes can only dream of. In this kind of world, it is not unreasonable for people to seek financial success in order to be free from the limitations evidently inherent in the fact of being poor.

 

[polytropos]

Well its simple really. In a world where health, security, and life itself has a price tag, financial success is synonymous to financial freedom, which includes the best health and security. I would say that, within reason, anything over a million, would allow anybody to have a sufficiently free life along with improvement of health and security, that the lower classes can dream of. In this kind of world, it is not unreasonable for people to seek financial success in order to be free from the limitations evidently inherent in the fact of being poor.

Hmm, I suppose it depends on how you define “financial success.” I would view financial success and financial freedom on a continuum (bondage, freedom, success). Those at the bottom cannot obtain what is needed for life. Those at the top have (millionaires) have much, much more than they need.

I do not think there is a philosophical basis for financial success if financial success means being in the top few percentage of wage earners. I find that immoderate and uncharitable.

 

[Beryllos]

Of course I am talking about material happiness. But what does one mean by that?
Well its simple really. In a world where health, security, and life itself has a price tag, financial success is synonymous to financial freedom, which includes the best health and security. I would say that, within reason, anything over a million would allow anybody to have a sufficiently free life along with the kind of improvement of health and security that the lower classes can only dream of. In this kind of world, it is not unreasonable for people to seek financial success in order to be free from the limitations evidently inherent in the fact of being poor.

Okay, that might be a good working definition, not the only possible definition, but a suitable starting point for discussion.

 

[wcknight]

As folks have pointed out financial success is relative, AND it does not mean one is happy or content.

Someone who has not reached their first or second BILLION may still think they are a failure, and even if they do obtain their goal, they may be very miserable in their wealth.

To me financial success is not having to worry about my finances. My bills are all paid up. I have very little debt or none at all. I no longer have to work for a living. I have income so I can retire if and when I want to. I can afford to give to others or to the poor. I can leave a small legacy to my heirs. I don’t need a million bucks to do that.

Someone else’s idea of financial success may be far different. SOme may choose to get that million bucks or more. Others may be satisfied with just having enough to live on. I think what one has to determine, is what will make you happy ? and more importantly, is it consistent with what God wants of us ?

Money should only be a tool that can help us get what we need. It should not be the goal to hoard huge sums so we can impress our friends or neighbors. We can either love God or love money not both. Some folks live to buy everything in sight. It’s like their goal to die with the most toys.

In our consumer oriented society, that is the way Madison Ave wants us to think. BUT you will notice that no matter how much you want to get something, once you get it, you have a let down. You can never get happy or at least stay happy buying stuff. Once you buy something then your desires turn to the next best thing. It’s never ending. There is no item that can ever totally satisfy our drive to get more junk.

I look in my house and I see an endless array of junk, that I wonder why I ever wanted this
stuff. I can understand why hermits are very content to live off the bare minimums. For now my junk occupies a huge amount of my time. I’m trying to get rid of as much stuff as I possibly can. I would hold a yard sale, BUT I doubt anyone wants this stuff. The last time I had one, almost nothing got sold… and I wasted a day moving the stuff in and out of the house.

 

[Linux]

As folks have pointed out financial success is relative, AND it does not mean one is happy or content.

Someone who has not reached their first or second BILLION may still think they are a failure, and even if they do obtain their goal, they may be very miserable in their wealth.

To me financial success is not having to worry about my finances. My bills are all paid up. I have very little debt or none at all. I no longer have to work for a living. I have income so I can retire if and when I want to. I can afford to give to others or to the poor. I can leave a small legacy to my heirs. I don’t need a million bucks to do that.

Someone else’s idea of financial success may be far different. SOme may choose to get that million bucks or more. Others may be satisfied with just having enough to live on. I think what one has to determine, is what will make you happy ? and more importantly, is it consistent with what God wants of us ?

Money should only be a tool that can help us get what we need. It should not be the goal to hoard huge sums so we can impress our friends or neighbors. We can either love God or love money not both. Some folks live to buy everything in sight. It’s like their goal to die with the most toys.

In our consumer oriented society, that is the way Madison Ave wants us to think. BUT you will notice that no matter how much you want to get something, once you get it, you have a let down. You can never get happy or at least stay happy buying stuff. Once you buy something then your desires turn to the next best thing. It’s never ending. There is no item that can ever totally satisfy our drive to get more junk.

I look in my house and I see an endless array of junk, that I wonder why I ever wanted this
stuff. I can understand why hermits are very content to live off the bare minimums. For now my junk occupies a huge amount of my time. I’m trying to get rid of as much stuff as I possibly can. I would hold a yard sale, BUT I doubt anyone wants this stuff. The last time I had one, almost nothing got sold… and I wasted a day moving the stuff in and out of the house.

This is all really a big straw-man. The OP did not ask, what is material happiness. Or is it relative. It basically asked is there an underlying behavior or state of mind in the millionaire that can be grasped as a consistent life-philosophy which can be applied by anyone in their Goal to material success (regardless of what amount an individual conceives as successful.) Material hapiness is not the same thing as spiritual happiness. Material gratification is not the same thing as spiritual gratification, and i am not interested in debated that distinction. You can make another thread if you want and i might pop by. I am talking about the philosophy of money making.

Books like “The habits of millionaires” and “The Secret” imply that there is a philsophy.

 

[Cartesian]

This is all really a big straw-man. The OP did not ask, what is material happiness. Or is it relative. It basically asked is there an underlying behaviour or state of mind in the millionaire that can be grasped as a consistent life-philosophy which can be applied by anyone in their Goal to material success (regardless of what amount an individual conceives as successful.) Material happiness is not the same thing as spiritual happiness. Material gratification is not the same thing as spiritual gratification, and i am not interested in debated that distinction. You can make another thread if you want and i might pop by. I am talking about the philosophy of money making.

Books like “The habits of millionaires” and “The Secret” imply that there is a philsophy.

I spend whole yesterday reflecting on this issue and I know this discussion would emerge, so I avoided to post my conclusions in the end of the day. But let me risk some words. Now my points may contain many mistakes, because despite me being very passionate about philosophy I am ashamed I am yet to read one book.

First thing, maybe it was unintentional but the poster asked his question in philosophical domain, hence the thread being posted here. This means that he should get answers which could be accepted in the domain of Philosophy. If he wanted those kind of self-help tips or finance tips he would have formulated the question differently or maybe have gone to another thread. But for the way he formulated I am almost sure he wants one explanation that comes from one rational argument. Curiously you mention that The Secret has some philosophy. I will not give my opinion about that book and similar ones to not lose the charity or offend who might like it, but I suggest that you really research what place those kind of books occupy within philosophy or science, if any.

As for this thread, of course I can’t get solid conclusion in just one day. And make not mistakes, unfortunately until today I want a lot of money, I want financial success, that’s why I have been studying all my life and working insanely. But I believe this forum is not about giving us what we want, but reaching for the truth.

Now, for my temporary discoveries, I think two big topics emerged in this thread: financial success and material happiness.

Now, I would redundantly go back to what other off topic posters already asked: the concept of material happiness. That is justified because you can’t tell someone how to reach material happiness if it means a different thing for different people. The OP kind of gave tips what he means by material happiness: having a good health and security.

Here comes the role of money and the reason why I think there are no philosophical bases or at least ethical bases in the context of his question (happiness :egyptian.

Cutting all irrelevant talk, I will accept just for the sake of this thread that financial success can be quantified, as emerged in one of the threads: one million dollars :hey_bud:.

In my view, there would be two ways in which you could get one million dollars: you become next Mark Zuckerberg and cash million dollars at the end of the day; or during your lifetime, summing up your humble wages in the end you have collected and spent with your health and security one million dollars.

The first option, suddenly millionaire, would fill pages, and unless you become the biggest philanthropist on earth, it reminds me of the parable of the rich fool (Luke 12:13-2). Quoting St. Augustine:

the farmer was planning to fill his soul with excessive and unnecessary feasting and was proudly disregarding all those empty bellies of the poor. He did not realize that the bellies of the poor were much safer storerooms than his barns

And OK, suppose that you would be indeed the biggest philanthropist on earth, how do you achieve that one million dollars? Unfortunately no general answer here also. People don’t give you money for nothing. You earn clean money in the context of mastering one professional area which people pay you for. And to earn a lot of money, I believe you have to be very good at that professional area and see what others didn’t see sometimes. This assumptions I make subtracting another elements that are beyond our control and that could condition such pursue for financial success (luck, influences, God?). Filling pages already, but in short if there is so far such unknown formula, which consider all these elements and would be obviously complex, it it worthy to spend all your life looking for it instead of directly seeking for what gives you happiness instead?

In my humble conclusion, there should be a simpler way to reach financial success (not the million dollar one). Live a life filled with virtues and with God. The rest, if it comes, it will come as bonus.

 

[Cartesian]

Again, sorry for off-topic (justified in previous post). But I found out that maybe one straight answer would come from someone who knows more about **Hedonism **whom I think wouldn’t bother in finding ways to financial success. I ignore about it, but for the sake of knowledge I will be exploring it in next days. As for the opposing view, some interesting excerpts from Socrates and from Jesus talking to the disciples about material needs.

acsu.buffalo.edu/~jbeebe2/Happiness.htm

Socrates’ view of the relation between virtue and happiness is sometimes stated like this: virtue is both necessary and sufficient for happiness. Virtue is necessary for happiness in the sense that you can’t truly be happy without being virtuous. Of course, you can feel happy and may have a life filled with fun and good times, but you won’t have lived the most excellent kind of life a person can live if you are a moral reprobate. Socrates also believed that virtue is sufficient for happiness because he thought that if you have virtue, you don’t need anything else to be happy. You may not be the wealthiest, prettiest, most successful person in the world, but if you are honest, wise, fair, courageous and self-controlled, your life and character will merit praise and respect. If you cultivate the ‘four cardinal virtues’ (courage, wisdom, justice and self-control) throughout your entire life—though you achieve nothing else—you will have lived a truly excellent life.

[BIBLEDRB]Matthew 6: 24-34[/BIBLEDRB]