Is this bad ecumenism?

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Hiskid1973 said:
We are to encourage one another…We all have up and down times in our faith irregardless of our faith camp…Christ is our common hope…When I see groups bickering, I think of John complaining to Jesus about another group…Jesus didn’t say they must be converted to our group, but not to worry if they not against us, they are for us…Wait till we see hard times here and we’ll see pettiness drop and see us ministering together…At the last place I lived. one Catholic neighbor said to me “I know you love Jesus”…I’ve prayed together with another Catholic neighbor with another hurting neighbor right in the middle of the street…My other Catholic neighbor who was like one of my best buds there…We worked together helping an unbelieving sick neighbor mowing his lawn for Him…We just live Jesus together in our neighborhood and don’t sweat the small stuff…We moved but he is mowing our lawn till the mobile home sells…Won’t take a penny from me…This is the stuff that comes into account when our works are burned for rewards or lack of them…
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Hiskid, sounds like my old neighborhood. I had a Catholic turned Brethren neighbor. Baptist neighbors. Methodist neighbors. Presbyterian neighbors. My Baptist friends and I shared meals together, said grace together. As neighbors we worked together in helping each other. Mowed a lawn. Plowed a snowed-in drive or walkway. Drove a neighbor to the hospital to visit their sick spouse, Etc. None of this small stuff even came up. God bless you.
 
Shin said:
I agree that we should encourage one another! But we should encourage one another in what is truly good, not join together in iniquity. 🙂

Pessimum genus inimicorum laudantes.
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:confused: praying with a pentacostal is iniquity? or a protestant? really? ive not had the chance to do this since converting from protestantism. nor do i look for it. i dont prefer there company for the most part. but JOINING TOGETHER IN INIQUITY?:rotfl: thats a little strong. Peace 🙂
 
benidict said:
:confused: praying with a pentacostal is iniquity? or a protestant? really? ive not had the chance to do this since converting from protestantism. nor do i look for it. i dont prefer there company for the most part. but JOINING TOGETHER IN INIQUITY?:rotfl: thats a little strong. Peace 🙂
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This is a very interesting thread and I’m only responding you your post because it was the last.

I recommend this book for everyone who posted here. It is very relevant to this discusssion.

amazon.com/Truth-Tolerance-Christian-Belief-Religions/dp/158617035X
 
Shin said:
If you want to tell people to not enter the Church, but to do whatever they’re doing where they are at they will be fine, you will reap your reward in the next life.
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No, of course I would never tell anyone not to enter the Church. My question was really about how to help and encourage another, who has no interest in the Catholic Church, and when it is raised, backs off and won’t even discuss it. In such a situation being too strident could surely be counterproductive.

I always remember, the best definition of evangelisation as being “loving another, where they are at.”
 
Shin??

…many elements of sanctification and of truth" are found outside the visible confines of the Catholic Church: “the written Word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope, and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, as well as visible elements.” Christ’s Spirit uses these Churches and ecclesial communities as means of salvation, whose power derives from the fullness of grace and truth that Christ has entrusted to the Catholic Church. All these blessings come from Christ and lead to him, and are in themselves calls to “Catholic unity.” (CCC 819)
 
nhylan said:
Shin??

…many elements of sanctification and of truth" are found outside the visible confines of the Catholic Church: “the written Word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope, and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, as well as visible elements.” Christ’s Spirit uses these Churches and ecclesial communities as means of salvation, whose power derives from the fullness of grace and truth that Christ has entrusted to the Catholic Church. All these blessings come from Christ and lead to him, and are in themselves calls to “Catholic unity.” (CCC 819)
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And…? 🙂

What do you think this means, but that the Holy Spirit is there in a sense where-ever a portion of the truths of the Catholic Church exists… He is not with the error, but with the true part that exists elsewhere.

The Holy Spirit works in all people, even in Satanists… If there were some branch of Satanism that had a bit of Catholic truth in it, it would belong to the Catholic Church, just as it belongs to the Catholic Church when the Protestants make use of her sacraments, and so on.

The Church teaches infallibly through her Ecumenical Council of Florence:

“It (the council) firmly believes, professes and preaches that all those who are outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans but also Jews or heretics and schismatics, cannot share in eternal life and will go into the everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless they are joined to the Catholic Church before the end of their lives; that the unity of the ecclesiastical body is of such importance that only for those who abide in it do the church’s sacraments contribute to salvation and do fasts, almsgiving and other works of piety and practices of the Christian militia produce eternal rewards; and that nobody can be saved, no matter how much he has given away in alms and even if he has shed his blood in the name of Christ, unless he has persevered in the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church.”

Catechisms and other statements are to be understood in the light of the doctrinal statements of the Church and her constant tradition. If people coming from outside in have a tendency to interpret them in a way different from this, because of the language or their perspective from the world, this is a problem of interpretation and understandings of authority of Church teaching. 🙂

I don’t want to be hard on people here, but if you don’t tell people that outside the Catholic Church there is no salvation, the dogma, in those words, and emphasize it properly, you’re not standing with the tradition of the Faith, and teaching it with an slant at best, that is against people understanding how VITAL and ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY it is to be Catholic for eternal salvation.

People put too much faith in ignorance. But the grace of God moves all people to become a part of the Catholic Church through their entire life. This is the goal of God. This is the goal of their lives. It is their purpose. Their necessary place. To fail here is a failure of an entire life. To rest easy about people remaining outside or to encourage them to another place and show indifferentism… it’s a terrible lesson.

But to the specific situation. No one can know in all the details how to handle it… but you do not overcome barriers by running away from them or avoiding them. You break them down with prayer, love, and Faith. If this person comes out of this crisis a Protestant, he again develops an emotional attachment to Protestantism, like most people do with conversion experiences. If he comes out knowing the Catholic Faith is what helped… that is a large matter.
 
Crown_of_Thorns said:
No, of course I would never tell anyone not to enter the Church. My question was really about how to help and encourage another, who has no interest in the Catholic Church, and when it is raised, backs off and won’t even discuss it. In such a situation being too strident could surely be counterproductive.

I always remember, the best definition of evangelisation as being “loving another, where they are at.”
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Bless you, for you have done wonderfully as a Christian. Most importantly it is to be there for your friend.

A person from a different religious background who has been taught differently may not be able to accept yours immediately. Just bear in mind that some Protestants do have an allergy to anything that’s Catholic and Mary. So it is understandable if he is not open to the Rosary. Don’t worry about it. You are not going to push your belief down his throat; even if one day he agrees with you, that’s for the grace of God to work on him and for his decision alone. But you still can be a good Christian friend to him by being there; by being sincere and devoted and by not ridiculing his belief. If the belief that motivates you that makes you so Christ-like, who is to say that you are wrong? So it is tough to be a witness but that’s how it is. We do our part and God the rest.

I have a priest friend who works in China. He cannot preach openly nor can he say mass. It is not allowed in China. Yet he persists – setting up school and helps the poor. He introduces Christianity to them directly in person; to the ones he meets personally. It must be terrible for a priest unable to say mass openly, but yet he is not discouraged. People will see the good work done by him and through him they may be led to Christ.

God bless you.
 
The Church works in fullness of truth with the Pope in union with the bishops.

Today the spirit of the Church is Vatican II.

I would advise people to get a copy and read the church’s stand on those of other faith, and how the Roman Catholics are the ones it directly addresses…in that if we follow all the letter of the law but do not have charity in our hearts, not only will we not be saved, we will be judged more severely.

I think the gospel has enough demands for any person to follow and live one day at a time.

A saint does not represent the spirit of the church, and you can’t take every word of a saint as truthful. Especially when they are in mysticism. I tend to draw more to St. Catherine of Siena as she is much broader in scope. Her study of the Church in her ‘Dialogues’ should be read by people today because it draws on the same problems we are seeing today as well as the remedy to them.
 
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