Is this canonically wrong?

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Not sure what you’re asking. Is **what part **canonically wrong? The Pope setting an offering near the Tabernacle? :confused:
 
Mickey said:
Here is the video.
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I don’t think the on altar, and right next to the tabernacle is the best place to rest your souvenirs from WYD. Was Our Lord in the tabernacle (i.e. was it being used) ?

Why couldn’t these be given to one of the attendants ?

In the past, I’ve seen all kinds of crazy things brought up to the Pope at the offertory of Mass. I would say bad judgment, rather than canonically wrong, since it was not actually done during the Holy Sacrifice (If it were, maybe then it may transgress some canon).

Maybe some canonist could chime in ?
 
Exactly! How can it be “wrong” to set these simple mementos of WYD before Our Blessed Lord Jesus Christ on that altar and offer prayers for all those who participated and that the good work begun will continue by God’s grace and the work of the Holy Spirit.
 
This has nothing to do with canon law, this would be a rubric and/or a liturgical matter (IMHO).
 
Melchior said:
This has nothing to do with canon law, this would be a rubric and/or a liturgical matter (IMHO).
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And given that the Pope gets to write his own book on what liturgical practices and rubrics he uses…
 
The Pope is the only “canonist” whose opinion matters!

Do people not have anything else to do that they have to get their shorts in a bunch over every little thing said or done by the Holy Fathey that “they” don’t like?! 🤷

Good gravy!! :mad:
 
lcburgundy said:
And given that the Pope gets to write his own book on what liturgical practices and rubrics he uses…
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Pray for the Pope.

Imagine being in charge of the spiritual welfare of a billion Catholics ?

There’s a reason the vesting room after the election of a new pope is called the room of tears.

What an awesome responsibility.

Something tells me those items will not be included if new rubrics are specified…
 
Gidge said:
Pray for the Pope.

Imagine being in charge of the spiritual welfare of a billion Catholics ?

There’s a reason the vesting room after the election of a new pope is called the room of tears.

What an awesome responsibility.

Something tells me those items will not be included if new rubrics are specified…
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From what I saw of the video too, it wasn’t liturgical in its context either. The real question is, is the pope allowed to put an offering or memento from a mass pilgrimage on the altar? Think about that question for a moment. 😉
 
Gidge said:
Something tells me those items will not be included if new rubrics are specified…
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It seems highly unorthodox.

I am not Catholic, but I am feeling that this Pope may turn out to be infinitely more liberal than most be suspected. 🤷
 
Waiting for the question: “Who do I report it to when the Pope commits a liturgical abuse?”
 
Tarpeian_Rock said:
Waiting for the question: “Who do I report it to when the Pope commits a liturgical abuse?”
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I love how many think that the Holy Father can do no wrong.
  1. Is he the highest authority this side of Heaven ? Yes.
  2. Can he make a mistake, like the rest of us ? Yes.
  3. Can he be in error when speaking on faith or morals ? No.
I think that the Pope would readily admit he’s a sinner like the rest of us.

To answer the question you pose that hasn’t been asked : You would report your grievance to God either directly or via the intercession of Our Lady or the Saints. 👍
 
Mickey said:
It seems highly unorthodox.

I am not Catholic, but I am feeling that this Pope may turn out to be infinitely more liberal than most be suspected. 🤷
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What is it that you are trying to express through a beach ball, a t-shirt, and the above statement about the Pope and the Catholic Church?
 
Mickey said:
It seems highly unorthodox.

I am not Catholic, but I am feeling that this Pope may turn out to be infinitely more liberal than most be suspected. 🤷
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Yeah, next thing you know, he’ll be seen in public talking with a Samaritan woman. :eek:
 
Here’s what I saw… beauty… thank you for posting the video.

Our Holy Father arrived in Brazil. He was given a gift (beach ball and t-shirt) to symbolize the event (World Youth Day). The gift symbolizes the whole event while also symbolizing each individual person who was there in person or watching through media.

The Holy Father arrived at the Church and placed the symbols of the people next to the tabernacle, next to Our Lord.

Not only did our Holy Father have a focus of Jesus truly present in the Holy Eucharist in the tabernacle, but he also had a focus on all the people.

He also had a tangible way to say to God… my prayer is for these people.

That is a beautiful way to prayer.

The symbol of the people (the beach ball and t-shirt) also brings to mind for us that we should pray for the people of WYD.
 
Mickey said:
Here is the video.
Click to expand...
It is quite something to read some comments on how this must definitely hint at a “liberal” attitude and others replying with their own subjective impressions on how pretty it was to put the beach ball on top of the altar 🤷 The question here is: does Holy Roman Church have specific rules and regulations on this matter?

And our orthodox brother may not necessarily be satisfied with the answer “he’s the Pope, he does whatever he wants”, because - as Pope Francis time and again tries to remind us - he is the Servant of Servants above all else, so I doubt he would ever go with the “I can do whatever I want” mindset.

Usually you’d expect that only those things which pertain to the liturgy would be placed on the altar. Canon 1239.1 states:
An altar, whether fixed or movable, must be reserved for divine worship alone, to the absolute exclusion of any profane use.
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What does this mean? According to The “New Commentary on the Code of Canon Law” by John P. Beal, p.1440:
Proper reverence for the altar means the only objects that may be placed on it are those which are necessary for the liturgical celebration.
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Now the commentary seems to speak about the time of the liturgical celebration alone, while the Canon seems to refer more generally to the purpose of divine worship - namely, restricting the possibility of placing something on the altar for the sake of it, for convenience, etc. but not when it is a matter of divine worship.

In this case, the Holy Father had just returned from his first apostolic trip and decided to pay a visit to Our Lady Protectress of the Roman People, and he decided to place on the altar a special offering as a token of the love of the Brazilian people and of all the youth who gathered for WYD. Now the altar is a place for offerings to be placed before God, and in this case while it may strike as a sharp contrast, these usually profane objects had in fact the character of the sacred offering.

As a traditional Catholic, I am struck by the devotion in the prayer of the Holy Father, and the following phrase strongly resounds in my heart:
Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the Kingdom of Heaven belongs to ones like these.
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Mickey said:
Here is the video.
Click to expand...
As an Orthodox why does it bother you what Catholics or the Pope does, you appear to be looking down your nose, don’t be so rigid, I see on U Tube also the Orthodox giving out about the Bishops waving there arms and doing a kind of dance in Rio, don’t be so stuffy, David in the Old Testament danced in front of the Ark, are you going to give out to God for allowing David to dance in front of him also. Catholics did not make any comments on the Patriarch in Russia excepting a very expensive watch which cost a few thousand as it had real diamonds meant to be given to him by President Putin was it a sin against the poor and was us Catholics shocked, scandalised, that he wore it all the time and was proud of it and no talk of him selling it or giving it to the poor, I could say “Was this fitting” and what does that say about the Patriarch- did I put a comment on the Orthodox Forum with this comment on what you all thought of this scandal but as a Catholic I feel its none of my business to comment

Back to Our Holy Father and His beach Ball and jersey, he is so in touch with the Lord, he most probably like a child went running up to the Tabernacle saying Lord look what I brought back to offer to you please keep the people of Brazil safe and holy, the offering was not done during Mass times, or at anytime that a Liturgical Function was on, but rather off the plane and straight to the Church with his offering what a lovely simple response to God as His Father. Don’t be such a Pharisee.:signofcross:
 
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