Is this Pope John Paul II waving from beyond the grave?

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This fiery figure is being hailed as Pope John Paul II making an appearance beyond the grave.
The image, said by believers to show the Holy Father with his right hand raised in blessing, was spotted during a ceremony in Poland to mark the second anniversary of his death.
Details appeared on the Vatican News Service, a TV station in Rome which specialises in religious news broadcasts.
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img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/10_03/popefireDM1510_468x365.jpg

dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldnews.html?in_article_id=487764&in_page_id=1811
 
So… what’s the big deal? We already know that heaven exists, we already know that Pope John Paul II is probably there, and we already know that he wishes us well.

If this is story is true, it’s only remarkable to an unbeliever.
 
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Recognizing deviations from randomness and familiar patterns in the natural world is what let humans find prey in the trees and hidden in the grass on land. it’s part of us that is nothing more than instinct.
finding puppies and pigs in clouds as kids. the pope in a bonfire.
random patterns the mind stitches into a picture.

just like the skull. or should we say two people sitting.
 
Sure looks like the outline of Pope John Paul to me. I give thanks for it. I dont need any official pronouncement to have my own personal opinion, which I dont intend to spread abroad…other than on the internet:shrug: Is it actually Pope John Paul from beyond the grave - I really dont know re the “actuality” and not searching for it…and yes, thank goodness it was not on grilled cheese…Peace and Joy - Barb:)
 
Any person appearing in tens of thousands of different photographs is going to have at least one picture that can be matched to a bonfire or a grilled cheese sandwich.
 
I heard people say that they see clouds in shape of a cat, dog, heart, etc. This is no different. I don’t think it is a miracle unless that flame started walking and talking like JPII, then I’ll believe its a miracle.
 
Mannyfit75 said:
I heard people say that they see clouds in shape of a cat, dog, heart, etc. This is no different. I don’t think it is a miracle unless that flame started walking and talking like JPII, then I’ll believe its a miracle.
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The miracle is not the event itself but what it causes in the heart and soul of a person. If this event, or even a grilled cheese sammich for that matter, brings someone closer to God, then THAT is the miracle.

God works in mysterious ways - if it happens in a bonfire for someone, hey, who am I to question God’s motives. 🤷

~Liza
 
Why jump to the conclusion that it was a fiery image of John Paul II? I don’t deny that would be possible for the Lord to cause/allow such a thing to happen, but this was a picture taken during a millisecond in the life of that fire - there could have been a billion ‘miraculous’ images… I think it’s unwise to accept this as a manifestation of the spirit of John Paul II - anyone could have created that shape, not only someone giving a blessing… in fact I think I may have waved in that manner on Monday when I tried to get the bus to stop for me!!..
 
lizaanne said:
The miracle is not the event itself but what it causes in the heart and soul of a person. If this event, or even a grilled cheese sammich for that matter, brings someone closer to God, then THAT is the miracle.
God works in mysterious ways - if it happens in a bonfire for someone, hey, who am I to question God’s motives. 🤷
~Liza
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I don’t see how you can say that, and at the same time advertise a website called “the One True Faith”. Do you see the conflict? The Christian Faith is supposed to be about Truth, not illusions. I agree that God can use just about anything to bring a person to Him, but on the other hand, a faith which rests on a grilled cheese sandwich is not, IMO, a very solid faith.
If what you say is true, why does St. Paul warn against following “fables”, etc. (sorry, I don’t have a cite for you now, but it’s there).
And have you ever considered the ridicule this brings upon Christians from non-Christians? Take a look at some of the other message boards on this story, like msnbc. Joe
 
lizaanne said:
The miracle is not the event itself but what it causes in the heart and soul of a person**. If this event, or even a grilled cheese sammich for that matter, brings someone closer to God, then THAT is the miracle.**

God works in mysterious ways - if it happens in a bonfire for someone, hey, who am I to question God’s motives. 🤷

~Liza
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Hey I’m all in favor of a theology that says eating brings ones closer to God. Bette Better yet proving that eating sweets brings you even closer!

I have to admi tI did have one meal this morningi that did bring me very close to God-I had communion at Mass. Which brings me to a serious point. Why are people always trying to find visions of God or see God manifested in strange ways when they can go to Mass and hold him in the their hands?
 
jco2004 said:
I don’t see how you can say that, and at the same time advertise a website called “the One True Faith”.
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A personal slam is not necessary. :mad:

There is absolutely no conflict whatsoever.

I feel very strongly that someone can indeed build a very strong and enduring faith and truth - not on a cheese sandwich, but truth and faith in Christ’s one Church. If that cheese sandwich is what got the person thinking and considering his faith, then who am I to dismiss it as folly? It’s not the sandwich that is the miracle, it’s not where the faith rests - it’s what that event does to the person that is the miracle. A life and a soul is transformed. Be it by some amazing bolt of lightning conversion experience, or by a simple shadow on the wall. Whatever brings Christ to someone is good enough for me. And I’ll be the last one to dismiss it if it helps them to be holy and get to heaven.

~Liza
 
Many believe God has a plan for each being on earth. If that is true then our lives are already predestined. Maybe for the photographer it was to take that picture right at that moment so that maybe in a way we would know that Pope John Paul II was ok. A twist of an idea but look at the event in which the image was taken.

Then again we might be trying to see something we want and not what was really there. Each of us are our own judges.
 
lizaanne said:
A personal slam is not necessary. :mad:
There is absolutely no conflict whatsoever.
I feel very strongly that someone can indeed build a very strong and enduring faith and truth - not on a cheese sandwich, but truth and faith in Christ’s one Church. If that cheese sandwich is what got the person thinking and considering his faith, then who am I to dismiss it as folly? It’s not the sandwich that is the miracle, it’s not where the faith rests - it’s what that event does to the person that is the miracle. A life and a soul is transformed. Be it by some amazing bolt of lightning conversion experience, or by a simple shadow on the wall. Whatever brings Christ to someone is good enough for me. And I’ll be the last one to dismiss it if it helps them to be holy and get to heaven.
~Liza
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Where was the personal slam? I pointed up what I saw as a conflict in your post. I didn’t say anything like “you are a hypocrite”. There was no judgment on you. Get over yourself.

I agree that whatever brings someone to Christ is good, but Christ dwells in Truth, not in illusion. A lot of people think they know Christ, but they don’t know Him in reality. He said that. Joe
 
People have a way of overspirtualizing things.

Looks like a fire to me that just happens to resemble JPII. I don’t really need further proof that heaven exists, or that life is good.
 
Maybe we are looking for (or at) the wrong miracle.

Maybe the real miracle is that this good and holy man, the head of our Church, is so familiar to the world – even the secular world – that his image can be seen in a bonfire (or a cloud or a grilled cheese sandwich).

Just a thought . . . 🙂
 
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