Is this statement true for Muslims and Muslim families living in the U.S., particularly those that are U.S. citizens? If so, what is an example of an Islamic Law that conflicts with a federal/state/local law that a Muslim would feel compelled to follow?
This is not a problem for me, as McCain supported limits on abortion, and Obama does not. Interestingly Muslims should hold to this same belief.
I see your point, but respectfully disagree with it. To maintain Shariah in the US, particularly through Shariah courts, you must choose not to follow the courts of the nation, and carry out the mandates of Shariah.
Perhaps, but this generates a double standard. One should simply move to a place where it is possible to practice Islam. There is not an expectation that Muslims cannot push for their “rights” in the Western world, but do not allow the constuction of churches within Muslim countries.
Gosh, I agree. So why would Muslims find themselves in the Western world. I suspect that solving that problem might solve a myriad of other problems the West has with Muslims.
Sure this is true. A relative of my hubby teaches her sons that they are first and foremost muslims, then pakistani before they are americans!!!
Then why are they in America and not Pakistan?
Sure, Muslims do agree with Catholics regarding abortion, and without the Muslim vote in Florida in 2000, Bush probably wouldn’t have won that state. (Right, until recently, Muslims have overwhelmingly tended to vote republican–the more conservative party. And it hasn’t turned out so well for them, you see.)
Well I guess I respectfully disagree with you. Most people think that Shari’ah just means punishments like stoning and flogging and chopping hands. And that’s not really the case. Getting up for prayer at 6am is part of Shari’ah and the government doesn’t interfere with that. By following Shari’ah, I am not in anyway abandoning American courts.
Churches in Egypt bear testimony against this statement–for sure, churches are allowed to be constructed in Muslim countries. And according to Shari’ah, they ought to be allowed, with the exception of Mecca & Medina.
I did of course mention a Muslim country that outlawed the wearing of headscarves. That country is Turkey. In many ways, I am more free to practice Islam here in North Carolina than I would be in Turkey, or many other “Muslim countries” which crack down on “religious people.” Not even Muslims in Muslim countries are guaranteed freedom of religion–it’s a real problem, on the hands of Muslims (who are only to blame.)
LOL… it’s a Pakistani thing.Then why are they in America and not Pakistan?
Being Pakistani is a source of personal pride and identity. Think of all those Americans who drive around with Italy flags and identify themselves as Italian. America is a melting pot. We can tolerate Italians and Irish and Pakistanis too.I think it’s unfair for people to call the laws of Islam–i.e,. Shari’ah–oppressive. I really think what comes to people’s mind are just the specific punishments for some specific crimes. Although even those are only with a sufficient amount of proof. Shari’ah also has to do with rights of spouses in marriage, inheritance, rights of children, business transactions, ritual worship, and things like that.
I personally know some women who are in polygynous marriages–by choice! Even here in the USA. And you’re right that it’s against the law, but do you know why that doesn’t stop people? They just don’t register their marriages. So their union is the legal equivalent to an extra-marital affair. Which in the USA is perfectly legitimate. So a man could go to court, charged with bigamy and say, nono, judge, she’s not my wife, she’s just my mistress.I just don’t know enough about Shariah law to know which one(s) would conflict with U.S. law to create a conflict. Other than polygamy which Sister Amy mentioned. I thought there was a story recently where a Muslim man tried to claim in court that his right to freely practice his religion was being hindered because he couldn’t marry 2 women or have a concubine or something of that nature. The judge, fortunately, told him Too Bad and put him in jail. I wonder if I can find that story again
St. Patrick’s day…Then why are they in America and not Pakistan?
They are in America because America is the land of opportunity and that they were able to teach their children the “pure” islamic way which they were unable to do in Pakistan.Then why are they in America and not Pakistan?
Very true, but I think all of us should be Americans first! My personal opinion. I have no problem with blending cultures - that’s what America is all about. But our allegiance should be to America first - not other countries.Sister Amy;4609912]LOL… it’s a Pakistani thing.
, is the whole burqa thing. No one is going to convince me that ALL those women want to wear that and be so restricted in where/when they can go out. I’m sure there are some that believe in it, but common sense tells me that not everyone wants to do that. I just don’t buy the whole it’s for their protection (if so, then men should be expected to control themselves better), submission to God, etc. God created all of us and I’m sure he doesn’t find the human form displeasing to the point that one can’t just dress modestly and not be completely covered from head to toe. The women that don’t want to wear that should have that freedom of choice. My impression is that the women that don’t want to follow some of those rules don’t even have the choice to change religions or move someplace else. That is what I find appalling. OK, I’ll get off my soapbox now. 
I’ll address this if you don’t mind. First of all, who is to decide what is modest, and what is not? Me? You? Hosni Mubarak? President Bush? Or God?My big pet peeve, and this is probably off topic
Absolutely! But that’s where we have to agree to disagree, because I don’t for one minute believe that God commanded that - I personally believe that was Muhammad’s way of oppressing women either because he didn’t like them, or had a high sex drive and couldn’t control himself or whatever - doesn’t really matter to me why he did it - I just don’t believe that it was from God. And if a particular woman wants to cover up, fine - but don’t force that view on those women who don’t. What would happen to a Muslim woman who chose not to cover up? She would probably be ostracized and not considered a “true” Muslim would be my guess. Or what if a woman in Afghanistan, to use your example, didn’t want to wear a burqa - can she simply not wear one, or can she simply, by herself without any male approval, move to another area or country that doesn’t require it?
To answer your aside first, modesty is not just about how a person dresses–you are absolutely right about that. It includes behavior and presentation, and manners.
This is part of my point! Why was he turning the boy’s head away? Why was there an assumption made that the boy had prurient or deviant thoughts? He might have thought she was pretty, he might have just been listening to her and focusing on her face as she talked, whatever. There is nothing wrong or sinful with looking at people and to assign perverted or lustful thoughts to everything is abnormal. That is part of why I think Muhammad was abnormal. He had trouble living in normal society for whatever reason and maybe it bothered him and he tried to control his perverted behaviors by coming up with the Quran.
I don’t know. I only know that as fervent as you are in your faith, I am a million times more certain that the Quran is NOT the word of God and that Jesus Christ is Lord forever and ever.I’m sure God prefers 6AM prayers to punishment, but does God still require these types of punishments?
1. Islam, like Christianity, has a huge following. Millions of Muslims are moderate and even modern, many are traditional but not hostile to others, and a few claim theirs is the only true faith and non-believers are infidels. This last group, of course, cause serious problems - among them terrorism. Fanatical religion of any sort is a danger to others, Actually, many Christians can be quite extreme in claiming their group alone has the full truth.
2. What is often overlooked is that four Muslim nations have had women presidents or prime ministers: Indonesia, Pakistan, Bangladesh and Turkey. How many women presidents have we had? So, Islam varies enormously from one country to the next. In our ally Saudi Arabia women are not even permitted to drive and must be thoroughly covered in public.
3. Sharia law has some good elements, but in many respects it is primitive. For example, it resembles in ways the taboos and punishments found in the Old Testament. An eye for an eye.... Stoning to death for adultery... etc. Actually, on the whole, Islam if more like Old Testament Judaism than it is like Christianity, even though Muslims honor Jesus as a revered prophet (something many Christians don't know).
4. It should be possible for Islam, Judaism and Christianity to co-exist peacefully. They share much in common. The problem develops when certain Muslims are extremists, certain Jews still believe they are the Chosen People, and certain Christians are insulting (and ignorant) in their missionary efforts and, as a result, offend Muslims. We think they should accept Christ. They think that we Christians are pagans - like the veneration for the Virgin Mary, the whole panoply of saints and praying to them, transubstantiation, etc. But we have one and the same God, share the Ten Commandments and much else, and should learn to respect one another. Tragically, many Muslims believe that Muslims who convert to Christianity should be killed!
5. The Pope has tried to get Christians, Muslims and Jews to enter into dialogue. This is good. My problem is that the Pope maintains that Catholicism is the only true religion, and this is not likely to lead to much progress. We must respect the faith of others, even if we quietly believe ours is better. I leave such judgements up to God. My guess is that heaven is going to have plenty of Christians, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, etc. We can look forward to some vigorous discussion there.