Is toplessness sinfull

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Clearwater… Might need to curl up in bed with a good read… can’t have you feeling badly…
I think this thread like others, cover every angle from every viewpoint…
so much so… that there becomes to much to read, to many opinions ,
arguments and counter arguments… but thats life, Forums are here to gather interest
in a topic… and go from there…
and as stated before… toplessness and any other form of nudity depend on the individual situation … going starkers from the shower, well it’s ok in your own house…
but if guests go parading around the house after a shower… well that’s perhaps different…
but i’m not sure even that would be a sin… if there old and wrinkly i’d tell them where the towels are …lol.
 
I think this is really just an issue in the US, most places in Europe and other countries, the female body is seen as art and thought very highly of, unlike the US, where it is seen as dirty and parents try to prevent their kids from seeing a females chest if they can, it makes me wonder why the fathers are not encouraging their male sons to appreciate the female body and recognize its beauty, there is nothing ‘dirty’ about it at all LOL

Something else I find very odd, I think most people would agree american society in general is greatly lacking in morals, and is getting worse and worse with each generation, yet for some reason, TV networks and even radio to some degree, are still acting like it is the 1950s, they still bleep out benign curse words, even words like sht, and as. They also are very very strict about ANY kind of nudity…and this is 2013? Even more surprising, the same laws apply to after hours??? LOL I wouldve thought by now, they would be allowing anything and everything!

This may be part of the problem, our younger kids see this and it makes them think the female body is something that must be covered up and not be seen, or thought of, maybe this is the reason we have the problems we do in todays world?
 
I had some rest and back! 🙂

The US, strict? When I first heard that about Americans being “puritanical”, I could not wrap my head around it. I thought, “What? Americans, puritanical?”

I have seem some American shows, movies. I was watching “The Tudors” a while back, and I guess it was a series, for TV, but I got it streamed to me in Mexico. It was SO explicit! I wanted to see it because it was a GREAT movie to learn about Henry VIII and the beginnings of the Protestant Reformation.

However, I hate to even recommend it, because it has one scene where Henry VIII is having sex with someone and shows him basically …well…looks like a porn movie.

I also wanted to watch this other series…trying to remember the name, because I had considered tutoring in a prison. I thought it’d be neat to watch a movie on prisons. Anyway, I tried to watch the very first episode and had to pass, saying, “This is just not for me”. It showed her talking about showers. So, it had to show her, naked in a shower with a naked man. Next scene, shows her in the shower naked with another naked woman!

What more could they show? It seemed like there was little left to the imagination!

As to the 1950s, I ask you this…did we, as a people, have more or fewer problems, percentage wise…of a sexual natural…then?
 
Bruised_Reed said:
Vatican website?

Not those.
Click to expand...
ALL the truth about Fatima and all we need to know about Fatima can be found on this page: vatican.va/roman_curia/co…fatima_en.html

Anything else has the strong potential to lead us away from what the Church teaches and straight into following what the owners’ of the website and their contributors want you to believe about an apparition. Including personal ideas about what Mary supposedly said.
 
mikekle said:
I think this is really just an issue in the US, most places in Europe and other countries, the female body is seen as art and thought very highly of, unlike the US, where it is seen as dirty and parents try to prevent their kids from seeing a females chest if they can, it makes me wonder why the fathers are not encouraging their male sons to appreciate the female body and recognize its beauty, there is nothing ‘dirty’ about it at all LOL

Something else I find very odd, I think most people would agree american society in general is greatly lacking in morals, and is getting worse and worse with each generation, yet for some reason, TV networks and even radio to some degree, are still acting like it is the 1950s, they still bleep out benign curse words, even words like sht, and as. They also are very very strict about** ANY kind of nudity.**…and this is 2013? Even more surprising, the same laws apply to after hours??? LOL I wouldve thought by now, they would be allowing anything and everything!

This may be part of the problem, our younger kids see this and it makes them think the female body is something that must be covered up and not be seen, or thought of, maybe this is the reason we have the problems we do in todays world?
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See “Orange and Black” and tell me TV in the US doesn’t permit any nudity at all!

So, you want the US to have MORE bad words on television and MORE nudity? You don’t think we have enough right now? Gosh!
 
The late Fulton J. Sheen stated (paraphrasing) that if one didn’t understand the doctrine of Original sin, he didn’t understand human nature." The doctrine stqtes that the proclivity to the sensual without control of reason is one of the effects of Original sin. Adam and Eve had this control even when naked until they lost the gift of Integrity, then they experienced guilt in their nakedness because they experienced disorder within themselves. The church calls this disorder Concupiscence. Concupiscence is not a sin in itself, but can lead to sin. Along with concupiscence is weakness of will, and darkness of mind, all the effects of original sin inherited from Adam. The biological drive experienced in sex was ordained by God for procreation. Many in society have made the means to the end, an end in itself. In doing this they are not acting according to their rational nature Sex is a holy act if employed as intended in Marriage a sacrament instituted by Jesus. Out side of marriage it is a sinful act. The person involved may not have sinned if he is totally ignorant of the morality of the act. There is culpability for ignorance if knowledge could have been acquired .(spiritual sloth) In love for our :neighbors as christians we must not cause them to be tempted to lust by our dress, language, bodies and acts. These effects of orignal sin affect the whole human race. The only human that wasn’t affected was Mary the mother of Jesus (God-man), who was conceived without original sin by Gods’ ordination.for the salvation of mankind. 👍
 
ClearWater said:
See “Orange and Black” and tell me TV in the US doesn’t permit any nudity at all!

So, you want the US to have MORE bad words on television and MORE nudity? You don’t think we have enough right now? Gosh!
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I dont understand then, I watch NBC alot and they consistently censor out words like a*s…?? and definitely do not show ANY type of nudity. The FCC are the ones in charge of this, so if certain words or nudity were allowed on one network, then all of them would also be allowed.
 
mikekle said:
I dont understand then, I watch NBC alot and they consistently censor out words like a*s…?? and definitely do not show ANY type of nudity. The FCC are the ones in charge of this, so if certain words or nudity were allowed on one network, then all of them would also be allowed.
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I’m in Mexico, now, and I got “Orange and Black” online, streamed. I thought it was a TV series.

I saw the series, “The Tudors”…I was thinking I saw it here, but it seems that I saw that series through NetFlix, in the US. I didn’t really hardly watch TV, but I was understanding that was a TV series.

You could be right on this.

Anyway, the case still remains as to wanting bad language or nudity. Why would we want MORE of something which is not beneficial to society?
 
Both Orange and Black, and the Tudors are cable only series,… there are many others that are just as outrageous.

For now, ‘regular’ network TV is fairly mild… although many shows try to push the edge of what is moral and upright. Gay relations and gay partnerships is the latest onslaught on moral sensibilities. Yes, it is a reflection of the real world, but it need not be so pervasive, and in your face.

Yes, Satan is alive and well in the US, you only have to watch a little TV and he is there front and center.
 
Ah, okay. My mistake. I thought those were TV shows in the US. Oh, well. Then, things are at least slightly better than I thought! 🙂

Returning to the issue of this thread, which was about nudity and such, I read somewhere that something like 80% of communication was said to be…nonverbal. So, in other words, what we wear, the body language we use and the rest supposedly speak, in some cases, even louder than our words.
 
There’s some confusion here over US television. The major networks, the ones that are available for free over the air (NBC, ABC, CBS, FOX, CW, and a few independent stations) are subject to the FCC and are rarely allowed to broadcast any type of swearing, nudity, and have restrictions on violence. However, on cable, the FCC is slightly more lax about the rules, although there are still restrictions for sure. However, on pay channels like HBO, Showtime, Starz, etc., almost anything goes, because you’re choosing the service, rather than it being forced upon you. Shows like The Tudors, Game of Thrones, Rome, and so on are from the pay channels.
 
rotcguy said:
…So I’m wondering since breasts have no sexual purpose (therefor not likely to temp men to sexual thoughts) they should not have to be covered. (same as a mans chest) Now you could argue that it does temp men, but why is that as breast have no sexual purpose?..
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I find this issue (in terms of societal practice) is pri-
marily based on culture, that is in some places it’s
wrong, in others “just whatever so what you know?”

Now what’s the big deal? If we are to assume that we share some basic instincts with
in common with other animals, particularly mammals, it will help in our understanding.
On an animalistic level, one of our strongest urges is to reproduce, keep the species
alive. Now what does the female breast have to do with it? Men (or Males) will target
INSTINCTUALLY the most healthy and fit Woman (or Female).

WE ARE NOT THE SAME AS ANIMALS, BUT GO WITH ME ON THIS… Most can get past the animal side of human and be more deep than that.
Some males are naturally attracted to exposed female breasts, as it signals to the
male that this female can do well in feeding his and her offspring. Such natural sig-
nals can and do manifest in various ways. In parts of Africa, where food is can be
scarce, males there would be attracted to LARGE females, as they are perceived
as more likely to survive in that harsh environment.

In many parts of the world, curvy figures are often appreciated in a female, as it rep-
resents to the male that such a particular female is healthy. Wide hips in particular
indicate an easier birth-canal. And there are many more features which for various
reasons appeal the human animal driven in part by instinct in this Fallen World.

This works both ways also. Women can also be driven in part by instinct when sel-
ecting a male partner, looking for certain features, for one reason or another. Some
look for muscle, others look for intelligent/clever, and so forth.

So back to original point: Most men are attracted to the female breast
for the subconscious desire for the perfect female reproductive partner
who can sufficiently nurse the offspring.
WE ARE NOT ANIMALS,
I WANT TO MAKE THAT
CLEAR!

We live in Fallen World, so because of
that, we sadly work partly like animals.

I took a Women, Gender, & Society class! 😃
​
 
Rolltide said:
There’s some confusion here over US television. The major networks, the ones that are available for free over the air (NBC, ABC, CBS, FOX, CW, and a few independent stations) are subject to the FCC and are rarely allowed to broadcast any type of swearing, nudity, and have restrictions on violence. However, on cable, the FCC is slightly more lax about the rules, although there are still restrictions for sure. However, on pay channels like HBO, Showtime, Starz, etc., almost anything goes, because you’re choosing the service, rather than it being forced upon you. Shows like The Tudors, Game of Thrones, Rome, and so on are from the pay channels.
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It is comical to me the FCC actually censors networks in todays world LOL what is the point? Today we have the internet, where kids can just turn off the tv and turn on the computer and get a healthy dose of whatever they want to see and hear!

Im not saying I want to see more language or nudity shown on regular tv, but in todays world, it doesnt really make a difference, most people can recognize society has long gone over the moral edge, it makes me wonder why the FCC still even exists and does things like this? Plus I think close to 95% of households now have cable tv,(probably more), so if the FCC cannot censor ‘pay tv’, all one has to do to see filth is change the channel LOL again, does this function of the FCC seem pointless in todays society?

Finally, what is offensive is not universal, what I am offended by seeing women in short skirts, or to hear people take the Lords name in vain, or to see openly gay people being depicted, If I called and complained to the FCC, would they then censor what I find offensive? Todays world does not get offended as easily as decades past, so there should no reason to censor out lame, harmless words like a*s, or similar words.
 
Judas_Thaddeus said:
I find this issue (in terms of societal practice) is pri-
marily based on culture, that is in some places it’s
wrong, in others “just whatever so what you know?”

Now what’s the big deal? If we are to assume that we share some basic instincts with
in common with other animals, particularly mammals, it will help in our understanding.
On an animalistic level, one of our strongest urges is to reproduce, keep the species
alive. Now what does the female breast have to do with it? Men (or Males) will target
INSTINCTUALLY the most healthy and fit Woman (or Female).

WE ARE NOT THE SAME AS ANIMALS, BUT GO WITH ME ON THIS… Most can get past the animal side of human and be more deep than that.
Some males are naturally attracted to exposed female breasts, as it signals to the
male that this female can do well in feeding his and her offspring. Such natural sig-
nals can and do manifest in various ways. In parts of Africa, where food is can be
scarce, males there would be attracted to LARGE females, as they are perceived
as more likely to survive in that harsh environment.

In many parts of the world, curvy figures are often appreciated in a female, as it rep-
resents to the male that such a particular female is healthy. Wide hips in particular
indicate an easier birth-canal. And there are many more features which for various
reasons appeal the human animal driven in part by instinct in this Fallen World.

This works both ways also. Women can also be driven in part by instinct when sel-
ecting a male partner, looking for certain features, for one reason or another. Some
look for muscle, others look for intelligent/clever, and so forth.

So back to original point: Most men are attracted to the female breast
for the subconscious desire for the perfect female reproductive partner
who can sufficiently nurse the offspring.
Click to expand...
I think you are on to something here. and to take it further, one has to wonder why so any men like to instinctively like to watch porn, when all porn is…is the act of reproduction between man and woman, but for some reason, many men have a real problem with this and cannot stop watching it. Does this somehow mean, on some level, they are actually addicted to the idea of reproducing, or is it solely because the act feels good?

It is strange to think that maybe all these porn-addicted men are really just addicted to the idea of having a baby and raising it…that would be nature at its purest form.
 
I clicked on a link “Sexy Beautiful Women” and saw 3 topless women with naked breasts. I saw them for maybe 8 seconds. Should I confess this?
 
Only if you didn’t consent to any lustful pleasure. Feelings don’t make the sin, but consent by the will does. There is moral responsibility when you encounter such a situation meaning avoid the occasion of sin and move on.if you don’t you may be culpable 😉
 
Why did you click onto the link “Sexy women” Playing in dangerous area, examine your conscience. Then decide.
 
I think toplessness isn’t a sin at all but I am not judging anyone.
 
Evania said:
Rotcguy:
“So I’m wondering since breasts have no sexual purpose (therefor not likely to temp men to sexual thoughts)”

Riiiight. No sexual thoughts whatsoever. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
I agree the statement “breasts don’t provoke sexual thoughts” is one I’m positive most straight men can say is false without a second thought
 
If we look back thru history, we can see the female chest was considered a thing of beauty and to be appreciated, so it is quite funny in our modern world in 2013, our society has come to see the female chest as dirty or something to be kept hidden, no parent wants their kids to see it…??? LOL

This is almost nonsensical!! Mens chests are openly accepted, females chests are just different, so how does that make it dirty or wrong?

I think our ancient cousins had it right and just proves our modern society is so degraded and pathetic, we cannot even see Gods handiwork anymore.This is pretty much just the US though, thankfully most other nations do not consider the female chest or any other part of the body to be dirty or something to keep hidden.

Maybe this is because the US hates anything to do with God and does not like their kids to see any of the beauty he has created, so they tell their kids it is dirty and they should not be looking at them…thats a good way to steer a kid away from God!
 
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