Is transgender a sin?

[Antrim]

Why was this question asked in the First place? Because as far as I see it has ended up being a mass of confusion with no clear answers.
We know that people born with a Physical or mental abnormality it is not their fault and it is not a sin.
Before I say anything more I want to say this.
When Christ sent the Apostels to preach the Gosple.He told them if you enter a house and they do not listen to my word. Remove the dust from your Sandels and move to the next house.
If today your hear His word harden not your hearts.
It is being alleged on here that the Trandsgender is in inner turmoil for whatever reason. That is a Cross they have to carry just like all of us have to carry our Crosses. God does not give us anymore than we can not handle.
Just because you have this problem you can not live a life of sin if you want to go to Heaven. Any Transgender person who is not living a Celabate life should have grave concerns about where they are going after they die.
The Church and the Majesterium knows exactly what the Transgender world is and how they live their lives and they are silent on it. Why?
By being silent they are talking volumes to those who want to listen.
Why do you think the Exorcism did not work? Exorcism is used on people who are possesed by Satan. The reason the Exorciswm did not work on that person or persons is because they were not possesed. Satan had a grip on them but he had not posesed them. Since the Priest did an Exorcism we can be sure that Satan was there in some way and the Priest wanted to get rid of him.
Somebody thought I was judgeing when I said that I did not think it could happen to children or people raised in a good Catholoic home and I would like to add where the Rosarie is said every night. I was not judgeing. I was surprised when I got a responce from somebody that said they have a problem and they go to Mass on Sunday.
To those of you who who say the Church is wrong Etc. I will remove the Dust from my Sandels and go to the hext house.

Antrim

 

[pathia]

Why was this question asked in the First place? Because as far as I see it has ended up being a mass of confusion with no clear answers.
We know that people born with a Physical or mental abnormality it is not their fault and it is not a sin.
Before I say anything more I want to say this.
When Christ sent the Apostels to preach the Gosple.He told them if you enter a house and they do not listen to my word. Remove the dust from your Sandels and move to the next house.
If today your hear His word harden not your hearts.
It is being alleged on here that the Trandsgender is in inner turmoil for whatever reason. That is a Cross they have to carry just like all of us have to carry our Crosses. God does not give us anymore than we can not handle.
Just because you have this problem you can not live a life of sin if you want to go to Heaven. Any Transgender person who is not living a Celabate life should have grave concerns about where they are going after they die.
The Church and the Majesterium knows exactly what the Transgender world is and how they live their lives and they are silent on it. Why?
By being silent they are talking volumes to those who want to listen.
Why do you think the Exorcism did not work? Exorcism is used on people who are possesed by Satan. The reason the Exorciswm did not work on that person or persons is because they were not possesed. Satan had a grip on them but he had not posesed them. Since the Priest did an Exorcism we can be sure that Satan was there in some way and the Priest wanted to get rid of him.
Somebody thought I was judgeing when I said that I did not think it could happen to children or people raised in a good Catholoic home and I would like to add where the Rosarie is said every night. I was not judgeing. I was surprised when I got a responce from somebody that said they have a problem and they go to Mass on Sunday.
To those of you who who say the Church is wrong Etc. I will remove the Dust from my Sandels and go to the hext house.

Antrim

My exorcism was not done by a Catholic priest.

 

[aspawloski4th]

Why was this question asked in the First place? Because as far as I see it has ended up being a mass of confusion with no clear answers.
We know that people born with a Physical or mental abnormality it is not their fault and it is not a sin.
Before I say anything more I want to say this.
When Christ sent the Apostels to preach the Gosple.He told them if you enter a house and they do not listen to my word. Remove the dust from your Sandels and move to the next house.
If today your hear His word harden not your hearts.
It is being alleged on here that the Trandsgender is in inner turmoil for whatever reason. That is a Cross they have to carry just like all of us have to carry our Crosses. God does not give us anymore than we can not handle.
Just because you have this problem you can not live a life of sin if you want to go to Heaven. Any Transgender person who is not living a Celabate life should have grave concerns about where they are going after they die.
The Church and the Majesterium knows exactly what the Transgender world is and how they live their lives and they are silent on it. Why?
By being silent they are talking volumes to those who want to listen.
Why do you think the Exorcism did not work? Exorcism is used on people who are possesed by Satan. The reason the Exorciswm did not work on that person or persons is because they were not possesed. Satan had a grip on them but he had not posesed them. Since the Priest did an Exorcism we can be sure that Satan was there in some way and the Priest wanted to get rid of him.
Somebody thought I was judgeing when I said that I did not think it could happen to children or people raised in a good Catholoic home and I would like to add where the Rosarie is said every night. I was not judgeing. I was surprised when I got a responce from somebody that said they have a problem and they go to Mass on Sunday.
To those of you who who say the Church is wrong Etc. I will remove the Dust from my Sandels and go to the hext house.

Antrim

Ive got a question or two for you. Was the church wrong for putting Gallileo in prison? Was the Spanish Inquisition wrong? Was burning heritics at the stake wrong? When Iceland was converted in the 11 century was it worng for the church to still allow certain types of infantiside to still be legal? Oh yes the battle of Hastings in 1054 was approved by the church too. Are you telling me the church is without mistakes? Do you think for your self? You talk about the church being silent on the issue is saying something. What it is saying is the jury is out and nothing more. We are not supposed to have a read between the lines church. Ofcourse truth doesn’t change, but our understanding of it does. you talk about crosses to bear. I pass kidneystones from time to time. Are you saying if a cure is found I shouldn’t take it because I have to bear a cross? If a cure is found I’m taking it. The pain is a big distraction for things like following Christ. Iv’e passed 33 of them by the way. That pain doesn’t come close to livng as a male which I am not at all inside.

 

[Numinous]

Ive got a question or two for you. Was the church wrong for putting Gallileo in prison? Was the Spanish Inquisition wrong? Was burning heritics at the stake wrong? When Iceland was converted in the 11 century was it worng for the church to still allow certain types of infantiside to still be legal? Oh yes the battle of Hastings in 1054 was approved by the church too. Are you telling me the church is without mistakes? Do you think for your self? You talk about the church being silent on the issue is saying something. What it is saying is the jury is out and nothing more. We are not supposed to have a read between the lines church. Ofcourse truth doesn’t change, but our understanding of it does. you talk about crosses to bear. I pass kidneystones from time to time. Are you saying if a cure is found I shouldn’t take it because I have to bear a cross? If a cure is found I’m taking it. The pain is a big distraction for things like following Christ. Iv’e passed 33 of them by the way. That pain doesn’t come close to livng as a male which I am not at all inside.

The Battle of Hastings was in 1066. Get your facts straight before you start berating people. YAWN.

 

[Zoe_Brain]

It is being alleged on here that the Trandsgender is in inner turmoil for whatever reason. That is a Cross they have to carry just like all of us have to carry our Crosses. God does not give us anymore than we can not handle.

You know, there’s one question that I ask of anyone who says something like this. Have they ever had a toothache, and if so, did they bear their cross, or did they see a Dentist?

It’s easy when they’re telling others what to do, but as for themselves, it’s different. They’re content to see others endure misery so great that half suicide, but as for themselves…

Antrim, tell me I’m wrong, that you’re not a hypocrite, please. Tell me that you gladly have suffered all the ills that the flesh is heir to, and have never sought relief from pain, as “God does not give us any more than we can handle”. There must be one, but if so, you’d be the first.

 

[Zoe_Brain]

The Church and the Majesterium knows exactly what the Transgender world is and how they live their lives and they are silent on it. Why?
By being silent they are talking volumes to those who want to listen.

Please explain what their silence means, and your justification for believing that.

We have asked in all humility for guidance. We have received silence. Contemptuous silence? Puzzled silence? The silence from someone who knows not what to say? Or a silence so that no matter what we decide, they can always say that it’s wrong without telling us what is right?

What other group who have humbly asked for guidance has ever been treated this way, and what did the silence mean there?

 

[aspawloski4th]

The Battle of Hastings was in 1066. Get your facts straight before you start berating people. YAWN.

OK I should of said the 1000’s, the point is still the same. You call what I’m doing berating. It sounds to me any questioning of this person is berating to you. If the answer to my questions is yes then that person is consistent and I will leave him alone. If the answer to those questions is no then this person is either intellectually dishonest or even possibly disingenuous, and I will take him to task because I’m fully antidoublestandard. Ive noticed you are a teacher. So it’s likely you have facts like that well memorized or in front of you. while a student of history I have neither facts in front of me or a memory thats great for remembering dates. On the subject of berating. Kettle the pot is calling you.

 

[Antrim]

The Churche’s teaching on Faith and Morals is never wrong because it is from the Sixth and Nineth Commandments which is from God Himself.
You are from one of the the households that Christ told the Apostales to remove the Dust from their Sandels and go to the next house. There is no point in discusing anything more with you since you will not listen. So as far as you are concerened I have removed the Dust from my Sandels.
Since the Church is silent on this matter. I must remain silent on it as well. Just read my post very carefully.
Only a Catholic Priest can do an Exorcism since Holy Water and a Crusafix must be used to fight and remove Satan.

Antrim

 

[pathia]

The Churche’s teaching on Faith and Morals is never wrong because it is from the Sixth and Nineth Commandments which is from God Himself.
You are from one of the the households that Christ told the Apostales to remove the Dust from their Sandels and go to the next house. There is no point in discusing anything more with you since you will not listen. So as far as you are concerened I have removed the Dust from my Sandels.
Since the Church is silent on this matter. I must remain silent on it as well. Just read my post very carefully.
Only a Catholic Priest can do an Exorcism since Holy Water and a Crusafix must be used to fight and remove Satan.

Antrim

You do know there is no official doctrine on transsexuals? It is sealed and secret. Also, I myself am intersexed, also known as hermaphrodite. That further complicates it, and church has even LESS stances on folks like me, let along folks who have BOTH conditions.

The only answer I get from any priest, bishop, even a cardinal, and the NCBC (National catholic bioethics center) is ~I’m sorry, I don’t know what to tell you~.

And for your information I AM CELIBATE I would ask you to KINDLY stop putting words, deeds and actions in my mouth. You continue to accuse us of not listening, meanwhile you are not reading.

I will also be perfectly honest, your posting style, grammar and paragraph structure make it really hard to read your posts. I don’t mean that to be insulting, it is merely my interpretation of your posts.

 

[Antrim]

Pathia I am so very very sorry that you took my post personally. It was not aimed at you at all. You are trying to live A good life.
If you read Aspawloski4th answer to my post you will see why I responded like I did.
I also want to thank you for giving me an opertunity to explain why I post the way I do.
When I said live a celabate life I was talking in general to all people.
What Christ was telling the Apostales when he said to them when you go into a house and they will not hear my word remove the Dust from your Sandels and go to the next house. He knew those people had hard Hearts and they could not be converted. What he was saying was go to the next house and they will hear my Word and save their Souls. Dont waste time on those who will not listen. Talk to those who will listen and save as many Souls as you can.
We as Catholics have a Moral duty to save Souls. We also have a duty not to waste time on those who wont listen or beleive what we are teaching since there are others who will beleive.
I worked with a Transgender who had the Surgery done so I know more about it than say the general public.
I hope this helps you understand why I post the way I do. I am trying to get my point across and try and get people to listen and beleive which is very important.

Antrim

 

[aspawloski4th]

Pathia I am so very very sorry that you took my post personally. It was not aimed at you at all. You are trying to live A good life.
If you read Aspawloski4th answer to my post you will see why I responded like I did.
I also want to thank you for giving me an opertunity to explain why I post the way I do.
When I said live a celabate life I was talking in general to all people.
What Christ was telling the Apostales when he said to them when you go into a house and they will not hear my word remove the Dust from your Sandels and go to the next house. He knew those people had hard Hearts and they could not be converted. What he was saying was go to the next house and they will hear my Word and save their Souls. Dont waste time on those who will not listen. Talk to those who will listen and save as many Souls as you can.
We as Catholics have a Moral duty to save Souls. We also have a duty not to waste time on those who wont listen or beleive what we are teaching since there are others who will beleive.
I worked with a Transgender who had the Surgery done so I know more about it than say the general public.
I hope this helps you understand why I post the way I do. I am trying to get my point across and try and get people to listen and beleive which is very important.

Antrim

I take umbridge with the insinuation that I’m not Catholic. I Go to Mass every sunday, I wear the brown Scapular, and yes 'm very very right to life I even put a tv program on the local public access cable channel hosted by Fr Gruner. I graduated from a Catholic highschool. Since I began voting 23 years ago I have a 100% right to life voting record. You twist the meaning of listen to mean agree with you. I questioned what your information you put out, you questioned my faith faith. Who is the one getting attacked?!

 

[aspawloski4th]

Please explain what their silence means, and your justification for believing that.

We have asked in all humility for guidance. We have received silence. Contemptuous silence? Puzzled silence? The silence from someone who knows not what to say? Or a silence so that no matter what we decide, they can always say that it’s wrong without telling us what is right?

What other group who have humbly asked for guidance has ever been treated this way, and what did the silence mean there?

It is simple why they are silent. It’s because they havent totally decided yet. Which is ok. Better to get it right albeit slow. The church has a lot on it’s plate issues wise, and I imagine this is not top prioroity. There is no grand teaching being hidden. The church feels it hasn’t gathered all the facts yet to deliniate over to come to a correct conclusion. Everything will workout in the end.

 

[v3orb]

It is simple why they are silent. It’s because they havent totally decided yet. Which is ok. Better to get it right albeit slow. The church has a lot on it’s plate issues wise, and I imagine this is not top prioroity. There is no grand teaching being hidden. The church feels it hasn’t gathered all the facts yet to deliniate over to come to a correct conclusion. Everything will workout in the end.

And yet, when we don’t know anything more about homosexuality than we do about transsexuality, the church feels quite free to label homosexual behaviors as sin.

 

[Ailina]

Is transgender a sin? Why or why not?

I think it is a mental illness, like any other. So not a sin, because it is ultimately a chemical imbalance. And I think it is more likely to occur in a sexually ambiguous culture like the one that currently exists in this part of the world. I would also add that most of us suffer from some mental illness or other, whether we will admit it or not! Some are considered more acceptable, that is all. (Would you believe that some even consider religious belief a mental illness?!)

 

[pathia]

And yet, when we don’t know anything more about homosexuality than we do about transsexuality, the church feels quite free to label homosexual behaviors as sin.

Actually there are more solid evidences of something being askew in transsexual’s brains then gays. Our brains actually show up differently in certain sections, and in many cases we seem to have intersexism of one sort or another. I was diagnosed as transsexual long before I knew about my odd chromosomes. In college, over 50% of the other kids I knew that transitioned in school, ended up having a measurable, medically viewable intersex condition.

Considering that intersex is about 1/1000 to 1/5000 (Depending on how you measure). The likelihood of them all being there at that time in the same club, transitioning seems too odd to be a statistical coincidence.

The inherent problem is those of us, particularly the young ones, we either die by suicide/murder or get safe enough to simply vanish, and then we become unstudyable.

 

[Antrim]

I ,read this on another Thread.
Anyone catch Father Thomas Loya on Relative Radio and he was talking about Theology of The Body & a caller asked the Question.
If someone is Transgender and Science shows these people are born thinking they belong as another Gender. Then what does God think.
He replied God does not make mistakes. Just because you think you should be something else does not mean you should be.
( and he went on but that is the Gist)

Antrim

 

[pathia]

I ,read this on another Thread.
Anyone catch Father Thomas Loya on Relative Radio and he was talking about Theology of The Body & a caller asked the Question.
If someone is Transgender and Science shows these people are born thinking they belong as another Gender. Then what does God think.
He replied God does not make mistakes. Just because you think you should be something else does not mean you should be.
( and he went on but that is the Gist)

Antrim

If God doesn’t make mistakes why are people born with birth defects that we fix? Why are people, like me, born intersexed and ‘fixed’ into a ‘real’ gender? God did not have be born that way, mankind manufactured my gender. There was nothing life threatening about my condition.

 

[Numinous]

OK I should of said the 1000’s, the point is still the same. You call what I’m doing berating. It sounds to me any questioning of this person is berating to you. If the answer to my questions is yes then that person is consistent and I will leave him alone. If the answer to those questions is no then this person is either intellectually dishonest or even possibly disingenuous, and I will take him to task because I’m fully antidoublestandard. Ive noticed you are a teacher. So it’s likely you have facts like that well memorized or in front of you. while a student of history I have neither facts in front of me or a memory thats great for remembering dates. On the subject of berating. Kettle the pot is calling you.

Whatever. You win. Your ignorance will not be denied, so let’s call it.

 

[aspawloski4th]

Whatever. You win. Your ignorance will not be denied, so let’s call it.

My ignorance. Ive been studying the issue since Carter was president. I good third of a century. Who’s ignorant? I just love it when someone has been reading about it for a year of two thinks they can match wits with me or someone like Pathia. Read and study up on it for a while and get back to me in a couple decades.

 

[Dale_M]

He replied God does not make mistakes.

That is a silly argument. My respects to the learned priest, but really… nature makes lots of errors. We wouldn’t deny a person with a cleft palate medical care, so why should we deny such care to someone with transsexualism?