Is West more embracing of East, or vice-versa?

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Sigh. Many times, I see Orthodox describe their belief as opposed to Catholic belief. Like “Orthodox belief this, while the Catholics belief that,” with the point of expressing that the beliefs aren’t the same.

My friend is becoming Orthodox and I was trying to research some things for her, and I came across an Orthodox article describing the Eucharist. It said “Orthodox don’t believe in transubstantiation like Catholics do…” And then it proceeded to explain Orthodox belief while essentially describing transubstantiation without using the word. It just seems there is an overall distaste of all Latin culture, language, and terminology… even with it’s expressing the exact same thing, like the Eucharist.
 
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dvdjs said:
As far as latinization goes, that was rarely, if ever, a matter of cross-pollination at the parishioner level, but deliberate decisions of hierarchs and priests - mostly from within rather than imposed from without.
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You don’t think that Greek Catholics often pick up spiritual ideas from their Latin Rite friends, neighbors, spouses or school chums?
 
catholic1seeks said:
Like “Orthodox belief this, while the Catholics belief that,” with the point of expressing that the beliefs aren’t the same.
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My description is that Catholic and Orthodox “violently agree” on so many things . . . and rarely actually believe what the other condemns them for believing . . .

hawk

hawk
 
I have noticed this as well with different things. I have been looking into Orthodoxy. I have spoke to many people. Some say they are basically the same as the RCC and others say they are night and day different. But reading what is on ancient faith website the orthodox have, it seems they are trying hard to get protestants on board and carefully word whatever topic they are trying to clear up. that, or they are just trying to unify Christians in general. idk. maybe they believe that the reason for all the division is merely wording and not the actual definition??
 
I don’t think they rub off much. The East has a healthy appreciation for mystery and knowing when to not ask questions. I don’t think much of the West has learned to, yet. People have to figure out how things work. Be it atheists or Christians… they often have bullet points, mental models, and systems to describe their worldview.
 
Promise91 said:
But reading what is on ancient faith website the orthodox have, it seems they are trying hard to get protestants on board and carefully word whatever topic they are trying to clear up.
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The next iota I see an Orthodox bend to accommodate Protestantism will be the first . . . the closest are the so-callec Western Rite Orthodox, Antioch Orthodox who use the western Mass with an epiclesis added to the Roman Canon.

hawk
 
Antioch Orthodox i think they are the ones who oversee the orthodox churches in america?
 
No, there are multiple autonomous churches and archdioceses in America. The Greek, Antioch, and the “OCA” (which was originally formed by Russian refugees and parishes in Alaska when the Soviets took over).
 
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straykat said:
No, there are multiple autonomous churches and archdioceses in America. The Greek, Antioch, and the “OCA” (which was originally formed by Russian refugees and parishes in Alaska when the Soviets took over).
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The OCA has tried to actually push for American autocephaly - ie the creation of an American Orthodox Church.

They were obviously resisted by the others because the idea was simply too good (and the home Churches in the old country thoroughly enjoy that American financial patronage).

When I go, it’s OCA
 
straykat said:
The Greek, Antioch, and the “OCA” (which was originally formed by Russian refugees and parishes in Alaska when the Soviets took over).
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Not quite.

Fr. Toth was a Catholic slav. When a pig-headed RC bishop abusively denied that both he ad the bishop who sent him were Catholic, this abuse triggered the schism that left Fr. Both approaching the Russian Orthodox, and forming the OCA.

This bishop (whose name I won’t mention in accordance with praryers that he be forgotten) also directly caused the schism creating ACROD from the Ruthenian Catholics by similar uncharitable and abusive behavior.

hawk
 
dochawk said:
Not quite.

Fr. Toth was a Catholic slav. When a pig-headed RC bishop abusively denied that both he ad the bishop who sent him were Catholic, this abuse triggered the schism that left Fr. Both approaching the Russian Orthodox, and forming the OCA.

This bishop (whose name I won’t mention in accordance with praryers that he be forgotten) also directly caused the schism creating ACROD from the Ruthenian Catholics by similar uncharitable and abusive behavior.

hawk
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I’ve never heard any of this, but admittedly, my knowledge is very miniscule. I thought what I said were the main points, but obviously it’s more complicated. I know the Russian church now freed from Soviets also has dispute with OCA or something, for not coming back in their fold… but I never looked into it.
 
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ROCOR (Russian Orthodox Church Outside Russia) reconciled with the ROC a few months ago.

hawk
 
Maximilian75 said:
An epiclesis in the Latin OF mass
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In the other Eucharistic Prayers it is explicit; in the Roman Canon (Eucharistic Prayer I) it is implicit (yikes, spellcheck changed that to"simplistic"–twice!).

Explicit is “Let your Spirit; descend” and so forth; “Bless this” is implicit (about sending the Spirit).

Some of the EO are bothered by this, thus adding the explicit. But then, in the Liturgy of Addai and Mari, the entire Institution Narrative is implicit, so . . .

Also, I remember as an RC altar boy our having been confused about only ringing the bells twice–I suspect this came from EPI coming back into our favor in our parish, but it’s been a few decades . . .

hawk
 
Ahh, okay.
My pastor is a trad-minded OF user, so we use the Roman Canon and the bell ring at the epiclesis in addition to all else.
 
Maximilian75 said:
My pastor is a trad-minded OF user, so we use the Roman Canon and the bell ring at the epiclesis in addition to all else.
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I’ll be the last one to deny that the epiclesis is there implicitly.

But, pray tell, asks my younger self, when do we ring the bells for it? There are (at least) two implicit epicleses in it . . .

hawk
 
hey, all I know is that the bells ring 3 times- 1 burst at the epiclesis (priests hands over chalice/paten) and then 3 bursts ar the elevations of the Host and Chalice
 
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