Is yoga demonic or no?

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Yoga’s primers say breathing is one of the most basic and important tools of yoga.
Actually, breath is the most important tool in life. If you don’t believe me, stop breathing.😃

It’s not yoga and breathing that are connected; that is limiting it to a particular circumstance. Exercise and breathing are linked. I discovered some “yoga” breathing techniques long before I ever did any yoga exercises, or took martial arts. Breathing certain ways allows you to stretch further, and have greater endurance while running, lifting weights, etc.
 
Yoga: Theory and Practice: Separable?
Not only are they separable, they are intrinsically separate. People can combine whatever they want into spiritual practice: exercise, breathing, prayer, crystals, etc. Just because someone, some people, or an entire culture attaches any one of these things to their own spiritual practice makes it intrinsically inseparable with that religion. You obviously think otherwise, yet you can’t explain yourself when obvious examples to the contrary exist.
 
I know some hindus who practice yoga and they are beautiful people. Nothing demonic at all about them.
Not only that, I find it interesting that India is one of the only democratic countries in that part of the world, and also one of the most tolerant when it comes to other peoples and cultures.
 
Not only that, I find it interesting that India is one of the only democratic countries in that part of the world, and also one of the most tolerant when it comes to other peoples and cultures.
Then of course, India, a so-called pagan country, won independence through non-violent means, while America, a supposedly Christian nation fought a most bloody revolution.

Jim
 
So, when I go into my living room and connect my WiiFit to my TV and choose to do the yoga exercises I am opening myself up to demonic forces and worshipping a Hindu deity?

Someone really wants me to believe that!
 
Yes! Absolutely!

You are doing the same thing as me when I open a late night box of Keebler Soft Batch cookies and begin worship of the elves that created them. 😃

Really. Why are these yoga threads even allowed to continue, LOL.
 
I know some hindus who practice yoga and they are beautiful people. Nothing demonic at all about them.
I think there are some people on this thread that are purposefully twisting what comecome is saying, and then basing their attack off of the spin version.:rolleyes:

At no point did he state that the people themselves are demonic or that all Hindus are possessed. He clearly is condemning the practice. It would be false to suggest that simply because someone is a “good person” that therefore they are not capable of sin (as all sin is demonic) or of being deceived. I used to know many “good” people who were deceived into thinking that witchcraft is harmless. Does that mean that since they are “nice people”, that they are somehow immune from demonic influences?

I think it’s telling that there are many people who are not addressing the references which comecome has provided, and have instead based their arguments on posting memes, and quick biting comments. Will someone, anyone, please address his points? Thanks! Just an observation…🤷

Peace!
 
So, when I go into my living room and connect my WiiFit to my TV and choose to do the yoga exercises I am opening myself up to demonic forces and worshipping a Hindu deity?

Someone really wants me to believe that!
Because if it’s the Wii, it has to be harmless.

Seriously people, does anyone want to contribute their argument? I’m just asking because there are some people who would like to see a serious debate instead of childish back and forth. Thanks.
 
Because if it’s the Wii, it has to be harmless.

Seriously people, does anyone want to contribute their argument? I’m just asking because there are some people who would like to see a serious debate instead of childish back and forth. Thanks.
Those of use who practice Yoga exercise, have presented our positions clearly, only to be told that we’re dabbling in the occult.

A serious discussion on this subject, like Centering Prayer, is not possible in this forum, which is why the latter had to be a banned topic.

Jim
 
Those of use who practice Yoga exercise, have presented our positions clearly, only to be told that we’re dabbling in the occult.

A serious discussion on this subject, like Centering Prayer, is not possible in this forum, which is why the latter had to be a banned topic.

Jim
I have seen references that lay out a convincing argument that it could in fact be dabbling in the occult. May I have some references that say otherwise? Johnnette Benkovic on EWTN aired a program that addressed the dangers. In my opinion, if it was a baseless claim, there should be others to address her points. I’m interested in hearing a more meaty argument that consists of something other than ( ex: What’s the difference between a stretch and yoga? Especially since that question has been answered ad-nauseam, but people are still pretending that it hasn’t been addressed). I would be interested in seeing a counter-argument on a reputable Catholic television station such as EWTN, if the matter is as silly as many claim.
 
Because if it’s the Wii, it has to be harmless.

Seriously people, does anyone want to contribute their argument? I’m just asking because there are some people who would like to see a serious debate instead of childish back and forth. Thanks.
Just like how the Parker Bros make Ouija boards and can be bought at Toys R Us, yet Ouija board use is still strictly prohibited by the Church.
 
I think there are some people on this thread that are purposefully twisting what comecome is saying, and then basing their attack off of the spin version.:rolleyes:

At no point did he state that the people themselves are demonic or that all Hindus are possessed. He clearly is condemning the practice. It would be false to suggest that simply because someone is a “good person” that therefore they are not capable of sin (as all sin is demonic) or of being deceived. I used to know many “good” people who were deceived into thinking that witchcraft is harmless. Does that mean that since they are “nice people”, that they are somehow immune from demonic influences?

I think it’s telling that there are many people who are not addressing the references which comecome has provided, and have instead based their arguments on posting memes, and quick biting comments. Will someone, anyone, please address his points? Thanks! Just an observation…🤷

Peace!
You mean like the refernce to
apologeticsindex.org/y01.html

Let’s look at it. (My comments in red)
John Ankerberg and John Weldon write:

The basic premise of yoga theory is the fundamental unity of all existence: God, man, and all of creation are ultimately one divine reality. An editorial in the “Yoga Journal” declares this basic premise:

We are all aware that yoga means "union"and that the practice of yoga unites body, breath, and mind, lower and higher energy centers and, ultimately, self and God, or higher Self. But more broadly, yoga directs our attention to the unity or oneness that underlies our fragmented experiences and equally fragmented word. Family, friends, the Druze guerrilla in Lebanon, the great whale migrating north - all share the same essential [divine] nature (594:4) .

Well, oneness and unity are pretty slippery words. Are they not. Don’t we Catholic Christians also speak of being in the Body of Christ? Unity in Christ? “Ut Unum Sint”? We also aspire to be Christlike. St Teresa spoke of Prayer of Union. Yes, the East has a stronger monist or pantheist emphasis but we do not have to buy into that.

This is why physical yoga and Eastern philosophy are mutually interdependent; ultimately, you cannot have one without the other. David Fetcho, a researcher with an extensive background in yoga theory and practice, states:

Physical yoga, according to its classical definitions, is inheritably and functionally incapable of being separated from Eastern religious metaphysics. The Western practitioner who attempts to do so is operating in ignorance and danger, from the yogi’s viewpoint, as well as from the Christian’s (725:2) .

That does not follow at all. Why does a monistic world view have to be inseprable from a physical exercise?

One of the leading contemporary authorities on kundalini yoga is Gopi Krishna. In his article “The True Aim of Yoga,” he says: “The aim of yoga, then, is to achieve the state of unity or oneness with God, Brahman, [and] spiritual beings…” (592:14) .

Yoga authorities Feuerstein and Miller comment that the postures (asana) of yoga and its breathing techniques (pranayama) are much more than just physical exercises:

Again, we see that the control of the vital energy (prana) by way of breathing, like also asana, is not merely a physical exercise, but is accompanied by certain psychomental phenomena. In other words, all techniques falling under the heading of asana and pranayama as, for example, the mudras and bandhas [physical] positions or symbolic bodily gestures utilizing pranayama and concentration for physical or spiritual purposes] of Hathayoga, are psychosomatic exercises. This point, unfortunately, is little understood by Western practitioners… (593:27-28)

All exercises are psychosomatic. All exercises involve breathing and focus. Again, Namaste mudra or hands together in prayer has been a Christian gesture since the beginning.

Actually, yoga practice is intended to validate occult yoga theory. And as noted, yoga theory teaches that everything is, in its true inner nature, divine - not only divine but ultimately equal to everything else - everything from God and the devil to the athlete and the AIDS virus. That may be yoga theory but I doubt it. In any case it need not be accepted.

Yoga theory also teaches that in their outer nature, everything is maya, or illusion. For example, only in his inner spirit is man divine; his “outer nature,” of body and personality, are ultimately a delusion that separates him from awareness of his real inner divinity. Thus, another purpose of yoga must be to slowly dismantle the outer personality - man’s illusory part - so the supposed impersonal divinity can progressively “emerge” from within his hidden divine consciousness (…) Again, this need not be accepted.

This is why people who practice yoga only for physical or mental health reasons are ultimately the victims of a confidence game. They are promised better health; little do they suspect the end goal of yoga is to destroy them as individuals. As yoga authorities Feuerstein and Miller comment, yoga results in “a progressive dismantling of human personality ending in a complete abolition. With every step (anga) of Yoga, what we call ‘man’ is demolished a little more” (593:8) . That is just misleading. “Dismantling the personality”? As in psychosis? No. More like a letting go of attachments, addictions, anything obscuring the light of Christ within.
 
I have seen references that lay out a convincing argument that it could in fact be dabbling in the occult. May I have some references that say otherwise? Johnnette Benkovic on EWTN aired a program that addressed the dangers. In my opinion, if it was a baseless claim, there should be others to address her points. I’m interested in hearing a more meaty argument that consists of something other than ( ex: What’s the difference between a stretch and yoga? Especially since that question has been answered ad-nauseam, but people are still pretending that it hasn’t been addressed). I would be interested in seeing a counter-argument on a reputable Catholic television station such as EWTN, if the matter is as silly as many claim.
I don’t think we will ever see that. To borrow a line I saw on a different thread/topic: Catholics have bigger fish to fry.

Certain factions, Johnette Benkovic and others are making it their business ($$$) to warn people about the occult. I used to watch the Abundant Life and got some good out of it but since have found some of her past guests or their positions questionable. This trend continues on the Women of Grace website where I’ve read both blatantly false information (no fact checking) and finding fault with other benign practices. When posters don’t want to do yoga and ask for another type of exercise replies come back with “Pilates.” Well guess what; the Woman of Grace sites warns about occult beginnings with that too.

Fine. 🙂 The fear mongers can have their fear and whatever dainty, ineffective exercise programs they try to come up with. I’ll keep the yoga and Pilates.

I just looked for another topic to see where they stood and I’m not surprised, but Women of Grace is against it too and recycling the same poorly researched information. I wish I hadn’t looked. However, it does explain the negativity and fretting I encounter with certain people IRL; they follow Women of Grace and now they seem to be critical of everything and have been sounding very fundamentalist now that I think about it. Satan isn’t everywhere but God is. Perhaps they would find God if they looked for him instead of the other guy.
 
In “Yoga as Methods of Liberation,” Moti Lal Pandit observes that (as in Buddhism) “the aim of yoga is to realize liberation from the human condition. To achieve this liberation, various psychological, physical, mental, and mystical methods have been devised. All those methods are antisocial (sometimes even antihuman) in that yoga prescribes a way of life which says: this mortal life is not worth living.” (595:41) . Again a distortion. Even Christianity has a purgative moment, a penitential and ascetic aspect.

Yoga is, after all, a religious practice seeking to produce “union” with an impersonal ultimate reality, such as Brahman or Nirvana. If ultimate reality is impersonal, of what value is one’s own personality? For a person to achieve true “union” with Brahman, his “false” self must be destroyed and replaced with awareness of his true divine nature. That is the specific goal of yoga (…) If we examine yoga theory in more detail, it is easier to understand who yoga practice has such specific occult goals. There is also a Bahkti yoga or yoga of worship a personal diety. Christianity also recognizes our false self that must be crucified with Christ.

One of the most authoritative texts on yoga theory within the Hindu perspective is Pantajali’s text on raja Yoga titled Yoga Sutras (e.g., 596 ). In this text he puts forth the traditional eight “limbs,” or parts, of yoga. These are defined within the context of a basic Hindu worldview (reincarnation, karma, and moksha, or liberation) and intended to support and reinforce Hindu beliefs. Each “limb” has a spiritual goal and together they form a unit. These eight limbs are:
Yama (self-control, restraints, devotion to the gods [e.g. Krishna] or the final impersonal God [e.g., Brahman]
Niyama (religious duties, prohibitions, observances)
Asana (proper postures for yoga practices; these represent the first stage in the isolation of consciousness and are vital components for “transcending the human condition” 601:54)
Pranayama (the control and directing of the breath and the alleged divine energy within the human body [prana] to promote health and spiritual [occult] consciousness and evolution)
Prayahara (sensory control or deprivation, i.e., withdrawal of the senses from attachment to external objects)
Dharana (deeper concentration, or mind control)
Dhyana (deep contemplation from occult meditation)
Samadhi (occult enlightenment or “God [Brahman] realization” i.e., “union” of the “individual” with God).
Because the eight steps are interdependent, the steps of “postures” and “breathing” cannot logically be separated from the others. Thus, the interdependence of all eight steps reveals why the physical exercises of yoga are designed to prepare the body for the spiritual (occult) changes that will allegedly help one realize godhood status. If these steps cannot be seperated then we must also avoid self control, restraint and any form of religious observance. That makes no sense to me. Does it to you?

The concept of prana (“breath”) is a key to the process. Pranayama refers to the knowledge and control of prana, or mystical energy, not merely to the control of one’s physical breath (979:592) . Prana is believed to be universal divine energy residing behind the material world (akasa). Prana is said to have five forms, and all energy is thoughy to be a manifestation of it. Swami Nikhilananada describes it in his Vivekananda - The Yogas and Other Works as “the infinite, omnipresent manifesting power of this universe” (979:592) . Perfect control of prana makes one God. One can have “infinite knowledge, infinite power, now”:"

What power on earth would not be his? He would be able to move the sun and stars out of their places, to control everything in the universe from the atoms to the biggest suns. This is the end and aim of pranayama. When the yogi becomes perfect there will be nothing in nature not under his control. If he orders the gods or the soul of the departed to come, they will come at his bidding. All the forces of nature will obey him as slaves… He who has controlled prana has controlled his own mind all the minds… and all the bodies that exist… (979:592-93) Does anyone here believe we can move the sun and stars out of their places? This is nonsense.
 
The aim of pranayama is also to arouse the coiled-up power in the muladhara chakra called kundalini:

Then the whole of nature will begin to change and the door of [psychic] knowledge will open. No more will you need to go to books for knowledge; your own mind will have become your book, containing infinite knowledge (979:605)

According to Vivekananda, all occult manifestations are accomplished through yogic control of prana:

We see in every country sects that attempted to control of prana. In this country there are mind healers, spiritualists, Christian Scientists, hypnotists, and so on. If we examine these different sects, we shall find at the back of each is the control of prana, whether they know it or not. If you boil all the theories down, the residuum will be that. It is one and the same force they are manipulating. … Thus we see that pranayama includes all that is true even of spiritualism. Similarly, you will find that wherever any sect or body of people is trying to discover anything occult, mysterious, or hidden, they are really practicing some sort of yoga to control their prana. You will find that wherever there is any extraordinary display of power, it is the manipulation of prana (979:593,599) This is just a rash generalization. And yet I must ask, what is wrong with some control in breathing. Don’t we all do that when we want to relax a bit. Take a deep slow breath? In fact, we ought to do it more here befor we post an incindiary comment.

In other words, prana, God, and occult energy are all one and the same. The one who practices yogic breathing (pranayama) is by definition attempting to manipulate occult (“divine”) energy.
…more…]
Simply not true.
 
IJohnnette Benkovic on EWTN aired a program that addressed the dangers…
Johnette Benkovic is not a theologian or scholar on this or contemplative prayer.

She merely repeats what others who oppose it say, and this goes back to her webpage Women of Grace, concerning Centering Prayer, where she spoke against John Michael Talbot teaching it at the Little Portion Hermitage Monastery.

She has no credibility on this subject or contemplative prayer.

I had taken a position that I would not get into these discussions on this website, because we get nowhere and I think I’m going to return to that position.

Don’t do yoga or tai chi if it makes you uncomfortable.

The rest of us will continue and continue our spiritual journey as Christ leads us.

Jim
 
Yoga is really a true danger for a Catholic!!! An Indian Catholic priest, fr. James Manjackal, MSFS explain why in his article “Yoga in philosophy and practice is incompatible with Christianity” jmanjackal.net/eng/engyoga.htm

You can read there many other articles about this issue all of them showing the huge risks of practising Yoga!

Did you know that the postures (asanas) are all destinated to praise an Hindu deity? etc etc…
Fr. Manjackal’s claim that God is “the Other” and in no sense immanent within the self denies the consistent teaching of the Fathers and the great medieval Doctors such as St. Thomas Aquinas.

There are certainly differences between the Christian and Hindu understandings (and there’s a spectrum in both religions, not just one position), but the difference is not as clear-cut as he claims.

St. Augustine (Confessions, Bk. 1, chap. 2) is a good place to start:
And how shall I call upon my God–my God and my Lord? For when I call on him I ask him to come into me. And what place is there in me into which my God can come? How could God, the God who made both heaven and earth, come into me? Is there anything in me, O Lord my God, that can contain thee? Do even the heaven and the earth, which thou hast made, and in which thou didst make me, contain thee? Is it possible that, since without thee nothing would be which does exist, thou didst make it so that whatever exists has some capacity to receive thee? Why, then, do I ask thee to come into me, since I also am and could not be if thou wert not in me? For I am not, after all, in hell–and yet thou art there too, for “if I go down into hell, thou art there.”11 Therefore I would not exist–I would simply not be at all–unless I exist in thee, from whom and by whom and in whom all things are. Even so, Lord; even so. Where do I call thee to, when I am already in thee? Or from whence wouldst thou come into me? Where, beyond heaven and earth, could I go that there my God might come to me–he who hath said, “I fill heaven and earth”?12
Or, for that matter, try St. Paul, who quoted a pagan poet approvingly saying that we live and move and have our being in God.

I am sure that if a modern Christian were to quote a Hindu author saying this, and approve the quotation, Fr. Manjackal and those who think like him would cry “heresy!”

But when St. Paul and St. Augustine use this language, it’s more prudent to ignore them, I suppose. Or simply to claim, “they don’t mean what Hindus mean.” Of course they don’t mean exactly the same thing. But Fr. Manjackal and other opponents of yoga need to do the work of showing just what the difference is and how it’s relevant to the practice of yoga.

If we live and move and have our being in God, then a practice that helps still our minds and calm our bodies so that we can sense God’s presence is a good one, not only for physical but also for spiritual purposes.

Edwin
 
I think there are some people on this thread that are purposefully twisting what comecome is saying, and then basing their attack off of the spin version.:rolleyes:
I’m not twisting anything. Quite frankly, comecome is not only taking the extremist POV, but is engaging the mouth before engaging the mind. To state that the positions associated with yoga are inherently evil and cannot be separated from the Hinduism is just plain ridiculous. As noted earlier, simply putting the hands together in Catholic prayer is a position used in yoga, thus if it is inherently evil, the praying in this position invites demons. Sounds ridiculous? Well, that’s because it is.

This extremist position means that you cannot pray or stretch, because these positions have equivalents in Hinduism…and other religions, BTW. One of the more well know examples is that various elements of Hindu yoga/martial arts has been incorporated in Buddhist martial arts (Chuan Fa). These have further evolved and incorporated into secular martial arts (Wu Su). Is there any particular reason comecome is only referring to such exercises in Hindu practice, and not the secular practice???
I used to know many “good” people who were deceived into thinking that witchcraft is harmless.
Yoga in the west is generally associated with exercise and breathing. Witchcraft in the west is associated with the occult. The difference should be obvious.
 
I have been watching this thread growing and growing. One thing I have noticed is some proponents of Yoga insist on writing of the spiritual benefits of Yoga. Some push this to extremes as if this is a form of approved Christian meditation and they cling to this with the greatest of tenacity. When one confuses physical benefits with spiritual ones then one falls into grave error.

catholic.com/magazine/articles/the-trouble-with-yoga
Code:
 Yoga like some forms of martial arts can cause spiritual woes because the meditations therein open one to demonic attacks.
spiritbattleforsouls.org/id36.html
Code:
   If  the stretches & postures of Yoga can be imparted without spirituality then there is no danger.  Cardinal Ratzinger has doubts about this though.  The Vatican has warned about the dangers inherent in the practice of Yoga:
apnewsarchive.com/1989/Vatican-Warns-of-Eastern-Meditation-Practices/id-8bf3a1c86c0b95e3df6e28779568f9a6

l) The Vatican document has identified Yoga as New Age.
2) Yoga is a direct door to the occult.
3) The Vatican document states that New Age cannot be accepted by faithful Catholics
4) Yoga can cause psychological damage.

The Vatican hears from Bishops about various spiritual dangers that are prevalent in the world. Then the Vatican issues statements warning people and calling them to conform to Christ.

I want to say that physical exercise and stretches alone shouldn’t present any sort of spiritual danger. It is the mistake of associating Yoga practices with spiritual well-being that appears to be the danger.

Strangely enough, right here in this forum there are those who make such claims.
 
From the very article you posted;
‘‘One can take from them what is useful as so long as the Christian conception of prayer, its logic and requirements are never obscured,’’ the document said.
apnewsarchive.com/1989/Vatican-Warns-of-Eastern-Meditation-Practices/id-8bf3a1c86c0b95e3df6e28779568f9a6

That being said, there is nothing spiritually being taken from Eastern Religions being expressed by proponents of Yoga exercise in this thread as of yet.

All participants are Christ centered Christians who worship Jesus alone.

Jim
 
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