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coolduude
Guest
Well then I give up.
Just keep the love and charity of Christ in mind.
Just keep the love and charity of Christ in mind.
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Kadaveri
Guest
This is false. The belief that committing sin doesn’t turn someone into a non-believer is not relativism.
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MrZetterlund
Guest
LOL! Jews call Jesus Son of God, who knew. 
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JerrySeibert
Guest
Soutane;
Yes, the Muslim faith historically has been violent. But, has not our faith been as well? As the Bible teaches us, “Go forth and make disciples of all the nation” so does the Quaran.
Did not our Lord teach us, “to offer the other cheek”
Yes, the Muslim faith historically has been violent. But, has not our faith been as well? As the Bible teaches us, “Go forth and make disciples of all the nation” so does the Quaran.
Did not our Lord teach us, “to offer the other cheek”
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BobCatholic
Guest
Terrorism is a sin or not a sin, depending on which Islamic scholar you ask. There is no standard to tell the terrorists to knock it off.
Hence, relativism.
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Soutane
Guest
Christ was not a wimp,Christ was a tough as nails Jewish carpenter who did not suffer fools gladly.he regularly provoked and shamed the pharisees,scribes and priests and they KILLED him for it.He was not the Dalai Lama,or an enlightened man,He was(is)God almighty whochallenged his followers,told his apostles off with regularity.,was rather snippy if not outrightoffensive to Samaritans upon ocassion.His ma had to ask him to perform HIs first miracle for the married couple which he did albeit with extreme reluctance;but He was a good Jewish boy who loved his Ma(and ours).He was accused of breaking the Sabbath,consorting with whores and being a drunkard.He made Poncious Pilate look like a doofus.The love and charitybof Christ does not supercede the Truth which is Christ Himself.Christ was a man’s man and I’m sure he uttered the ocassionaloath when smacking his thumb with a hammer.Don’t presume to lecture me on my admittedly forceful deportment on these fora and I won’t question your misguided peace-love-and- bellbottoms response…He was so full of love and charity that He even let His Disciples go who couild not fathom or were revulsed at the necessity of eating His Body and Drinking His Blood.Now THAT’S TOUGH LOVE.
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Kadaveri
Guest
And murdering millions of babies inside their mothers’ wombs is a sin or not a sin, depending which Christian scholar you ask.
Spare me the hypocrisy.
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Aramis
Guest
Not all muslims practice the slavery and dhimmitude allowed for in the Quran, not all muslims believe in violent jihad, not all muslims want 99 virgins to do with as they please in the afterlife, not all muslims think it acceptable to marry a child, not all muslims think it acceptable for a man to have 4 wives…
But almost all Muslim communities seem to give rise to those who want to see those elements, and accept them as part of the truth of Islam. Even the peaceful Sufi have the occasional jihadist arise.
The Quran breeds jihadi.
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BobCatholic
Guest
It is a sin and gravely so, in the Catholic Church which has taught this consistently for 2,000 years. Don’t lump in protestantism with Catholicism on this issue or any other issue.
The Catholic faith is definitely NOT relativistic. Protestantism is all over the place, and is also relativistic too. You can compare Islam to Protestantism which it has more in common with, than comparing it to Catholicism.
Case in point.
Catholic terrorists in Northern Ireland were excommunicated and they stopped. Where’s the Islamic equivalent of the Pope (like the Caliph) who will tell Al Queda to knock it off?
There’s NOBODY in Islam who holds that kind of authority as the Pope does over Catholics.
Hence, Islam = relativism.
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Soutane
Guest
There is only one complete Christian truth and that is Catholicism which forbids murder in the womb as you well know.Due to the Protestant Deformation many heresies and errors crept into non-catholic Christianity;birth control was permitted in the 1920’s and divorce as well.Women were also allowed to become preachers ministers and bishops all forbidden by Holy Scripture.Also clearly forbidden in Holy Scripture,abortion was the logical consequence to these percursors.None of the former are tolerated in Catholicism.In certain denominated non-catholic eclaisial bodies homosexuality is condoned,celebrated and even practised openly by clergy,Bishops included. Catholicism is the ONLY legitimate voice of Christanity supported equally by Sacred Sripture,Sacred Tradition and the teaching of the Magisterium as guarantteed by Christ and the Paraclete.
Our own Catholic problems with a small minority of homosexual predatory Catholic clergy is quite well known and a horrific shame to all Catholics and I ask you my muslim brother to pray for us and those Judas priests that they may be redeemed.
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MrZetterlund
Guest
Reading over this, I think it’s a bit rediculous. Did Jesus say “Love your neighbor… Unless they’re violent crazy terrorists?” Nope… Did He say “Love your enemy… Unless they hate Jews, Christians, and slaughter us silly infadels?” Nope…
Reguardless as to whether they’re violent or not, or if they’re crazy or not, we must love them. And not all Muslims are crazy, phsycho terrorists. It’s important to remember that whether they are violent sphsychos or not, they’re wrong. Because Jesus died for their iniquities and the Qu’ran left that part out. Let us show them the truth by showing God’s love. Not trying to mark this religion as evil for our own self-righteousness.
Reguardless as to whether they’re violent or not, or if they’re crazy or not, we must love them. And not all Muslims are crazy, phsycho terrorists. It’s important to remember that whether they are violent sphsychos or not, they’re wrong. Because Jesus died for their iniquities and the Qu’ran left that part out. Let us show them the truth by showing God’s love. Not trying to mark this religion as evil for our own self-righteousness.
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Soutane
Guest
That is the most misinterpreted passage in the Bible.Christ did not offer the moneychangers who were defiling his Abba’s house-He kicked *** and took names.You can bet it wasn’t business as usual the following Saturday.God,Jesus was not some birkenstock wearing hippie anarchist who lived in Seattle and drank lattes-he drank wine-He supported law,authority,and Caesar.He was a real down in the dirt proud red necked hebrew in every way but sin.God treated sinners with compassion and love and always forgave them with the admonition to sin no more.He was positively scathing with those who were hypocites(and they hated him and plotted against Him)…he called them whitened sephulcurs-pristine on the outside but a charnel house on the inside.He didn’t preach prosperity gospel,I cringe to hear what He will say to those Hypocrites who approach Him saying "lord,Lord…"He’ll say depart from me you evildoers I never knew you…'He never minced words when He told Peter that He would betray Him three times but He lovingly forgave him AND made him our shepard,papa,pope.We his sheep.We his lambs.
When the Apostles went out to make disciples of all nations they did so by speaking such an unpleasant unvarnished and offensive Truth that their listeners murdered every one of them except John.Yet the world was and is being saved by these rough uneducated but spiritfilled fisherman and taxcollectors and we their descedants who must tell the world that the only way to the Father is Through the Son and the Church with all those misunderstood sacraments that the appeasers like to gloss over.Stand up and witness for Christ.Wecould all use a little more ST Jean D’arc and a little less PC.
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Kadaveri
Guest
Well now you’re splitting Catholicism from Christianity. Not that I couldn’t show you plenty of Catholics who don’t agree with the official position of your church, but that’s not the point, the point is that neither Islam or Christianity are relativist faiths, and finding some people within each justifiying the unjustifiable does not disprove that. I don’t think you even understand what the term ‘relativism’ means.
And as someone who’s family participated in The Troubles, you’re seriously mistaken if you think Catholic paramilitaries stopped killing people because the Pope told them to ‘knock it off’.
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Soutane
Guest
He’s splitting Christianity off from non-catholic Christianity.Big difference.Catholicism IS
Chistianity.The others are pretenders to the throne.Don’t mistake ecumenism with unity 'cause there ain’t no such animal in Christendom.Even tho Christ prayed that we would be one.Those Catholics who do not agree with the position of the Church are simply not Catholic any longer.They may label themseves as such but until thy submit they’re as much Catholic as I am Muslim.They are defacto protestants but ones who lack the cojones to formally leave the Church.They are:Christmas Catholics,Easter Catholics,Catholics in name only,cultural catholics,ethnic catholics,cafeteria catholics.In other words Catholics who do not practise theirfaith,receive the sacraments,pray,attend mass or receive Christ in the Eucharist.But they’re the furst to demand that their children are baptised and that they receive Holy Communion and confirmation.At The last first communion that I attended(40 children) my parish
priest was in tears as he said that he would probably never see any of these little children of God again.He didn’t,nor did I"Suffer the little children to come unto Me.It is better that a millstone be placed around the neck of he who would intrerfere with them,and be cast on the water.
The Troubles were caused by vicious sectarian communist idealogues who were finally shamed into stopping by their own victims and families.ne
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Husaria_1683
Guest
The Armenians were exterminated by the Ottomans!
“For 50 years, historians, diplomats and state department officials have touted Mustafa Kemal Ataturk as a great secular leader in a predominantly Muslim region, whose policies modernized and democratized Turkey. But in 1955, barely 17 years after the dictator’s death, a little-known pogrom, driven primarily by Islamic fanaticism, targeted the Greek population of Istanbul, with the intent of driving non-Muslims from Turkey.”
-The Mechanism of Catastrophe: The Turkish Pogrom Of September 6 - 7, 1955, And The Destruction Of The Greek Community Of Istanbul, by Speros Vryonis Jr.
Read the book.
Everyone else, if you want to learn more about Islam don’t take a Muslims word for it, Read the Koran and watch this documentary,
Islam: What the West needs to know
Throughout the bible God is depicted on high, in heaven, on the mountain where he gave the commandments, in the open along the road when the Lord spoke to Saul. God was not hiding in a cave to speak to Muhammad, It was the Devil!
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BobCatholic
Guest
I’m splitting off Catholicism from protestantism. Truth from Error. Truth from Relativism.
If Islam is not relativistic, then show me who declared Osama Bin Laden Kafir please.
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Soutane
Guest
I love the person who broke into my house and stole from me.I still called the cops and took security arrangements.I’ll love that person if he returns but he’s going to be facing a mossburg loaded with double ought buck.If he cooperates i"ll call the cops and have him charged and testify against him and wave goodbye as he goes off to the crow-bar hotel,but I’ll still love him.What I won’t love is his wanton disregard for my family and property and the fact that i’ll have difficulty feeling safe in my home.Judge everything by its fruits.ISlam is a medieval,ethnocentric,patriarchical,vendetta-ridden,intolerant,triumphalistic,political,female chattel subjugating,jew hating,murderous idelogy much akin to naziism whose aim is NOT co-existance but subjugation.
Bernard Shaw called Islam the greatest religion practised by absolutely the worst people.
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Kadaveri
Guest
Well at least we seem to have established that Mustafa Kemal was not some Islamic fundamentalist (being an atheist who wished all religions ‘be at the bottom of the sea’), but still whoever wrote this either has no idea what they’re talking about or is a propogandist. The Istanbul Pogrom of 1955 was orchestrated by ultra-secular Turkish nationalists (sorry to repeat that phrase but it doesn’t seem to be sinking in) who wanted to create an ethnically pure Turkish nation state, it had nothing to do with ‘Islamic fanaticism’. It’s totally ridiculous to talk of anything being driven by ‘Islamic fanaticism’ in Istanbul in this period, when Islam had been practically erased from public life, all religious orders were banned, teaching the Qur’an was banned, the call to prayer was banned, countless mosques turned into ‘museums’ or otherwise closed.
Likewise for the people behind the Armenian genocide. The İttihat ve Terakki Cemiyeti organisation who carried out the Armenian genocide (of whom the ‘great secular leader’ Mustafa Kemal was a leading member) and later became the CHP had a great distaste for Islam, and once they had control of the Turkish state wiped Islam off the political landscape of Turkey for decades. You’re going nowhere if you’re trying to prove Islam is bad by pointing at these guys.
There’s no logic in this inference, you don’t seem to know what being ‘relativistic’ actually means.
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planten
Guest
Husaria, you may be more aware of the devil. WE know from bible that devil was tempting your God for 40 days. That was the beginning of Jesus. So Devil was very much with Jesus. Jesus is your God. So, shall we believe from today that Devil was temptng and trying your God??
We cannot imagine a god who is born of a woman. A God who prays in the garden, and seeks help from some one. A God who yelles out and asks the greater God or his God about why He had forsaken him. You have a God who dies too.
Husaria, please do not go looking for Devil near Muhammad. Look for devil with your God. We cannot believe in a God who dies and still all the work of the Universe was running very well for three days of Dead God.
Muslims believe that Devil dare not go near Jesus or Mary or Muhammad. You can have your strange type of God. We can have a prophet (Muhammad) as a humble servant and messenger of God (Allah).
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uglygal
Guest
I believe you are a sincere person but what you say here of Jesus Christ only shows your complete ignorance and lack of understanding of who Christ is. I would refer you to read about the Memra - present from the beginning of ages and made manifest in the Incarnation
bibleword.org/memra.shtml
jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=399&letter=M
A problem many Muslims have in understanding who Christ is, is because Christianity does not exist in a vacuum. It exists within the rich and ancient history of Judaism - unlike Islam which re-writes ‘versions’ of Biblical events that find no basis in Scripture.
The concept of Christ was well known to the early Christians and Jewish converts because they knew full well of God’s Memra
The Memra is pre-incarnate Christ
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